Tal J-8

[zvenx]

But he did. A page or two ago.

Edit: quite a few pages ago by now
viewtopic.php?p=7974788#p7974788

Rsp

[revvy]

Hasn't convinced ED has he.

[zvenx]

Nope . Hopefully his friends' Jupiter 8 may do so.
rsp

[Teksonik]

I figured it out. You need to go from DUAL to WHOLE, and then select either LOWER or UPPER depending on what part you want to solo.

Ahh that's it. Thanks.

[AnX]

I'm pretty sure Alan Wilder used a Jupiter 8 in his very early days with DM, might be interesting to recreate some of those sounds

edit: live.... can see it here clearly, but its on quite a few other vids too

[revvy]

Nope . Hopefully his friends' Jupiter 8 may do so.
rsp

Ah yes, let's bring in a dude from GS, that'll help clarify things

[Teksonik]

because of how polyphony works in J-8 (if you have 8 voices of poly set, and you go to Dual mode, you basically double your CPU usage because now you have 16 voice poly max, whereas RC Jupiter works exactly as original, and halves the 8 voice poly into 2x4 in this case).

I'd much prefer to have the 16 voice poly for Dual sounds rather than 2x4 voices.

I'd ask TAL not to change this behavior because as mentioned you can do a simple change if you want to limit the poly.

This is where J-8 wins for me. It is possible to layer 4 VCO oscillators for some huge pads and poly synth sounds and still get enough poly voices to actually play the patch with some nice big chords (or simple chords and a lead)

Exactly.

[waltercruz]

Well, and Roland Cloud is still a CPU killer...

Interesting because I can get J-8 to use way way more CPU, because of how polyphony works in J-8 (if you have 8 voices of poly set, and you go to Dual mode, you basically double your CPU usage because now you have 16 voice poly max, whereas RC Jupiter works exactly as original, and halves the 8 voice poly into 2x4 in this case).

You are using windows, right? Maybe it's not yet properly optmized on mac? Just sitting idle, playing nothing:

[chk071]

Hasn't convinced ED has he.

How are VCO's supposed to stay in phase when you are playing a couple of notes? That doesn't make sense, that's why I wonder why it would be happening on a Jupiter-8.

Unless I completely misunderstood how VCO's are working. I always thought they WERE free-running.

See this is really not against the synth, or against TAL (as you seem to suspect), it's just something which some people rightly scratch their head about.

[dermage]

Hasn't convinced ED has he.

How are VCO's supposed to stay in phase when you are playing a couple of notes? That doesn't make sense, that's why I wonder why it would be happening on a Jupiter-8.

Unless I completely misunderstood how VCO's are working. I always thought they WERE free-running.

See this is really not against the synth, or against TAL (as you seem to suspect), it's just something which some people rightly scratch their head about.

In my understanding there are options like in DIVA, where you can set them to reset the phase on the next note trigger. (That's the more digital way) Or have them run independently from opening the synth (more like Repro)
I'm not sure if this is possible in Diva to have them running all the time, but at least they're free running when triggered (probably random phase) when the reset phase is off.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

But he did. A page or two ago.

Edit: quite a few pages ago by now
viewtopic.php?p=7974788#p7974788

Rsp

And his response was:

"I tried this with my Jupiter 8 and it is the same. But i wasn't able to set the detune knob exactly to zero. So it starts to drift away when removing the sync. I will make some more tests..."

So what we're saying here actually does line up with Patrick's hardware. You can't get the two osc's perfectly in tune in the hardware with no sync, and the second you take sync off they start to drift away.

None of that contradicts ED. I'm all for making this more accurate. And it sounds great as is. Could perhaps be a bit more authentic.

[zvenx]

Hasn't convinced ED has he.

How are VCO's supposed to stay in phase when you are playing a couple of notes? That doesn't make sense, that's why I wonder why it would be happening on a Jupiter-8.

Unless I completely misunderstood how VCO's are working. I always thought they WERE free-running.

See this is really not against the synth, or against TAL (as you seem to suspect), it's just something which some people rightly scratch their head about.

I forgot. How did we determine that if you play a chord that the oscillators are indeed in sync?
rsp

[revvy]

Hasn't convinced ED has he.

How are VCO's supposed to stay in phase when you are playing a couple of notes? That doesn't make sense, that's why I wonder why it would be happening on a Jupiter-8.

Unless I completely misunderstood how VCO's are working. I always thought they WERE free-running.

See this is really not against the synth, or against TAL (as you seem to suspect), it's just something which some people rightly scratch their head about.

Not really claiming it's against TAL, I'm simply just not smart enough to come to my own conclusion on this matter so I hope the heavyweights can sort it out and I can just enjoy the accurate results. The idea of ED taking this up with Patrick in private is a good one IMO

[zvenx]

But he did. A page or two ago.

Edit: quite a few pages ago by now
viewtopic.php?p=7974788#p7974788

Rsp

And his response was:

"I tried this with my Jupiter 8 and it is the same. But i wasn't able to set the detune knob exactly to zero. So it starts to drift away when removing the sync. I will make some more tests..."

So what we're saying here actually does line up with Patrick's hardware. You can't get the two osc's perfectly in tune in the hardware with no sync, and the second you take sync off they start to drift away.

None of that contradicts ED. I'm all for making this more accurate. And it sounds great as is. Could perhaps be a bit more authentic.

I would like to remind you of something I said PAGESSSS ago..
let me find it and add it here.

They are free running oscillators, which do not reset with note on, and their instabilities have been modeled.
Of course in the digital world you can tune them to have the same pitch and instabilities.

rsp

That was me paraphrasing Patrick's words.
What it seems to all mean is that the Zero Detune is a digital only (that is software) only reality...
So is it he should remove Zero Detune on the software since the Hardware seems to not be able to do that?

That is the behaviour of the modeled Oscillators are indeed correct but that a Detune of Zero that is available on the software is not at all physically possible on the hardware (without sync mode enabled)
rsp

[e-crooner]

Maybe it is my hearing, but I also hear some sort of high-pitched trill sub-tone, particularly on higher notes. It has nothing to do with the detune issue because I can also hear it when listening to 100% of one oscillator.
I suppose one could see some sort of ripples on an analyzer plugin, which I don't have, though.

I downloaded a spectrum analyzer plugin and found out what it is.
I sent J-8 as well as Retrologue and Repro 5 through it (same note on the 5th octave, single saw wave, no modulation, effects etc.) and noticed that all those gain bars are vibrating all the time, while with the other two synths they are static.
Not sure if it is intended or not, or whether the original hardware behaved like that as well. Maybe a new level of emulation?