KVR Audio

SamDi · Post by **SamDi** » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:03 pm

V0rtex wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:52 pm damn, Ableton upgrade is pricey regarding FL Studio upgrades,
but it will be over with paid upgrades soon anyway, because I guessing every major software developer will run a subscription model soon as Adobe did it......

You mean upgrade or update? FL Studio is lifetime update, so the costs are zero there...

Rivanni · Post by **Rivanni** » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:39 pm

V0rtex wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:52 pm damn, Ableton upgrade is pricey regarding FL Studio upgrades,
but it will be over with paid upgrades soon anyway, because I guessing every major software developer will run a subscription model soon as Adobe did it......

Yes, you're guessing.
Soon? Adobe started subscriptions 8 years ago. How many DAWs have a subscription?

zerocrossing · Post by **zerocrossing** » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:53 pm

Reefius wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:00 pm It's always the same when a new paid update of any software is released. Some people always complain if they bought it before the grace period.
When you're buying a piece of software, you're buying it as it is on that very moment. It will not stop working because a new version is released.

You can't expect a company to stop selling their current product because they know a newer version is coming.

It's just bad luck. Same with people who buy something at full price and the next day it goes on sale. Bad luck.

As a teenager working in retail I once had a woman who wanted the sale price on a tennis racket that she had purchased 8 months before the sale.

SamDi · Post by **SamDi** » Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:24 pm

zerocrossing wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:53 pm As a teenager working in retail I once had a woman who wanted the sale price on a tennis racket that she had purchased 8 months before the sale.

Yes, these Karens are everywhere, even here on KVR

tooneba · Post by **tooneba** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:10 am

anxiousmofo wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:02 pm
Reefius wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 7:00 pm It's always the same when a new paid update of any software is released. Some people always complain if they bought it before the grace period.
When you're buying a piece of software, you're buying it as it is on that very moment. It will not stop working because a new version is released.

You can't expect a company to stop selling their current product because they know a newer version is coming.

It's just bad luck. Same with people who buy something at full price and the next day it goes on sale. Bad luck.
This would hold water if they hadn't done the liquidation sale knowing damn well it was for an (undisclosed) end-of-updates version. That's not bad luck on the customer side-- it is a calculated screw.

Yeah on top of that they knew people are suffer from pandemic. Their hubris for not even exhibiting spirit of compassion for those “baited” customers is somewhat mind boggling. I thought they were better than that. It’s sure Old ableton would have handled and executed better. They have changed.

tooneba · Post by **tooneba** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 am

Haha nice cynical comment. I remembert Pennywise was always with balloon like he were not harmful.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:45 am

tooneba wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 amHaha nice cynical comment.

No, I'm just getting old and realistic. And prbably bitter. Go find my comment in proper Live 11 thread to see they knew Live 11 is coming already in June 2019, when internal / private beta started. As @SLiC pointed out, we've been let in at 18th(!) iteration. That's just life

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:05 am

Is it more expensive to update from 9 to 11 than from 10 to 11?

Having a price dependant on how far back you are updating from (like Cubase) would seem to solve these problems.

PieBerger · Post by **PieBerger** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:18 am

SLiC wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:05 am Is it more expensive to update from 9 to 11 than from 10 to 11?

Having a price dependant on how far back you are updating from (like Cubase) would seem to solve these problems.

No it's the same AFAIK. One could choose to be bitter about that too, but again what's the point, Ableton can never be fair to all users all of the time, we just have to be grownups about it and accept that this is their model and we can choose to play along with it or move along. BWS upgrade path doesn't give me warm fuzzies but I accept that's how they choose to run their business and that it's a model that does work for a lot of people, it costs more in the long run but they generally add more features, so it's a fair tradeoff, just not something I see myself wanting a part of.

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:48 am

It is a weird model for software in general having the same upgrade price irrespective of how close you are to the current version, but ultimately people vote with their wallets (FYI I updated from my 6 month old Live 10 to 11 as I though there was value in it- I bought L10 in a sale after it had been out 3 years, I knew wat was coming!)

Its the same with Arturia, NI, iZotope, IK etc case in point, I have 2 V collection licences, one at V2 and one at V6...the cost to upgrade to V7 is $99 for either of them- one gets we 3 new instruments, one gets me 20! IK had a shirt storm with new Amplitude pricing A4 Max to A 5MAX same price as a new user!

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:36 am

zerocrossing wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:53 pmAs a teenager working in retail I once had a woman who wanted the sale price on a tennis racket that she had purchased 8 months before the sale.

The default rule is that if you're paying more than any other person has ever paid under any other circumstances, then you should be entitled to a discount. Everyone knows that.

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:37 am

antic604 wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:45 am
tooneba wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 amHaha nice cynical comment.
No, I'm just getting old and realistic. And prbably bitter. Go find my comment in proper Live 11 thread to see they knew Live 11 is coming already in June 2019, when internal / private beta started.

FWIW, June is probably when alphas started.

https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/differenc ... a-testing/

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:40 am

SLiC wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 9:48 am It is a weird model for software in general having the same upgrade price irrespective of how close you are to the current version

It doesnt cost them any less to develop just because you bought it more recently.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:45 am

whyterabbyt wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:37 am
antic604 wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:45 am
tooneba wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 amHaha nice cynical comment.
No, I'm just getting old and realistic. And prbably bitter. Go find my comment in proper Live 11 thread to see they knew Live 11 is coming already in June 2019, when internal / private beta started.
FWIW, June is probably when alphas started.

https://www.geeksforgeeks.org/differenc ... a-testing/

It says "beta" in the document that's opened following that link, but it's entirely possible - almost certain - that its content changed over time. Anyway it's irrelevant which name it had. It was clear it's gonna be 11. I was quite surprised getting beta on the day of announcement, that there were already several pages of FR, many with few pages of comments already, too.

Again, it's not surprising the tests started earlier, but I was a little surprised how much earlier they started. That's it

EDIT: oh, and bye in case I'm banned! I was supposed to not write "one character" in this thread, but I simply replied to a notification without looking where it came from

WasteLand · Post by **WasteLand** » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:46 am

antic604 wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:45 am
tooneba wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 amHaha nice cynical comment.
No, I'm just getting old and realistic. And prbably bitter. Go find my comment in proper Live 11 thread to see they knew Live 11 is coming already in June 2019, when internal / private beta started. As @SLiC pointed out, we've been let in at 18th(!) iteration. That's just life

it seems quite normal to start that early, i think every brand has alpha's, and a roadmap, they do not implemented everything they already got (in some state). also choices are made, not only for the roadmap.

to develop a new version of DAW, takes time. any program, if you buy the latest version, there are already some people that are working on the next things, of course. not all pass.

of course roadmaps can change, choices aren't always logical (managers..), and i believe every brand sets a global roadmap. to put all in one new version, how to sell the next version?

but back to development, june 2019 isn't that soon, in a way, it is extremely fast.

EDIT: a year, or somewhat more than a year, is pretty fast. for alpha to beta. or fast, it isn't extreme, not a whole team can do it, there is still version 10.. that slowed down... so...

and they were working on cubase 11 begin this year, and i think even before, alpha, roadmaps, ideas. etc. etc. programming isn't the only thing, to think what is next, and when, there are also comercial reasons..

only thing, with ableton you can't really predict the new version, as with bitwig. cubase has a steady release, every year, november, full or .5 version.
reason is also unpredictable. as reaper.. don't know about studio one, or other DAW's.

Live 11 - Many bitter comments on their Facebook