Reason+ = subscription model (20€ month)

[briefcasemanx]

This is from Synthanatomy:
“However, every Reason user can take a deep breath. Reason Studios uses a bi-system. You can choose between a perpetual license or take the subscription train. RS doesn’t force customers to take out a subscription model like Adobe. That’s very good. Thus, Reason + is just a second business idea of the company and not a complete change. Don’t panic.”

It is a complete change, in that their highest paying top tier customers that paid $600 for super old software that's too small to be readable on modern displays now don't have an upgrade path that makes any monetary sense. Their intro customers have no cheap option upgrade path into features or RE's.

Taking advantage of your best customers, unless there is a monopoly or near monopoly (which Reason doesn't have), isn't a good sign of long-term health for a business. Moves like this without the leverage to back them up are signs of mismanagement.

Short of a change of course, buying anything from Reason Studios in the short term is ill-advised if you want software to be an investment that will hopefully last into the future at least a few years.

[JonSolo]

Yes...these are exactly my fears.

Understand, I have been a fanboy of PH's for a LONG time. I have recommended and defended them many times. Even in their most feeble of times (all recent years) I have defended their actions. Saying that they have a "bi-system" is not relevant because their original formula is COMPLETELY gone.

The most powerful thing I have read here was someone mentioning that Reason will stand on its DAW capabilities alone. This is what I fear. Like I said, Nuendo is my primary DAW (Live is my secondary). I have always used Reason through ReWire. It has been a fantastic tool when used this way. It is why I keep older versions of Reason on my machine.

When that dropped, they gave us a plugin that was inferior to ReWire. I should have seen this coming. Sad.

[zoidkirb]

Ideally Reason Standard should be only feature upgrades, and Reason Suite would be that plus big content upgrades.
Unfortunately Suite competes too well against the value of the new subscription so it gets the cut.

[DJBuddhaBear]

Yes...these are exactly my fears.

Understand, I have been a fanboy of PH's for a LONG time. I have recommended and defended them many times. Even in their most feeble of times (all recent years) I have defended their actions. Saying that they have a "bi-system" is not relevant because their original formula is COMPLETELY gone.

The most powerful thing I have read here was someone mentioning that Reason will stand on its DAW capabilities alone. This is what I fear. Like I said, Nuendo is my primary DAW (Live is my secondary). I have always used Reason through ReWire. It has been a fantastic tool when used this way. It is why I keep older versions of Reason on my machine.

When that dropped, they gave us a plugin that was inferior to ReWire. I should have seen this coming. Sad.

I have to agree. The rack plugin is inferior to ReWire. My main DAW's were Studio One & Live on PC. Switching now back to Mac it will be Logic Pro going forward predominantly. I have been with Propellerheads since day one. I fear that Reason will go the way of Opcode for me. I invested years & money into Opcode & then it was just gone. I don't imagine them keeping a "standard" version around for long. Subscriptions is the way software is going & has been going now for some time.

I find myself now quite hesitant to invest further into RE's. I am sure I am not alone in this which means fewer developers will stick around & continue to produce quality RE's. I have the added question of whether V11 will ever support Apple Silicon natively with V12 due out later in the year. So if I want to continue to use Reason, I will have to upgrade to V12. For now, I am on a wait & see going forward.

[festeringheap]

Upgrade from Reason 11 suite is only to Reason 12 standard. Hopefully Friktion is included.

According to the moderator on today's Reason+ Livestream, no new modules will be provided to perpetual license holders through upgrades. The only way to get these is to pay for them or subscribe to them separately.

According to their blog today, devices are included, as well the workflow enhancements.
https://www.reasonstudios.com/blog/intr ... eason-plus
Yes, we are working on a major update to Reason to come later this year that will include high resolution graphics, workflow enhancements and some new devices, too. We’ll price it similarly to how we have before for the perpetual license owners. Reason+ subscribers gain immediate access upon release.

[antic604]

Let's think about it like this. Reason Suite is comparable in to Ableton Live Suite in-terms of goal. Now imagine Ableton Live 11 (non-suite) came out and all the Ableton 10 suite stuff was included but you need a sub to get something equivalent to Ableton Live Suite going forward. That's pretty shady and disconcerting imo. Especially since you paid extra for the extra content and plugins that is now selling for lower (which is fine) but to get the "real" suite upgrade you need a sub.

But that's a completely wrong analogy. WIth Reason, even if you'd upgrade to 12 Standard, you'll still get to keep all the extra things that made your 11 Suite special. You don't have to get the "+" for that.

Your analogy only makes sense if your ambition is "I want to have the best version always" which indeed means that from 11 Suite you should upgrade to 12+, but that's just ego problem

[k-tronix]

Upgrade from Reason 11 suite is only to Reason 12 standard. Hopefully Friktion is included.

According to the moderator on today's Reason+ Livestream, no new modules will be provided to perpetual license holders through upgrades. The only way to get these is to pay for them or subscribe to them separately.

According to their blog today, devices are included, as well the workflow enhancements.
https://www.reasonstudios.com/blog/intr ... eason-plus
Yes, we are working on a major update to Reason to come later this year that will include high resolution graphics, workflow enhancements and some new devices, too. We’ll price it similarly to how we have before for the perpetual license owners. Reason+ subscribers gain immediate access upon release.

