Arturia OB-Xa V

[JHernandez]

It's my favorite synth.



So far, I'm not impressed by the Aurturia version but I haven't heard a demo that really aims to sound like the real raw deal yet. Maybe I'll change my mind then, but I'd also like to hear about how much work it took to make it sound like the real thing, if possible.

Anyways, I'm not going to buy the plugin because I'm on a hardware kick but it would be interesting to see a side by side comparison I think.

[PAK]

A preset designer made a great video a few years back with Diva vs. an actual Oberheim. All the analog purists kept asserting the difference between the two, and then when it came to actually blindly spotting the difference, they couldn't do it. They chose Diva again and again.

Because Diva had better punch than that OB8, and most people don't otherwise know what to listen for. Not that it's easy because the whole point in that test was picking sounds which were close.

Had the goal been the opposite - IE to choose sounds which emphasized differences (which there are) the results would likely have been different. So keep in mind peoples motives play a big part in what they show you, and that's why it's not necessarily the best way to discern differences

So, other than exposing peoples dumb biases, comparison tests are kind of a waste unless you use them to point out where you think something lacks, and hopefully have someone pick up on that thing and improve on it. This stuff isn't random. It's usually about a level of detail in specific features. Not just when you slam the resonance either - Examples with PWM motion, on those OB8 tests, would've revealed greater differences with Diva. But that wasn't the goal..

[TheMaestro]

A preset designer made a great video a few years back with Diva vs. an actual Oberheim. All the analog purists kept asserting the difference between the two, and then when it came to actually blindly spotting the difference, they couldn't do it. They chose Diva again and again.

This is simply because Diva doesn't sound analog, but "better/different".
And many analog synths just doesn't sound good.

[mrj1nx]

Consider the fact that the full price advertised is 200 eur. Thats one tenth or 2000eur. For ~2000 eur I can get a used OB6. That at least for me is carrot enough to skip most plugins and save for the real deal. On the other hand I guess almost zero people would buy this at full price.

I think both synapse and arturia should consider making a video going in depth on how deep and advanced their modelling of the synth is.

[kmonkey]

Because Diva had better punch than that OB8, and most people don't otherwise know what to listen for. So keep in mind peoples motives play a big part in what they show you, and that's why it's not necessarily the best way to discern differences

Oh really. You are automatically assuming that all people which joined test did not know what to listen for. Hahaha how humble from you

So, other than exposing peoples dumb biases, comparison tests are kind of a waste unless you use them to point out where you think something lacks, and hopefully have someone pick up on that thing and improve on it. This stuff isn't random.

Oh gimme a break. No they are not waste. They serve exactly what they need. If person can not point out difference between the two then that's presentation of how close one side of technology developed itself.

Past 20 years i've seen dozen of people such as yourself. You act like your poo is no stinky when in fact people like you almost NEVER join any blind testing.

You are all full of excuses and broken logic yet somehow you all find your way in to threads criticizing stuff AFTER tests are done or revealed.

Almost exclusively people like you join these comparison tests AFTER results are revealed and then you are all golden saying how you can hear difference even on laptop speakers. Something like that.

It is precisely that people like you need to join and crush your own bias to became better and develop further.

This stuff isn't random. It's usually about a level of detail in specific features. Not just when you slam the resonance either - Examples with PWM motion, on those OB8 tests, would've revealed greater differences with Diva. But that wasn't the goal..

Yeah that. That precisely. I have yet to see any song in any genre where people can pinpoint and say...yeah man that song/genre is amazing. Did you hear that PWM...

You are like those Intel fanboys. I mean now after we reached that level of people not being able to tell the difference now you are telling me that key is in PWM....hahaha

I will never forget how they pissed on Ryzen platform saying how Intel architecture is superior. Then two years after Ryzen was on market completely crushing intel architecture then these intel fanboy people shifted from who is making better processor to who is generating better yearly revenue - hahahaha hypocrite

I would sincerely like you to see your superior attention to details and knowhow on how to listen when proper decent comparison test are published. Seriously.

I already see your answer coming...oo i am not available....ooo there is no point in this...ooooo my super duper active speakers are not available so i am listening on lowquality speakers so excuse me if i am getting wrong results...and that stuff.

