Upcoming Synapse OB-Xa: Obsession

[Echoes in the Attic]

Oops. Accidental quote.

[BONES]

That OB-Xa V was just not "good" to my ear. It just made me appreciate the filter of the OB-Xd, which isn't even some fancy circuit modeled emulation as far as I know.

The 4 pole filter in the OB-Xa is terrible, like really bad. It's a ladder filter but it's a lot worse even than the Minimoog's. But the 2-pole filter is a completely different design, based on their SEM filter, and it's great. So if the Arturia doesn't sound very good, it's possible that, as you suggest, it is a closer emulation.

On the "which sounds best" front, I can't be arsed trying out the Arturia one but what I can tell you is that OBsession sounds absolutely incredible. I would be very surprised if anyone who put off buying the Arturia one was disappointed when they got OBsession. If the Arturia one is better, it must be a very special synth indeed but nothing I have read about it indicates it is anything more than a decent emulation with a few extra features.

To give you some idea where the development is at, we are testing "RC" versions at the moment but, in typical Rich fashion, he is still adding new features, largely based on feedback from here. So new features means the RC process won't be as quick as it should be but the GUI is now complete and I don't think there will be any more additions or changes so it shouldn't be too much longer.

In fact, if anything, it might be the peripheral stuff that holds it up - finishing the manual and assembling presets based on the full feature set. The last 2-3 weeks have added bits that definitely need new presets to show them off. A month ago Rich already had more than 500 patches for the factory bank so who knows how many it will end up shipping with. I've been working on a batch of 5D presets with my Roli, based on existing presets, so I will finalise that and hand it in over the weekend. So it won't be more than another couple of weeks, I reckon, and could be sooner than that (but don't quote me, I am just guessing). What I can say with certainty is that it will be worth the wait.

[EnGee]

Are we there yet? I sold Dune 3 and Bitwig so I could save some money for "La bomba" (one of the reasons really!)

[zerocrossing]

But when you say stuff like "I doubt it will be better" having never even heard it, that says that you're not even allowing yourself to give it a fair chance. And that came across as a pro-Arturia bias. That's all.

Are you being stubborn, or is it my fault because I'm not explaining myself well?

I'm not being biased. I said, and I repeat - it's a matter of taste. And I also gave the example of apples. To me, an apple is an apple. I don't have a favorite kind of apple. If it's juicy and tastes good, I like it. And I don't like one more than the other.

So, I DOUBT IT WILL BE BETTER. And I doubt it because, when we reach a certain degree of quality, things are no longer "better", but simply different, "more to my taste because of this or that". I'm sure it will sound good, and I may very well like the way it sounds. I may even consider buying it, if I am offered a good deal. But I DOUBT IT WILL BE BETTER - is this clarified now?

What I don't say is that "I deleted OB-Xa V because I didn't like it" (I sincerely doubt it did sound THAT BAD to anyone that is in good faith - only someone highly biased could make a statement like that), and also would never say that I'm sure SOMETHING I DIDN'T EVEN HEARD YET will be MUCH BETTER, or that Synapse is in a different platform. That's being totaly unfair. But hey... it's KVR - I've watched Arturia being completely dragged to the mud for much less not so long ago

See? I don't bash anyone. I don't need to. Only people who feel unsecure feel the urge to bash competition.

Holy crap, the tribalism...

I have no dog in this race. I like some Arturia products and I like Synapse’s products. I’d put Synthi V up against Legend in terms of analog emulations and be hard pressed to say that either one is a clear winner. They’re both amazing. If I was making a list of the 5 best analog emulations available, they’d both be on it. OB-Xa V might be on it too...

Legend
RePro
PolyKB
Synthi V
Roland System 100

OK, so maybe it doesn’t make it in, but it’s good. Roland kind of tilts the playing field because I really feel their emulations are all outstanding. Anyway, OT over.

I also have a hard time thinking that anyone who loves synthesizers (and uses plugins) would use OB-Xa V and think it didn’t sound great. It sounds great. Might not be your thing, but I’ve spent a bunch of time with it and the sound quality is extremely high. Is it even close to an OB-Xa? I was getting some pretty good Prince style sounds out of it that put a smile on my face. Maybe it sounds a hair bright to me... really not a bad thing. It’s not like the brightness has a bunch of aliasing on it. It’s a far cry from the muted high end of things like Mini V. The mod matrix is easy to use and really adds a ton to a straight 1:1 emulation, and that’s not even getting into the function generator. It’s a lot more synth than Legend is, in this respect. Not that I don’t think that Legend is amazing. It’s just a lot closer to a Model D, not counting the polyphony. Of course I don’t know what special tricks OBsession will bring to the table. I don’t really care. I’m going to buy it regardless, because I consider it supporting a developer that I really like.

