Why did you leave Studio One?

[antic604]

People who completely ignore this topic about slicing and mangling around with loops miss a huge creative potential with such great results one could hardly come up with on his own...
There is so much potential in advanced usage of loops (and I don´t mean messing around with just a single but many loops) with so many "happy little accidents" ... once you know how, you´ll never stop!!

Agreed. I'm ashamed to say this, but I only recently started to use samples & loops more, having focused on MIDI too much in the past. It's a lot of fun and - as you said - leads to so many creative & happy accidents!

But more on-topic - what's exactly wrong with S1's transient detection algorithms? Or stretching algorithms for that matter? Is it the lack of more "creative" algorithms like Live or Bitwig have?

[Trancit]

...
But more on-topic - what's exactly wrong with S1's transient detection algorithms? Or stretching algorithms for that matter? Is it the lack of more "creative" algorithms like Live or Bitwig have?

For me, it always worked quite well...
No automatic transient detection is perfect and often have to be finetuned depending on the source material...
The included timestretch is ok but lacks of course of variety... it´s already ridiculous that they needed more than 10 years to finally implement a tape stretch mode not to speak of other creative modes Bitwig or Ableton got...
Finally what S1 completely lacks of is something similar to Ableton´s Beat mode, Bitwigs Slice or FL Studio´s Slice Map...
So syncing especially drum/percussion loops which sound mostly silly when timestretched is (for me) too old school...
But this is a desease all the major DAW´s got compared to the creative ones...

To me it seems some DAWs were made only by one type of music interested programmer... DAWs like S1/Cubase/Logic...etc... are made by traditional music interested and lack heavily of creative tools while something like Bitwig/Ableton/FL Studio are too focused on the creative part and lack of many advanced arranging and mixing stuff...

Why can´t just a developer come up with a great hybrid FrankenDAW which got more focused on the important features of both worlds...??

[ReleaseCandidate]

Why can´t just a developer come up with a great hybrid FrankenDAW which got more focused on the important features of both worlds...??

That's what I thought S1 is, but it isn't and so I left
Still Live and Bitwig for me.

[dellboy]

Why can´t just a developer come up with a great hybrid FrankenDAW which got more focused on the important features of both worlds...??

Digital Performer on the PC and Logic Pro on the Mac are beginning to fill that role with clip recording and launching now included in both of them.

[antic604]

Finally what S1 completely lacks of is something similar to Ableton´s Beat mode, Bitwigs Slice or FL Studio´s Slice Map... So syncing especially drum/percussion loops which sound mostly silly when timestretched is (for me) too old school...

In Audio Bend you can slice the loop at transients, then select all events, quantize them and set them to follow tempo (not timestretch). This way the slices - drum hits - will always be in time but never time-stretched (I'm changing tempo when cursor goes off screen):

To me it seems some DAWs were made only by one type of music interested programmer... DAWs like S1/Cubase/Logic...etc... are made by traditional music interested and lack heavily of creative tools while something like Bitwig/Ableton/FL Studio are too focused on the creative part and lack of many advanced arranging and mixing stuff...

I actually find Reason and Studio One to be the closest, with a hypothetical hybrid of the two being the ideal we're looking for. Reason has all the modular stuff that Bitwig or Live do, but also has proper comping, exceptionally good time-stretching, good MIDI tools, pitch correction; Studio One compared to say Cubase has really powerful on-channel tools for splitting the signal to make parallel, mid/side or multi-band processing and what I only misses is some native modulation system.

[antic604]

That's what I thought S1 is, but it isn't and so I left
Still Live and Bitwig for me.

How are Live + Bitwig together a hybrid, though?

[ReleaseCandidate]

That's what I thought S1 is, but it isn't and so I left
Still Live and Bitwig for me.

How are Live + Bitwig together a hybrid, though?

They aren't (yet), that's why I tried other DAWs some months ago.

[pdxindy]

People who completely ignore this topic about slicing and mangling around with loops miss a huge creative potential with such great results one could hardly come up with on his own...
There is so much potential in advanced usage of loops (and I don´t mean messing around with just a single but many loops) with so many "happy little accidents" ... once you know how, you´ll never stop!!

Everyone should enjoy what they want to do. If someone is into slicing and mangling loops, great... it holds no interest for me.