I can say with 99.99% precision that in proper comparison with 16-20 examples you wouldn't be able to pick 5 right answers one after another. And then you would probably claim how test were rigged.

But luck is on your side. You'll most likely never join these test i mean noone is that stupid to waste so much ti me on your PWM stuff.

[mholloway]

A preset designer made a great video a few years back with Diva vs. an actual Oberheim. All the analog purists kept asserting the difference between the two, and then when it came to actually blindly spotting the difference, they couldn't do it. They chose Diva again and again.

This is simply because Diva doesn't sound analog, but "better/different".
And many analog synths just doesn't sound good.

I think you missed the point. Regardless of what you think Diva sounds like -- better, different, hot mayonnaise, it makes no difference -- the point is that the hardware buffs who insisted the hardware was better, couldn't pick it out against the Diva.

As for the other dude, PAK, saying it's 'because how the tests were done' and so on -- that, as someone else has already replied, is the usual bogus reply of the person just refusing to admit he's beat. The test covered a wide range of different sounds. It wasn't raw oscillators, it was actual patches. Things people would use in a song. The hardware crowd couldn't tell a difference. That speaks volumes about where the technology is at. You can keep trying to talk around the problem with your bending-over-backwards rationales and dubious explanations, it makes no difference. The test proved its point years ago, but you are still stuck with your head in the sand.

[chk071]

@mholloway: The thing with that "comparison" was that it was a excercise in matching sounds, not a A/B comparison.

Pretty impossible to do that with Diva anyway. The parameters won't match, the envelopes won't match. You have to synthetically add noise to match the hardware. The guy is pretty talented though, and, I really liked what he did there. You can indeed get very, very close with software, no doubt.

Check the comparison between the Pro-1 and the Behringer Pro-1 from Starsky Carr on Youtube. It's insane, he dials in the same parameter values, and the synths actually match sound wise.

[PAK]

Oh really. You are automatically assuming that all people which joined test did not know what to listen for. Hahaha how humble from you

20 years of reading their various opinions on forums is not quite a blind assumption Ask them to explain differences and many of them can't. That means they often don't understand them and, if they don't understand them, how are they supposed to listen for them?

Oh gimme a break. No they are not waste. They serve exactly what they need. If person can not point out difference between the two then that's presentation of how close one side of technology developed itself.

Not if the examples aren't really exposing the differences much. Like I said.. this stuff isn't random and it should be self evident that the better emulations already do a lot of stuff well. Indeed, I'd often prefer Diva over real analogue synths.. sooo...

Past 20 years i've seen dozen of people such as yourself. You act like your poo is no stinky when in fact people like you almost NEVER join any blind testing.

What was that you were saying about assumptions? But I do find it less useful these days.. plus there's cheap clones now, so just buy those if you're that bothered, would be my attitude.

Almost exclusively people like you join these comparison tests AFTER results are revealed and then you are all golden saying how you can hear difference even on laptop speakers. Something like that.

But I'm not saying that. And I'm naming a specific feature (PWM, in relation to motion which would be greater on the "real" OB8, and can't quite be copied the same on Diva though you could certainly make it more difficult to tell if you spot it).

tell the difference now you are telling me that key is in PWM...

No, I'm saying it's one area. He could likely pick out points on the filter with resonance too, which would be harder to emulate.. I'm sure Swan would be happy to tell you there were differences on his hardware.. Sooo..

Anyway, thanks for the rant

[AdvancedFollower]

2. Emulation Accuracy - Again, subjective.

how?

either its accurate, or it isnt

Because the human ear isn't perfect. So unless one knows the actual specs of the original and the specs of the emulation, given all they have is their ear to go on, their evaluation of the accuracy of the emulation is subjective.

And you know what? It doesn't even matter if the specs are identical (which it really can't be if you're comparing analog to what is now digital) if the person listening to the synth thinks that it doesn't sound like the original.

So yes, the interpretation of the accuracy, to the end user, is subjective.

And that's the only thing that ultimately matters.

ah OK, so this is subjective too then...

I owned a Korg Wavestation and used it for years. The Korg VST is identical. There is absolutely no difference. Nobody can tel me there is. It is dead on.

