Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
jonljacobi
KVRian
1463 posts since 16 Jan, 2013 from USA

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 1:55 pm

tracktion.jpg
This is why I won't use Tracktion. This is their own plug-in from the T11 Demo. This simply can't happen. I bought v10, but if not for Collective, it would be a total write-off. I don't relish feeling this way about a DAW. Someone LMK when it's truly stable.

Put Tracktion's interface on Reaper's engine, then you'd have something.
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lastmessiah
KVRist
110 posts since 23 Aug, 2017

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:59 pm

I've been using it for a couple years now. On v11 now. It is true that it isn't the most stable software. Crashes are pretty frequent - not egregiously so, but more than other tried and true programs.

However, the feature set and little workflow enhancements it brings have swayed me into dealing with the occasional crash. And with Waveform 11 things seem better.

The audio clip functionality is fantastic. Clip Effects allow you to apply processing directly to an audio clip (rather than say, an entire track). I have found this very useful when working with samples.

The instruments are quite nice too - Multi Sampler is not the most full-featured of its kind but it has MPE support and allows you to record the system output from your PC. Very useful for ripping and mangling old movie soundtracks playing back in your browser. Subtractive is your typical VA synth that gets the job done - I don't like to use 3rd party plugins if I can avoid it so I appreciate when I have something like this at my disposal. Collective is an FM/sampling synthesizer with a decent sample library, it is pretty versatile. I like it so much that I intend to buy Biotek2 soon.

The Racks feature is pretty cool, but I already use Bitwig Studio as well and find their approach to the modular DAW more intuitive and easygoing. Maybe there's some interesting things you can pull of in Racks, I haven't really dug deep yet.

And I have to say that it just looks better than something like Cubase or even Logic, which I find to be quite ugly and dated in a lot of ways.

jonljacobi
KVRian
1463 posts since 16 Jan, 2013 from USA

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 4:35 pm

I bought it because it looked interesting, but I’ve seen far too many of these in a rather small amount of usage. It would probably work, but I simply won’t trust it. This was likely because no samples were loaded, which indicates sloppy error checking. So much for sandboxing. Even Collective, which I like, scoops the first note every time I change presets.

There’s an old saying. You never get a second chance to make a first impression.

jens
KVRAF
19995 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Tue Mar 31, 2020 5:41 pm

lastmessiah wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:59 pm
Clip Effects allow you to apply processing directly to an audio clip (rather than say, an entire track). I have found this very useful when working with samples.
Tracktion/Waveform is far from being the only one to offer this (and it certainly wasn't the first one either)… :shrug:

Trancit
KVRAF
2745 posts since 27 Jul, 2004

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:29 am

jens wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 5:41 pm
lastmessiah wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:59 pm
Clip Effects allow you to apply processing directly to an audio clip (rather than say, an entire track). I have found this very useful when working with samples.
Tracktion/Waveform is far from being the only one to offer this (and it certainly wasn't the first one either)… :shrug:
While there are some unique clip fx inside...
Yes, there are other DAWs offering event based fx but none of them has an integrated trance gate or tape stop effect...

Nevertheless as always with Tracktion they implemented this feature halfbaken... i.e. if you insert a reverb or delay it cuts the tail at the clip boundaries which makes it 100% useless...
On the paper the feature set looks great but since everything lacks of the most essential things Waveform is far less useful in a realtime scenario than it seem to be by looking at it´s feature set...

And a software that crashes randomly every half an hour isn´t a pleasure to work with neither ...
On top their shameless prpaganda about 3rd party VSTs would be a problem for every DAW and being the cause of that trouble is not only embarrassing but a joke regarding this
tracktion.jpg
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fedexnman
KVRAF
2710 posts since 4 Jan, 2005

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Wed Apr 01, 2020 5:56 pm

Micro Drum Sampler crashes have been fixed in Waveform 11.0.24 beta ..

