Sampling Hardware Synths

Sampler and Sampling discussion (techniques, tips and tricks, etc.)
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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:22 am

I know that this has been asked numerous times over the years, but what is the current best way to automatically sample hardware synths for playing on the computer these days (for example in Kontakt or Halion)?

Thanks in advance!

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Forgotten
KVRAF
11426 posts since 15 Apr, 2019 from Nowhere

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:44 am

Audio out from the VCA into an audio interface I would think. Record the audio then trim the audio in the sampler.

Personally I'd use Kontakt as it's pretty much ubiquitous.

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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:36 am

Thanks, but I am looking for something that does this automatically across the keyboard spectrum. I know that SampleRobot and Samplit 2 are two of the more prominent players, but was wondering if there were others that were better (or less expensive)? Does Halion 6 do this automatically?

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Etienne1973
KVRian
660 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:13 am

I did many sampling sessions in the past. As we speak there's no software with automatic sustain loop creation that really works.

If I intend to sample decay non-loop instruments with multi-velocity layers then Auto Sampler (Apple MainStage 3 for $30) is my tool of choice.

If I intend to sample sustain loop instruments with 1 velocity layer then Björn Bojahr's free sampling suite is my tool. Website is German but Software English.

If you have interest then I'll explain further how to get a nice fast workflow with Bojahr's apps.

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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:24 pm

Thanks!

I should mention that I am using Windows, so Mainstage is out :(.

I take it from your comment that neither SampleRobot nor Samplit 2 will do the job here?

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Etienne1973
KVRian
660 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 1:07 pm

bharris22 wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:24 pm
I take it from your comment that neither SampleRobot nor Samplit 2 will do the job here?
If you sample decay sounds with multi velocity layers then these tools do the job pretty well.

But I've ran tests with SampleRobot 5.x because of the automatic seamless sustain loop marketing promise. Got no satisfying results. :(

Perhaps SR version 6.5 is better in this regard?

Did you already run your tests with the SR 6.5 Trial?

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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:22 pm

OK - thanks. I have not tried any of the trials yet, but hope to do so soon.

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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:52 am

Etienne1973 wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:13 am
I did many sampling sessions in the past. As we speak there's no software with automatic sustain loop creation that really works.

If I intend to sample decay non-loop instruments with multi-velocity layers then Auto Sampler (Apple MainStage 3 for $30) is my tool of choice.

If I intend to sample sustain loop instruments with 1 velocity layer then Björn Bojahr's free sampling suite is my tool. Website is German but Software English.

If you have interest then I'll explain further how to get a nice fast workflow with Bojahr's apps.
Do Bojahr's apps convert to Kontakt or Halion format, or only WAV/SFZ? I would like to take you up on your offer regarding workflow for these apps, if you have time. Thanks!

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Etienne1973
KVRian
660 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:49 am

bharris22 wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:52 am
Do Bojahr's apps convert to Kontakt or Halion format, or only WAV/SFZ?
No worries. Individual pitch (root key) and loop info are stored in WAV files' metadata header. After import in Kontakt do 4 or 5 simple steps and get the perfect mapping. Guess in Halion it's a similar easy task.
bharris22 wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:52 am
I would like to take you up on your offer regarding workflow for these apps, if you have time. Thanks!
I'm gonna post a step by step walkthrough today.

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bharris22
KVRAF
1755 posts since 3 Mar, 2010

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Mon Apr 06, 2020 7:52 am

Thank you!

CircuitEYE
KVRist
141 posts since 11 Sep, 2017

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Mon Apr 06, 2020 11:19 am

Etienne1973 wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 1:07 pm
bharris22 wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:24 pm
I take it from your comment that neither SampleRobot nor Samplit 2 will do the job here?
If you sample decay sounds with multi velocity layers then these tools do the job pretty well.

But I've ran tests with SampleRobot 5.x because of the automatic seamless sustain loop marketing promise. Got no satisfying results. :(

Perhaps SR version 6.5 is better in this regard?

Did you already run your tests with the SR 6.5 Trial?
I have worked with SampleRobot 6.5.
Its a bit buggy (and expensive).
Its not been updated for a long time and seriously needs to be, due to the bugs.
Seems incomplete/unfinished.....

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Etienne1973
KVRian
660 posts since 8 Feb, 2013 from Switzerland

Re: Sampling Hardware Synths

Post Mon Apr 06, 2020 4:18 pm

What we need:

Synth

Audio/MIDI Interface

DAW

Bojahr's free Session2WAV and EndlessWAV apps. Download and put them in the same folder on your desktop. Website German but software's language English.

Plus NI Kontakt Software Sampler (I'm gonna use version 5)


What we're gonna sample:

I don't have access to my hardware synths at the moment. Example wise I've sampled my u-he Repro-5.

Typical Sequential Circuits Prophet 5 sync unison stack. Can be used for lead or bass purposes.

Monophonic, 5 voices stacked and slightly detuned, no velocity sensitivity, re-trigger non-legato, no portamento/glide.

I wanna sample the whole analogue character sound with OSCs beating, filter, mixer and filter/amp envelopes.

All I'm gonna do is set release of the amp envelope to zero and bypass all effects except soft clip saturator.

Hardware Synth

Guess you already connected your hardware synth via MIDI and Audio (line level) with your interface. As long as it sounds good and doesn't clip the AD converter, max out hardware synth's master volume.

DAW

New project. Tempo = 120BPM. Set up for recording the synth. Download this MIDI File and import (eg. drag and drop) on a MIDI track.

Now you have a MIDI region/clip which contains 21 notes in minor 3rd intervals (3 semitones) from key 36 C1 (Yamaha standard) up to C6. Duration each about 22 seconds.

Record at 24 Bit and 44.1 kHz (or 48 kHz) this series of notes with pauses in-between on an audio track. About 10 minutes in real time.

After recording is finished, change gain of this Audio region/clip to loudest peak = -3dBFS. We need this headroom b/c crossfade sustain loop transitions depending on curve can cause clipping.

Export the audio region/clip as WAV, sound name followed by 36_3 (eg. P5 Sync 36_3) to your desktop. Create a folder, sound name only and put the file in it.

Session2WAV

>>> Watch Video <<<

Download this Session File for practicing. Create a new folder (P5 Sync) on your desktop and put the file in there.

- Use headphones

- Start Session2WAV app

- Open audio file (eg. P5 Sync 36_3)

- All 21 notes should be separated in the upper display

- Check the box 24 > 16 bits and convert

- Push the Preview button (sidebar on the right opens)

- Click on 001 and keep eyes on the small display Zoom Start

- Make sure the segment is cut correctly at beginning

- Use the down arrow on your physical computer keyboard to quickly go through segments 002 to 021

- Stop audio

- Check the box Fade (apply this way a 5 sample fade in to avoid clicks)

- Push the Export Regions button

- Push the -> EndlW button

- Yes, trash the session file b/c you have backup in your DAW project and the segments are already stored in the sound folder on your desktop.


... so far for now. Gonna post part 2 (EndlessWAV) and part 3 (Kontakt) a little later.

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