Yes, that is subjective too. Now go and find one person on this planet who owned a Wavestation who doesn't think the VST is dead on identical.

I'll wait.

The real question is, are any of your listeners going to go "This song sucks because he used the Wavestation plugin and not the real hardware! I can clearly hear the difference in this mixed and mastered track!".

[Teksonik]

Dune 3 cannot sound like a true Polymoog.

Again thank god....but are you sure ?

And as far as business opportunities to sell libraries goes, well here are the numbers out of 80 libraries.

Synapse Stuff

Legend - 10th best seller
Dune 2 - 12th best seller
Dune 3 - 54th best seller

Arturia Stuff

V5 Collection - 8th best seller
V6 Collection - 20th best seller
Pigments - 33rd best seller

So as you can see, Arturia has a slight edge for me as it's more consistent. Dune 3 was a terrible disappointment for me, relatively speaking.

Comparing the entire Arturia Collection to a single plugin ?

Of course, as you can see, the more recent stuff (Dune 3, Pigments) hasn't been doing as well and I think that has to do with saturation.

No offense intended but could the lack of sales of your Dune 3 banks possibly have to do with the quality of the product rather than the size of the market ?

Anyway saying you won't buy the Synapse offering if it isn't released on time seems like a mistake to me but buy whatever you wish.....

[wagtunes]

Dune 3 cannot sound like a true Polymoog.

Again thank god....but are you sure ?

And as far as business opportunities to sell libraries goes, well here are the numbers out of 80 libraries.

Synapse Stuff

Legend - 10th best seller
Dune 2 - 12th best seller
Dune 3 - 54th best seller

Arturia Stuff

V5 Collection - 8th best seller
V6 Collection - 20th best seller
Pigments - 33rd best seller

So as you can see, Arturia has a slight edge for me as it's more consistent. Dune 3 was a terrible disappointment for me, relatively speaking.

Comparing the entire Arturia Collection to a single plugin ?

Of course, as you can see, the more recent stuff (Dune 3, Pigments) hasn't been doing as well and I think that has to do with saturation.

No offense intended but could the lack of sales of your Dune 3 banks possibly have to do with the quality of the product rather than the size of the market ?

Anyway saying you won't buy the Synapse offering if it isn't released on time seems like a mistake to me but buy whatever you wish.....

Everyone here says all my libraries sound like crap. So everything being equal, they should all sell just as poorly. But they don't.

As for making a mistake, it comes down to available funds. I don't have the luxury of buying both. And to buy one because I think it will make me money when recent experience tells me otherwise seems like a poor business decision. And the only reason I would purchase Arturia first is because there is a deadline on the sale. Otherwise, if it was forever or no sale at all, I'd wait for Synapse and be done with it.

And even if I were rich as (insert famous person) I still wouldn't need 2 OB-Xa's.

[TheMaestro]

Because Diva had better punch than that OB8, and most people don't otherwise know what to listen for. So keep in mind peoples motives play a big part in what they show you, and that's why it's not necessarily the best way to discern differences

Oh really. You are automatically assuming that all people which joined test did not know what to listen for. Hahaha how humble from you

Obviously, the people that couldn't pick out the analog synth didn't know what to listen for.

[TheMaestro]

A preset designer made a great video a few years back with Diva vs. an actual Oberheim. All the analog purists kept asserting the difference between the two, and then when it came to actually blindly spotting the difference, they couldn't do it. They chose Diva again and again.

This is simply because Diva doesn't sound analog, but "better/different".
And many analog synths just doesn't sound good.

I think you missed the point. Regardless of what you think Diva sounds like -- better, different, hot mayonnaise, it makes no difference -- the point is that the hardware buffs who insisted the hardware was better, couldn't pick it out against the Diva.

Those "buffs" picked the best sounding example and assumed that had to be the analog synth, because analog is "the best".

That test wasn't great for the hardware buffs nor u-he.

[fmr]

And this thread, after having passed through a "mine is better than yours", is now at the "mine is bigger than yours" state

[urosh]

And even if I were rich as (insert famous person) I still wouldn't need 2 OB-Xa's.

But you have at least two Minimoog emus, right?
I don't get this part, Legend was what, 5th or 6th emulation that came onto market, but people were buying it and you got some nice sales of libraries for it.