Trancit
KVRAF
2745 posts since 27 Jul, 2004

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:09 am

At least...now they just have to fix the other 5000 issues :)

fedexnman
KVRAF
2710 posts since 4 Jan, 2005

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:13 am

:hihi:

krixa
KVRist
256 posts since 8 Apr, 2012

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:12 pm

Gonna try this. Might switch from Bitwig :D
Bitwig 3 | Maschine 2

jonljacobi
KVRian
1463 posts since 16 Jan, 2013 from USA

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:27 pm

I’m kind of sorry I was so harsh. The program has potential, but the infinite user beta test needs to stop. Forget new features, and have a two week bug hunt.

Trancit
KVRAF
2745 posts since 27 Jul, 2004

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:04 am

jonljacobi wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:27 pm
I’m kind of sorry I was so harsh.

I didn´t find you overly harsh...
The program has potential,...

Yes...
...but the infinite user beta test needs to stop. Forget new features, and have a two week bug hunt.
User begging for this since ages... tbh this will never happen...
They always fix a little bit but it turned out more and more they don´t have no clue at all why this happens...
Because the longterm crashes happen completely randomly there is no way to really track them down...
But it´s not only the crashes, it´s mainly the halfbaken features which start to annoy you when diggin deeper into the programm... i.e. Racks have many problems with latency compensation which is a no-go because of being a central aspect of how Waveform works (sends, multiout Instruments etc...)

Beside all of that it seem to be that they decided bug-fixing and feature expansion doesn´t pay off and strictly follow the insurance selling strategy ... always trying to put more customers on top than loosing afterwards and instead of making the programm useable they simply rely on new features...
I bet most of the problems Waveform 10 had will be present in Waveform 20 too...

It´s a real shame as featurewise it´s a really interesting DAW with many unique helpers... just the Pattern generator/Chordtrack alone as an example is unique and a real inspiration source... but things are as they are and the devs of Tracktion stay with their behaviour since ages now... :x

User avatar
tonedef71
KVRian
1234 posts since 21 Sep, 2007 from USA

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:07 am

Trancit wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:04 am
... they decided bug-fixing and feature expansion doesn´t pay off and strictly follow the insurance selling strategy ... always trying to put more customers on top than loosing afterwards and instead of making the programm useable they simply rely on new features...
I bet most of the problems Waveform 10 had will be present in Waveform 20 too...
Some of the bug-fixing has essentially been outsourced to the development community. Last year, I believe, the underlying Tracktion engine was open-sourced: https://www.tracktion.com/develop/tracktion-engine

Last month, a fix was made to the external plugin module...
https://github.com/Tracktion/tracktion_engine/
[Intel Core i7 8700 | 32GB DDR4 | Studio One 4.6 Pro; FL Studio 20.6; RapidComposer; Sundog Song Studio; Orb Composer; Pizzicato; Odesi | FL Studio ASIO (WASAPI) | Win10 x64]

Trancit
KVRAF
2745 posts since 27 Jul, 2004

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:08 am

I am not sure if Waveform itself has benefits from anything that happens to the Tracktion engine...

jens
KVRAF
19995 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:30 pm

Why not? That's what it runs on, after all... they may of course ignore the fix, but I think what tonedef71 hints at, is that amongst the reasons (if not THE reason) why they open-sourced it in the first place might be that it may lead to other developers fixing bugs for them for free….

Steve Bolivar
KVRian
690 posts since 25 Aug, 2006

Re: Tracktion Waveform 11 PRO looks cool

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:55 pm

jonljacobi wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:27 pm
I’m kind of sorry I was so harsh. The program has potential, but the infinite user beta test needs to stop. Forget new features, and have a two week bug hunt.
In not saying that's a bad idea. But probably every DAW has been the recipient of that suggestion. Any DAWs other than the recent Cakewalk by Bandlab ever put new feature development on hold to just fix bugs? That's an honest question, not trying to be a smartass. It could also be it's just very rare for a DAW to find itself in that situation.

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