And you know what? If you were all good little KVRarians, you’d buy both too. Because you can’t really figure out what to do with your money anyway now that you can’t go drinking in pubs.

[revvy]

I'm guessing the SA will sound better.

Bought a new analogue guitar pedal tho so might be a while before I can splash out on a synth.

I'll start saving up. No rush guys.

[AnX]

I'm guessing the SA will sound better.

you can't tell in a mix

No rush guys.

not even Tom Sawyer?

[revvy]

I'm guessing the SA will sound better.

you can't tell in a mix

No rush guys.

not even Tom Sawyer?

Actually, yes Rush, I was a young metaller.

Now I'm learning bass I'm revisiting Geddy.

[Ingonator]

That OB-Xa V was just not "good" to my ear. It just made me appreciate the filter of the OB-Xd, which isn't even some fancy circuit modeled emulation as far as I know.

The 4 pole filter in the OB-Xa is terrible, like really bad. It's a ladder filter but it's a lot worse even than the Minimoog's. But the 2-pole filter is a completely different design, based on their SEM filter, and it's great. So if the Arturia doesn't sound very good, it's possible that, as you suggest, it is a closer emulation.

The 4-pole filter is not "bad" at all it is just different compared to the 2-pole filter and opposing to that 2-pole filter it loses much low end at high resonance.
Several patches i made with the OBsession plugin only really work with uisng the 4-poole filter while others need the 2-pole one.

FWIW in OBsession when i need high resonaance while keeping the low end i will mostly use the 2-pole LPF. For such purposes it is indeed better.

On the other hand i like the Minimoog filter (especially the one in The Legend while i had also used the real thing) while you seem to hate it so i guess we simply do not agree there.

[BONES]

The 4 pole filter is really, really awful. If you even look at the resonance knob the bottom end starts to fall out of your sound and by the time you can actually hear the resonant peak, the bottom end is completely gone. It actually makes the Minimoog filter seem OK. If you don't need the bottom end, then of course it has its uses but that is NOT how Low Pass filters are supposed to be. As the name implies, the low frequencies should pass through, not be attenuated. Hence it is a really terrible low-pass filter.

[EnGee]

So the 4 pole filter is weak (or not that good) in the original design of OB Xa not in Arturia's emulation, right? So, I expect that Obsession is also has the same weakness (as the original), but maybe a bit more accurate than Arturia's?

Not that matter really, because in any case I like Arturia's one and definitely going to buy Obsession, but I want to understand because I think the sound in Sleepwalk (Ultravox) at about 1:30 is not with the OB Xa, while the OB Xa used only for those low fat heavy chords. Right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIdbeJzjKSs

[OrangeSlices]

c'mon Synapse gang, I want beans to be spilled, I want to hear THE sounds. not the vague rubbish in Synapse video teaser, but some real OBX phatness, you know what I'm saying. gimme the brasses, the strings, some crazy leads and shit, show me the money! like Cuba Gooding used to say.

Arturia gives me a major GAS and I'm about to rip a big one, but I want Synapse sound designers to give me the anti-gas tablet, not with just talk, but with the actual demos. Take my GAS for Arturia and turn it into Synapse GAS.

now I've heard some phat in that mp3 posted, but it's not enough. it's time for a second one and just bloody convince me I never think of Arturia again and just save my Bens and my Ulysses focking Grants for the Richard.

[schpaeckulum]

The 4 pole filter is really, really awful. If you even look at the resonance knob the bottom end starts to fall out of your sound and by the time you can actually hear the resonant peak, the bottom end is completely gone. It actually makes the Minimoog filter seem OK. If you don't need the bottom end, then of course it has its uses but that is NOT how Low Pass filters are supposed to be. As the name implies, the low frequencies should pass through, not be attenuated. Hence it is a really terrible low-pass filter.

They didn't know how to make a good 4-pole filter, or did it like that on purpose? If your oscillator section is limited, are you going to include two samey filters after it, or make them different, just to open up more sound design possibilities?

[chk071]

They didn't know how to make a good 4-pole filter, or did it like that on purpose?

Don't worry, I'm sure the 4-pole sounds great like it does on the original. Somehow Bones doesn't seem to like 4 poles.

[urosh]

So the 4 pole filter is weak (or not that good) in the original design of OB Xa not in Arturia's emulation, right?

Yeah, it's famously crappy CEM3320, also used in Prophet 5 and Pro One, which also sound like crap.

[urosh]

"Emu sounds like crap because original synth sounds like crap, so emu is actually really good" is next level stuff, contorting narrative where no narrative has gone before.