Ableton Live ($700) doomed? Now Logic ($200) got huge update.

[jeffb01]

I’m on a Mac and I own logic (there’s no way to sell it) and I’m not going back to logic... so with that n = 1...

[fuzzlightyear]

What is your impression? Are they fighting for the same userbase? At least ableton have PC users so they will live on.

• Logic 10.5 Release note

• Top 1-50 DAW percentage in DJ Mag Top 100 DJs is, Logic 36.4%, Live 36.4%, FL 15.9%, S1 6.8%, Reason 2.3%, Cubase 2.3%.

*EDIT* Release note link added, added 1-50 daw percentage of DJ Mag top 100.

Re: Ableton Live ($700) doomed? Now Logic ($200) got huge update.

DJs that actually produce their own music is a very small percentage of the audio industry.

I do think that Logic being so inexpensive and now that it can be used as a performance or looping device, it's going to make a lot of people think about that next Live upgrade; what it has, what it doesn't have and what it costs.

[Passing Bye]

...

[Passing Bye]

DJs that actually produce their own music is a very small percentage of the audio industry.

True, but "Djs" that don't make their own music are small percentage of DJ Mag top list, that list is about everything but DJ-ing, it's popularity contest between those acts who play their music on live events, they don't have to DJ, just to show up, press play and dance.

We can argue for days, but wannabe producer hobbyist market is huge part of audio industry right now.

[Yorrrrrr]

I’m on a Mac and I own logic (there’s no way to sell it) and I’m not going back to logic... so with that n = 1...

Yes, same here. Apple is trying to catch up wit LPX. But nope, it's still no Ableton.

[kovacs]

I'm a long time (25 years) Mac user who has had a PC at times, and there is no way Logic will consume the entire Mac market. Garageband is a case in point - there are so many different users with so many different tasks and purposes that the ecosystem needs to offer a wide variety of solutions.

There are many reasons why, for example:

- $199 is not small potatoes for a lot of people so there is a market for cheaper/free DAWs
- many people collaborate with PC users and need to use the same software
- many people simply are more used to/prefer other DAWs than Logic
- many people use more than one DAW (like myself)
- software like Reason has a different selling point than Logic and can nicely co-exist
- Ableton Live also has a very different selling point and unique features

I sold my Live license simply because I could not afford to keep up with both Live and Logic. I miss Live though, but frankly every time I dig deeper into Logic I find ways to solve whatever I'm working on. It's so rich. But Logic is not necessarily better - just different.

[pdxindy]

- $199 is not small potatoes for a lot of people so there is a market for cheaper/free DAWs

There is nothing out there that is cheaper that offers what Logic does.

Something like Reaper is cheaper, but you would then spend considerably more on plugins to have the tools that come with Logic.

Also, I purchased Logic Pro X some years back now and it has developed a lot since then and has not cost another penny.

[SLiC]

If Apple ever want to make some more money (!) they can release this for Windows and I will buy it (and get my much loved Alchemy back)

Yeh I know its never going to happen, but take it as a compliment from a PC user!

[kovacs]

- $199 is not small potatoes for a lot of people so there is a market for cheaper/free DAWs

There is nothing out there that is cheaper that offers what Logic does.

Something like Reaper is cheaper, but you would then spend considerably more on plugins to have the tools that come with Logic.

Also, I purchased Logic Pro X some years back now and it has developed a lot since then and has not cost another penny.

I think you misunderstood the quote.

[apoclypse]

If Apple ever want to make some more money (!) they can release this for Windows and I will buy it (and get my much loved Alchemy back)

Yeh I know its never going to happen, but take it as a compliment from a PC user!

LOL. Logic's revenue doesn't even register as pocket change for Apple. They don't need or want the PC market.

[fuzzlightyear]

If Apple ever want to make some more money (!) they can release this for Windows and I will buy it (and get my much loved Alchemy back)

Yeh I know its never going to happen, but take it as a compliment from a PC user!

LOL. Logic's revenue doesn't even register as pocket change for Apple. They don't need or want the PC market.

Apple takes technology, software and devices that already exist, and improves on their aesthetics. While trying to create a mass appeal, by taking advantage of the hype machine and tapping into the psychology of brand loyalty.

This mystic aura they've created back when "Windows viruses" propaganda was circulating like a case of COVID.

Now a days Apple and their O/S incompatibilities, while causing systems and software to be discontinued or unusable is a much deeper issue than "open source PCs" will ever be. This need for a proprietary stranglehold on their customers is becoming less appealing as the future unfolds.

Logic actually defies their own logic with their pricing, but only to lure would be Apple musicians over the fence and to signup to a world of frequent O/S conflicts and maintenance headaches.

Apple would never let Logic or GarageBand go Windows because they use it as leverage for potential customers, period. If you don't have a selling point or points, then what's the point?

[Forgotten]

Also, why would they move into an already overcrowded market? There might not be much return on that kind of investment.

[Kongru]

I’m on a Mac and I own logic (there’s no way to sell it) and I’m not going back to logic... so with that n = 1...

Yes, same here. Apple is trying to catch up wit LPX. But nope, it's still no Ableton.

What sets Ableton apart?

[brozobob]

I'd love to switch to Logic because Ableton has been sucking as a company for the last half-decade and there's nothing in Live 10 that compelled me to upgrade from 9.

But Logic doesn't have Audio Effect Racks, Instrument Racks, Midi Effect Racks, and the macros. Those are a super important part of my workflow. Logic is super compelling, but without racks and macros, I'm not switching.

Pair Logic and Reason Rack (for the racks aspect), and you have a powerhouse with more sounds that you would ever need. In fact I just listed my Live 9 Suite in the Sell and Buy forum:)

[Biscotto]

I’m on a Mac and I own logic (there’s no way to sell it) and I’m not going back to logic... so with that n = 1...

Yes, same here. Apple is trying to catch up wit LPX. But nope, it's still no Ableton.

What sets Ableton apart?

Work with it and you’ll figure it out for yourself since it seems that DAWs are just a personal thing.
I own Logic (iMac) and the idea that it will kill Ableton is a self delusional prophecy.
Bitwig (the best version of Ableton and on three platforms!) was indeed going to do just that....I see....