KVR Audio

Ou_Tis · Post by **Ou_Tis** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:42 am

Several mixing courses recommend the Maag EQ4---just for adding air. I also like the sub. Since the EQ2 is supposed to have the same air band, and I prefer a variable second band over fixed bands anyway, I thought I'd prefer the EQ2. But the PA audio demos for EQ2 sound noticeably harsher in the high end, while EQ4 audio demos sound smooth. But I was wondering if it that was just the choice of material or amount applied. (Almost as if PA wanted to discourage people from getting the EQ2 instead of the EQ4?) Demoing them now myself, I think there may be a slight difference at the same settings (all except air turned to 0). Or is there? Is the air band effectively identical?

The Noodlist · Post by **The Noodlist** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:52 am

Dunno.
There's Luftikus for free, it has an air band, so do the TDR EQ's

Ou_Tis · Post by **Ou_Tis** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:59 am

The Noodlist wrote: Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:52 am Dunno.
There's Luftikus for free, it has an air band, so do the TDR EQ's

Yeah, I saw the Youtube video comparing them. Luftikus isn't quite as good on vocals and it can smear the bass a little (in a nice way, but I wouldn't usually want to do that).

The EQ4 and EQ2 definitely sound different when "only" adding air....

EQ4 is on sale before the 13th, so I should decide tomorrow.

djanthonyw · Post by **djanthonyw** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 2:52 am

I have both and the air band on 4 and 2 sound pretty much the same.

MogwaiBoy · Post by **MogwaiBoy** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 3:54 am

This thing has sold purely on it's "Air" band but it is not unique and can be done with many, many other EQs.

SlickEQ for example also does 40hZ "Air" and has an even smoother curve...

To answer your question though, EQ4 in red and EQ2 is in pink... they're similar but not identical.

EQ2 has a flatter frequency response at default - EQ4 is a bit.. lumpy. Neither of them emulate the pre-amps so there's no harmonics, just a bunch of Plugin Alliance's trademark truncation

Greybox Audio · Post by **Greybox Audio** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 7:54 am

In true kvr fashion I feel inclined to tell you that EQ4 sounds much more open and clearer and 3D and has that extra bit of gnnnmpf that we're all looking for. EQ2 is absolutely inferior and has nasty cramping and aliasing and - if the numbers don't make it obvious - is only half as good.

In reality though, here's what's up with the Air-bands:
EQ2 has an additional 15k setting.
EQ4 has more gain and the gain curve is slightly different. So when you set both EQs to 2.5k and a gain of 8.0, EQ4 will sound "so much better" simply because it's actually 3dB louder.
EQ4 doesn't have an off-switch but instead is actually flat, when set to 0.
On the EQ2 Just switching the Air band on, already adds a fixed gain boost. This is comparable to a gain of 2.5 on the EQ4.

tl;dr - you can't compare both EQs by just dialing in the same numbers. When matched correctly they are pretty much equal.

jochicago · Post by **jochicago** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 8:42 am

I got the Maag EQ2 from the interface bundle (Presonus I think, BTW you can buy that bundle on Ebay for like $15).

I've been told the air band is magic, fantastic, 3d, low "harshness". So I keep trying to hear something special.

It's an inconvenient plugin inside the DAW. The stepped knobs are an inferior tool inside a digital space and this thing is playing with frequencies that warrant some precision. All it can do is a wide boost at the bottom and the celebrated air trick at the top. So this eq comes out when I'm ready to receive the magic, like the blessing of a deity.

Except the blessing never comes. Every try I give this thing I end up annoyed that I can't set it to something like 4k, or control the Q and placement of the bass lift. If there's something special about the air lift it's lost on me. I just take it off and go back to my favored EQs. Never once after swapping EQs I thought I lost something that the Maag was giving me (but I also use very good de-essing so maybe there was no harshness to expose, perhaps your mileage will vary).

If I wanted something "analog" like this to lift the bass and the air, I would much rather use a Pultec, and I don't really like Pultecs (I don't quite gel with the knobs).

If you got money burning a hole in your pocket, try Black Rooster VPRE 73. The only boost it has is the air band of the 1073, and it's actually something. For me it's much closer to a "magical knob" than the Maag EQ2. I don't know what modeling is in the knob but there's some transformer-ish stuff happening, plus the band is a one-size-fits-all that sounds good on anything. Quite overpowered too, a touch is plenty. I set it to like 8%.

Burillo · Post by **Burillo** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:30 am

i got it for free also. IMO it's one of those things that either works or doesn't. you put it on, you try it, if it works, it works, if it doesn't, move on. i also have VPRE-73 and i like its high boost way less, i always found it a bit too low and too harsh for me. horses for courses, in other words.

pixel85 · Post by **pixel85** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:04 am

Seriously it's nothing special neither EQ4 nor EQ2. This 'air' magic is nothing but marketing. Some time ago my friend put hardware Maag EQ on my track master bus and whoooaaa... The plugin can't compete with hardware at all. Plugin doesn't do anything what other modern plugin EQ's can't. Save money and don't buy any of these.

El°HYM · Post by **El°HYM** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:07 pm

Not exactly an Airband, yet might be able to achieve similar:
https://www.kvraudio.com/product/roth-air-by-rothmann

I also remember Airwindows wanting to release an Air - Band - Equalizer,
which he might already have & I just dont know because its hidden the 300+ Plugin - folder.

Could be one of these, that are already near/there:
https://www.airwindows.com/purestair-vst/
https://www.airwindows.com/air-vst/

Would be pretty neat to see an Update on the air - band concept by chris.

GRUMP · Post by **GRUMP** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 5:49 pm

AA Celestial(free). Or Jade in the End. Tried PA and it took me 3 Minutes.

Turello · Post by **Turello** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:08 pm

The best "air" band filter i've tried it's the high band on Black Rooster Audio Edelweiss, especially on mastering... Amazing!

Hanz Meyzer · Post by **Hanz Meyzer** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 6:10 pm

It's magic

MogwaiBoy · Post by **MogwaiBoy** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:05 pm

El°HYM wrote: Fri Jun 12, 2020 1:07 pm Not exactly an Airband, yet might be able to achieve similar:
https://www.kvraudio.com/product/roth-air-by-rothmann

I also remember Airwindows wanting to release an Air - Band - Equalizer,
which he might already have & I just dont know because its hidden the 300+ Plugin - folder.

Could be one of these, that are already near/there:
https://www.airwindows.com/purestair-vst/
https://www.airwindows.com/air-vst/

Would be pretty neat to see an Update on the air - band concept by chris.

We always fall into this trap, for example we've made "air" EQ a thing. It's not a thing. It's not a situation where only plugins that explicitly state an "air" control do it. An "air band" is not a thing. I'm calling snakeoil on "air". PA have made millions off this "air band". It's a high shelf and that's literally all it is - any EQ that doesn't cramp against Nyquist will do it.

Let's de-mistify these marketing terms and save some money.

abi · Post by **abi** » Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:24 pm

I tried to like the mag eq4, but as others have stated too, the air band doesn’t sound any better to me than high shelfs of other eqs. If I want an „airy“ high boost I will have to try a few plugins‘ high shelf’s....owning a bunch of pa stuff I would recommend the bx_2098 as a nice all round EQ or one of the channel strips for some characterful high boost (in an „airy“ sense).

PA Maag EQ4 vs EQ2 - is the air on 4 smoother?