Vital - Released

[BONES]

The clipping is an issue, Bones, is not because of the DAW, but because many many plugins do not like >0db signal coming into their inputs. If I put Vital in front of any reverb that I use (Blackhole, Reaktor 6Rev, Seventh Heaven Pro) and most of the compressors that I use, like Silika, clip like crazy.

What host are you using? I've never had a problem like that with Orion, Cubase or Studio One. Mind you, the first thing I do whenever I add anything to Studio One is to turn it down to -12dB, because defaulting to zero is just plain stupid. S1 itself even does it if you D'n'D a MIDI file in and get it to add the default GM instruments, to -10dB. So why they default to 0 when you add your own instrument is somewhat beyond my understanding. To be clear, that's all about mixing, the need to have plenty of headroom to turn up a quiet instrument/track, not because I've had a problem with clipping. I suppose it's because I am used to Orion always leaving plenty of headroom - I think it's default is -18dB or something similar.

But gainstaging is absolutely central to my workflow (as it ought to be)

With infinite headroom and no noise floor, I consider gain staging to be an anachronism when working ITB and if I demo'd a plugin that clipped when I put a hot signal into it, I would not buy or use that plugin.

in which case I'd love a master gain setting in the synth like, say, the one in Kontakt.

Pretty much every synth I own has a master gain control. Vital certainly does.

The filters sound completely different, as well as the EQ being obviously entirely different. Serum sounds tight/compact and Vital loose and thinner.

Not in that video. I've never heard any Serum stuff that made me think it was worth even downloading the demo. It's just another synth like a whole load of other synths I already own. Nothing at all special about it and, in that demo video, I honestly thought the Vital patch was very slightly nicer but so close that it didn't really matter at all. To be fair, I was only using my $80 headphones at work but, the thing is, if you need a serious pair of headphones to really tell the difference, then there is not much difference.

[BONES]

Every commenter is equipped with different types and qualities of:
cables
speakers
headphones
audio interface
room acoustics
audio config settings
personal hearing loss
knowledge of sounds and sound design
knowledge of music terminology and genres

I fail to see how that matters when making a direct comparison, given that the comparison will be made on the same equipment by each of us. That said, if something sounds great on some systems and lousy on others, then I'd be tempted to class it as lousy overall, because I think one of the most important qualities of an instrument should be its ability to be consistent across a wide variety of set-ups.

Test = Waste of time

I do testing all the time. It helps me to work out in my head why I do or don't particularly like any given instrument and what it might be suited to. e.g. I was really enthusiastic about Hive when I first got it but after a few months I had pretty much stopped using it altogether. Some months later again, I put it into a couple of little tests I was doing, expecting it would hold its own, but it was actually one of the worst I tested. I've included it in accouple of other tests since then and found the same each time - it takes a lot more effort to get Hive to do things other synths do more easily and Hive's results are usually worse into the bargain. OTOH, when I try Union in a test, even when I expect it to be way out of it's depth, it always manages to hold its own.

[liquidsound]

The following sentence of mine made clear the previous was sarcastic (I guess you got it).
The only software I never tested before buying a plugin was Omnisphere.
I don't regret it.

With Hive I experienced the same thing. Maybe one day it will click.

[Noumena]

It is not the host, bones, but subsequent effects. You can’t have both infinite headroom and dynamics in your effects chain. Things have tolerances for their inputs, ie the importance of gain staging. If you haven’t run across that you might not be mixing in a way that involves much dynamic range. Your releases speak to that possibility. And by master output attenuation I mean master, as in global, not altered by presets. Kontakt and some other samplers have this... because, among other reasons, polyphony and output gain relate.

[BONES]

You're just typing words, they have no relationship with anything I have experienced over the last 20 years of working ITB. The one and only place I have ever experienced unwanted clipping (as opposed to clipping by design) is between my software and the hardware I/O device it runs through. As long as I don't run hot into that, things just get as loud as they can get, without consequence.

Kontakt has a level control because it's a framework within which you run instruments. Of course, every instrument has a master gain control via the mixer, which will allow you to listen to all the presets in an instrument at an appropriate volume. It seems to me you are just manufacturing issues out of thin air.

The only software I never tested before buying a plugin was Omnisphere.

I don't mean trying the demo, I mean setting up an experiment and putting a handful of synths through it to see how they go. I do it with synths I already own, some that I've been using for years. When I demo a synth, I mostly just listen to the presets and try to make a squelchy bassline from scratch. If I like the former and am happy with the latter, I'll usually buy it.

With Hive I experienced the same thing. Maybe one day it will click.

I wonder if maybe Hive 1.2 was OK but Hive 2 isn't as good, as I bought it just a few weeks before v2 was released. It seems unlikely, although I certainly don't like the look or layout of v2 as much.

[liquidsound]

I don't mean trying the demo, I mean setting up an experiment and putting a handful of synths through it to see how they go. I do it with synths I already own, some that I've been using for years. When I demo a synth, I mostly just listen to the presets and try to make a squelchy bassline from scratch. If I like the former and am happy with the latter, I'll usually buy it.

Definitely.
When I can, or have the time, I try to get a track going with the new plugin or use it in an old track and see what’s bringing to the table.
Beside being fun, it becomes an immersive time restricted learning experience.

[Dalle]

So what's the recommended oversampling setting?

The one that sounds best to you.

[VELLTONE MUSIC]

Today spend another 5 min with Vital and already knocking on the fan club front door,amazed how easy make modern sound with few turns,comparison Vital vs Serum seems pointless to me,still can't force myself to like Serum enough so to buy and use it.
If 7 years and literally few thousands sound design hours matters as opinion somehow anyway....

[RexBanner]

How do you import a lot of presets in a batch? I have them as individual presets, not a bank.

[mtytel]

How do you import a lot of presets in a batch? I have them as individual presets, not a bank.

You can just put them in your Vital folder in a "Presets" directory.

[Teksonik]

So what's the recommended oversampling setting?

Vital 120720-1.png

[liquidsound]

So what's the recommended oversampling setting?

Vital 120720-1.png

[fisherKing]

So what's the recommended oversampling setting?

Vital 120720-1.png

too many variables. a lot depends on your computer, your DAW. one thing you can do: set it as high as you can before you have issues (overloads, etc). but a better thing is to keep it at 2x, or 4x... and if you're absolutely convinced it sounds better higher... set it higher just when you bounce out your track.

[Teksonik]

I'd go with what the developer recommends. He felt strong enough about it to put it right on the GUI.

[mrsugmad]

Today Plugin Guru went through Vital and showed some tips and tricks:

He will be creating new patches for Vital and Unify; Can't wait !

Anyone else watch this?