Thanks for doing the homework I should have. This means that I can come off the ledge, at least for now. Too bad they didn’t make this clear during the livestream—they certainly had enough time.

[v1o]

Kinda weird when someone with ~2700 posts says they're gonna cancel their THREE SEPARATE SUBSCRIPTIONS that I can't find them ever talking about using the search function. Subscriptions that contain MILLIONS of sounds and loops curated over many years, that they'll magically replace with Reason+, a brand new service that has nowhere near the selection of the THREE SUBSCRIPTION SERVICES the user apparently pays for, but comes with a DAW (which does not factor into the users decision to buy these subscriptions because they already own and upgrade the Reason DAW).

Quite strange. I look forward to seeing more of this users completely baffling defenses of this dumpster fire.

You sound like you got annoyed with someone because they're happy about Reason+.

[antic604]

Too bad they didn’t make this clear during the livestream—they certainly had enough time.

They made it clear from the start.

There are 2 ways of getting Reason now:

• perpetual, i.e. traditional way: you buy Reason upgrades when they're out (that will include new features, some new devices and new sound content), you buy REs and refills; you "own" all of it forever
• "+" subscription: you pay $/EUR/GBP20 / month and you always get the newest Reason version + all Reason Studios' REs (maybe some 3rd party REs, too) + weekly soundpacks; you can obviously buy 3rd party REs, too. When you stop paying, you only keep access to stuff you bought in a perpetual/traditional way, which includes 11 Suite extra devices

It's really simple.

[v1o]

I have been with Reason a long time. Since v1. The impetus for upgrading Reason is always new features...but also new Racks...I mean THIS IS REASON! If you think it is just for new features and improvements, clearly you have been using Reason only since V7.

Like I said, the page that discussed Suite including new devices is gone. They stated that would be the path to include new Reason Studio Racks moving forward (as well as the plugin) and that Reason non-Suite would only include features and improvements to the DAW.

Reason is not my main DAW and never has been. Nuendo is and will probably always be that. Because I don't use Reason as my main DAW is why I am disappointed in my upgrade path really being downgraded. I have no use for a standalone DAW in Reason. The Racks were worth their digital space in Bitcoins. Still are...but with no upgrade path moving forward to expand that...

Disappointing.

(Of course I can still buy Racks. That is not the point. They destroyed my upgrade path that they JUST created...stupid of them.)

Ok I didn't see the webpage you were talking about before it got taken down. Now that you mention you mainly use the RRP inside Nuendo, it makes more sense why your incentive for upgrading was new devices. Buying new REs gets very expensive. A single RS rack extension synth costs about the same as the £99 annual Reason+ subscription. So its cheaper to subscribe to get all new devices they will make. You won't gain ownership of new devices with the subscription, but since rack extensions have zero resale value anyway you won't be losing much either.

[briefcasemanx]

Kinda weird when someone with ~2700 posts says they're gonna cancel their THREE SEPARATE SUBSCRIPTIONS that I can't find them ever talking about using the search function. Subscriptions that contain MILLIONS of sounds and loops curated over many years, that they'll magically replace with Reason+, a brand new service that has nowhere near the selection of the THREE SUBSCRIPTION SERVICES the user apparently pays for, but comes with a DAW (which does not factor into the users decision to buy these subscriptions because they already own and upgrade the Reason DAW).

Quite strange. I look forward to seeing more of this users completely baffling defenses of this dumpster fire.

You sound like you got annoyed with someone because they're happy about Reason+.

I sound like I got annoyed with someone because they posted something really, really fishy.

[Lazarus451]

Too bad they didn’t make this clear during the livestream—they certainly had enough time.

They made it clear from the start.

There are 2 ways of getting Reason now:

• perpetual, i.e. traditional way: you buy Reason upgrades when they're out (that will include new features, some new devices and new sound content), you buy REs and refills; you "own" all of it forever
• "+" subscription: you pay $/EUR/GBP20 / month and you always get the newest Reason version + all Reason Studios' REs (maybe some 3rd party REs, too) + weekly soundpacks; you can obviously buy 3rd party REs, too. When you stop paying, you only keep access to stuff you bought in a perpetual/traditional way, which includes 11 Suite extra devices

It's really simple.

If it would be simple it would mean that suite 11 owners can get everything but the sounds in the next upgrade. If you have to a) pay 120€? for upgrade to 12 standard and in addition also buy some individual devices to upgrade to full 12, or b) subscribe to the Reason+, I think they will lose a big part of their loyal userbase. Not because I'm angry, but because I really do.

And for me my suite devices are not "extra devices", suite devices are suite devices.

[MuzikFreq]

So..... anyone afraid of them losing users..... their login is down and can't use the software lol
I don't think they were ready for this

[kgbrolic]

Suite can now go on the scrap heap along with Alihoopa, Ignition, Balance, Europa VST and Reason Compact. Maybe + will go there too in a few years time.

Add Record and Recycle to that list..

[AnX]

ReDundant