Synapse Audio OBSESSION is now available!
- KVRian
- 695 posts since 9 Apr, 2005 from Japan
Stormchild
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Funkybot's Evil Twin Funkybot's Evil Twin https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=116627
- KVRAF
- 11483 posts since 16 Aug, 2006
What synth emulation doesn't add features or deviate from the workflow? There are exactly zero that I know of.wagtunes wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 1:42 pm John Doe: Hey, I'd love to have an OB-Xa emulation
Dev: Okay, here you go.
John Doe: Cool. Now, could you add....
Dev: (scratching head) I thought you wanted an OB-Xa emulation.
John Doe: I do, but I just want you to add...
Dev: (A Bit Annoyed Now) Yeah, but that's not an OB-Xa emulation.
John Doe: But that's what I want.
Dev: (Throwing Toys Out Window) I'm going back to making door knobs.
They're ALL doing things like adding polyphony, effects, a mod matrix, velocity, MPE, tweaks panels, eliminating noise, adding a sequencer, etc.
So this whole idea that customers want exacting emulations in the first place is a bit of a straw man argument. Customers want the sound of classic synths, in a feature set that at minimum matches the hardware but expands on it. It's up to the developer to understand how best to expand on it, and implement which additional features and how.
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- KVRAF
- 4283 posts since 15 Feb, 2020
some have claimed in this thread that ears are irrelevant...
anyhoo, nowt wrong in asking nicely for stuff from the dev - if it makes practical sense or not he'll decide.
I lost my heart in Taumatawhakatangihangakoauauotamateaturipukakapikimaungahoronukupokaiwhenuakitanatahu
- KVRAF
- 21191 posts since 8 Oct, 2014
Then let's stop saying we want a (fill in synth name) emulation because nobody really wants that.Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:20 pmWhat synth emulation doesn't add features or deviate from the workflow? There are exactly zero that I know of.wagtunes wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 1:42 pm John Doe: Hey, I'd love to have an OB-Xa emulation
Dev: Okay, here you go.
John Doe: Cool. Now, could you add....
Dev: (scratching head) I thought you wanted an OB-Xa emulation.
John Doe: I do, but I just want you to add...
Dev: (A Bit Annoyed Now) Yeah, but that's not an OB-Xa emulation.
John Doe: But that's what I want.
Dev: (Throwing Toys Out Window) I'm going back to making door knobs.
They're ALL doing things like adding polyphony, effects, a mod matrix, velocity, MPE, tweaks panels, eliminating noise, adding a sequencer, etc.
So this whole idea that customers want exacting emulations in the first place is a bit of a straw man argument. Customers want the sound of classic synths, in a feature set that at minimum matches the hardware but expands on it. It's up to the developer to understand how best to expand on it, and implement which additional features and how.
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- Banned
- 3946 posts since 25 Jan, 2009
Don`t understand either. What is wrong with wanting an emulation with extended features when this is one obvious option of recreating it in software? Those who want to stay true to the restrictions can just avoid using them. Or is that the problem? “Plz, don’t make extended features, I get so tempted to use them and lose sense of authenticity.”
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- KVRist
- 104 posts since 28 Apr, 2015
agreeIncarnateX wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:42 pm Don`t understand either. What is wrong with wanting an emulation with extended features when this is one obvious option of recreating it in software? Those who want to stay true to the restrictions can just avoid using them. Or is that the problem? “Plz, don’t make extended features, I get so tempted to use them and lose sense of authenticity.”
and my request is a sub OSC (like sequential did on the OB-6)
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Funkybot's Evil Twin Funkybot's Evil Twin https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=116627
- KVRAF
- 11483 posts since 16 Aug, 2006
It's not either or. RePro-1/5 are pretty damn exacting emulations but they each add additional features. Every emulation I know of adds features. You can do both simultaneously: create an emulation of a classic synth while simultaneously expanding the feature set. That's all we're talking about.
- KVRAF
- 21191 posts since 8 Oct, 2014
Which doesn't make it an exact emulation.Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:43 pmIt's not either or. RePro-1/5 are pretty damn exacting emulations but they each add additional features. Every emulation I know of adds features. You can do both simultaneously: create an emulation of a classic synth while simultaneously expanding the feature set. That's all we're talking about.
Look, I'm waiting for SOMEBODY to make a CS-80 that deserves to be more than spit at. But PLEASE don't add anything to this beast. It has enough stuff crammed into it already.
So we'll just agree to disagree.