One thing, if I couldn't come up with it on my own, that means it is not mine and I'm only using someone else's energy. Not speaking for anyone else, but I would not find that satisfying.

Second thing, I never run out of creative energy to do my own new and unique sounds and rhythms. That is plenty of potential that I have no need to look elsewhere.

[Trancit]

...One thing, if I couldn't come up with it on my own, that means it is not mine and I'm only using someone else's energy. Not speaking for anyone else, but I would not find that satisfying.
...

One question: Do you use samples??? Kick, Snares, Hats...etc... if the answer is yes than it´s not any different to the technique I meant...

[pdxindy]

...One thing, if I couldn't come up with it on my own, that means it is not mine and I'm only using someone else's energy. Not speaking for anyone else, but I would not find that satisfying.
...

One question: Do you use samples??? Kick, Snares, Hats...etc... if the answer is yes than it´s not any different to the technique I meant...

Hey, you are the one who said that slicing and mangling loops was different than using drum samples and that it has "huge creative potential"... That was the whole point of your post I quoted... now you are saying the opposite?

In either case, I have no interest in slicing loops and am happy with using sampled drum hits, whether included from some plugin or ones I made myself + live drum synthesis.

[ReleaseCandidate]

...One thing, if I couldn't come up with it on my own, that means it is not mine and I'm only using someone else's energy. Not speaking for anyone else, but I would not find that satisfying.
...

One question: Do you use samples??? Kick, Snares, Hats...etc... if the answer is yes than it´s not any different to the technique I meant...

Hey, you are the one who said that slicing and mangling loops was different than using drum samples and that it has "huge creative potential"... That was the whole point of your post I quoted... now you are saying the opposite?

The point is that you are using samples created and edited by somebody else. And your argument against slicing is that people who slice their own samples are less creative than you.
There is nothing wrong with using 'premade' samples, don't get me wrong. But you can't accuse other people of 'using the energy of somebody else'.

[Trancit]

Hey, you are the one who said that slicing and mangling loops was different than using drum samples and that it has "huge creative potential"... That was the whole point of your post I quoted... now you are saying the opposite?

In either case, I have no interest in slicing loops and am happy with using sampled drum hits, whether included from some plugin or ones I made myself + live drum synthesis.

That´s because you don´t know how it works...

It´s somehow different but very creative and as unique as using pure samples... it´s magic... and it leads you much quicker to much more interesting results with the same possibility that somebody else comes to the same result like with using samples on their own...

[Trancit]

In Audio Bend you can slice the loop at transients, then select all events, quantize them and set them to follow tempo (not timestretch). This way the slices - drum hits - will always be in time but never time-stretched (I'm changing tempo when cursor goes off screen):

I know how this works in S1 but this is what I meant with oldschool...
Abletons Beat mode is far quicker and can be used more creative...

I actually find Reason and Studio One to be the closest, with a hypothetical hybrid of the two being the ideal we're looking for. Reason has all the modular stuff that Bitwig or Live do, but also has proper comping, exceptionally good time-stretching, good MIDI tools, pitch correction; Studio One compared to say Cubase has really powerful on-channel tools for splitting the signal to make parallel, mid/side or multi-band processing and what I only misses is some native modulation system.

Meh,... Reason got the worst sequencer I ever came across with and is far to cumbersome with all it´s routings...
I talked about the BEST of both worlds...

[pdxindy]

...One thing, if I couldn't come up with it on my own, that means it is not mine and I'm only using someone else's energy. Not speaking for anyone else, but I would not find that satisfying.
...

One question: Do you use samples??? Kick, Snares, Hats...etc... if the answer is yes than it´s not any different to the technique I meant...

Hey, you are the one who said that slicing and mangling loops was different than using drum samples and that it has "huge creative potential"... That was the whole point of your post I quoted... now you are saying the opposite?

The point is that you are using samples created and edited by somebody else. And your argument against slicing is that people who slice their own samples are less creative than you.
There is nothing wrong with using 'premade' samples, don't get me wrong. But you can't accuse other people of 'using the energy of somebody else'.

I didn't say a single thing about others... I specifically stated I was only talking about myself... twice I stated that.

So you don't need to get outraged. We can each have different interests and viewpoints and the world will be fine

[pdxindy]

That´s because you don´t know how it works...

Or maybe I do and we simply have different interests.