- KVRAF
- 6304 posts since 18 Jul, 2008 from New York
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Funkybot's Evil Twin Funkybot's Evil Twin https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=116627
- KVRAF
- 11483 posts since 16 Aug, 2006
The only one talking about an exact emulation with no extra features is you! You made that up as a thing people want to make a contrarian argument. There is not a single VSTi emulation of hardware in existence that I can think of that meets this imaginary criteria of yours. No one wants that. Not even you. Nothing to disagree about at all.wagtunes wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:51 pmWhich doesn't make it an exact emulation.Funkybot's Evil Twin wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 3:43 pmIt's not either or. RePro-1/5 are pretty damn exacting emulations but they each add additional features. Every emulation I know of adds features. You can do both simultaneously: create an emulation of a classic synth while simultaneously expanding the feature set. That's all we're talking about.
Look, I'm waiting for SOMEBODY to make a CS-80 that deserves to be more than spit at. But PLEASE don't add anything to this beast. It has enough stuff crammed into it already.
So we'll just agree to disagree.
The fact that VSTi's allow you to save presets and recall in a DAW is already not an "exact emulation." Should developers only allow you to run one instance per license and break recall functionality just to make it more exact like the hardware? Would that be an accurate emulation for you? No! That would be completely silly. Do these emulations include additional effects that were not part of the original units? Yes! Do many add features like polyphony? Yes! Do many add Mod Matrixes, sequencers, expanded modulation options? Yes! Can you still do all of those things in a way that includes the original features and still makes it an accurate emulation of the hardware? Yes! Because users can ignore the added features and stick to only those the hardware had.
So just saying "well then it's not exact and some people will not be happy because it's not exact" is just arguing for the sake of arguing. No product meets that criteria. No one is really saying that. Sorry.
- Banned
- 10732 posts since 17 Nov, 2015
indeed, for certain tasks they are.... for creating sounds tho, of the utmost importance
nothing wrong at all, and I'd be very surprised if one or more were not taken on board.... but I doubt everyone will be pleased, such is life
- Banned
- 10732 posts since 17 Nov, 2015
The way I see it is this...
a dev wants to make an accurate clone of a famous synth
he does this, but realises users will want some modern touches (polyphony, mods, Fx etc)
he adds stuff he considers complimentary
on release, the dev is inundated with FRs, and now he faces a dilemma.... add them and stray too far from the original, or leave them out.
in the case of SA, if you want bells and whistles e, get Dune 3, if you want an accurate emulation with some bonus features, get Obsession
a dev wants to make an accurate clone of a famous synth
he does this, but realises users will want some modern touches (polyphony, mods, Fx etc)
he adds stuff he considers complimentary
on release, the dev is inundated with FRs, and now he faces a dilemma.... add them and stray too far from the original, or leave them out.
in the case of SA, if you want bells and whistles e, get Dune 3, if you want an accurate emulation with some bonus features, get Obsession
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Funkybot's Evil Twin Funkybot's Evil Twin https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=116627
- KVRAF
- 11483 posts since 16 Aug, 2006
It's definitely a balancing act and there's some art to what to include and what not to when it comes to extra features. There's no right answer. Just different compromises and limitations. U-he and Arturia both have a good balance of old and new, Rich did pretty well but could've been a tiny bit less conservative IMO. Obsession is already in the ballpark as far as I'm concerned but could've been improved by adding a few LFO shapes and tempo sync, or using trimmers for velocity to save mod slots. Nothing crazy.AnX wrote: ↑Sat Jul 04, 2020 4:15 pm The way I see it is this...
a dev wants to make an accurate clone of a famous synth
he does this, but realises users will want some modern touches (polyphony, mods, Fx etc)
he adds stuff he considers complimentary
on release, the dev is inundated with FRs, and now he faces a dilemma.... add them and stray too far from the original, or leave them out.
in the case of SA, if you want bells and whistles e, get Dune 3, if you want an accurate emulation with some bonus features, get Obsession
- KVRian
- 1452 posts since 25 Sep, 2011
Obsession already got a decent amount of additional features, while staying very close to the original hardware (I personally would like very few more, and I'm sure some will be added down the road, but it's fine with me if it stays like this). For more features, just look elsewhere. DUNE 3 would be a very good option, for instance. But Obsession is already a fine instrument.
Last edited by Yorrrrrr on Sat Jul 04, 2020 4:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.
- KVRian
- 1452 posts since 25 Sep, 2011
Just adding 6 slots of modulation matrix with tons of parameters, velocity, AT, etc., is way beyond an OB-Xa. The OB-Xa is emulated very closely just in the front side of the plugin.