KVR Audio

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Oct 22, 2020 11:47 am

Yeah, same for me. Even though I consider skipping the update all along, and wait what K14 brings. The only things I'm really interested in K13 are Super 8 and Noire, and, both are not really necessary, so, I guess I rather wait.

pixel85 · Post by **pixel85** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:15 pm

Who did the new NI Survey?

I got a strong feeling from this survey that they're looking at how many people is willing to go for the subscription model.
There's also an option to answer why we don't like purchase or subscription model.

For me, it's obvious that subscription will be the next thing coming from NI. As long as they offer me to purchase their products then I'm fine. I just hope they will not do anything ridiculous like a paywall to make people use the subscription.
If I'll see that eg. new modules in GR6 will be very expensive, or the next MX update (with stuff that should be there from version 1.0) will be paid, then I'll not buy anything more from them anymore.

gondii · Post by **gondii** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:37 pm

I wonder, how would you even transition to a subscription only model that is fair to existing customers? Would an owner of Komplete 13 Ultimate Collectors Edition be expected to pay as much as someone starting out? I sincerely hope that they are just "adding" a subscription as another option. Considering that the bundles can be relatively expensive, I think it would make sense. There are plenty of companies with that follow this model, like Melda, Kilohearts, Plugin Alliance... nothing wrong with that imo.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:41 pm

Where is that survey? I didn't get any email, or see anything on their site that would lead to a survey.

pixel85 · Post by **pixel85** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:50 pm

I'm pretty sure it will be both: purchase or subscription option.
Like I said, as long as they don't do a paywall like Slate for example, then it will be fine. A good option for new customers who like the subscription model. The new approach to Guitar Rig looks like the ideal thing for sub: get new amp/fx model every month for just x/month, get new browser in MX etc.
They also can do like Reason Studio with new samples/expansions every month.
I also hope that they will not go with quantity over quality philosophy just for a sake of having something new every month.

pixel85 · Post by **pixel85** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:52 pm

chk071 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:41 pm Where is that survey? I didn't get any email, or see anything on their site that would lead to a survey.

I got an email 3 days ago, titled "Your chance to win a KOMPLETE KONTROL keyboard".

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 5:14 pm

But... but... I want to win one as well.

Guess I wasn't even signed up for the newsletters. Although I'm sure I at least got some of them...

mumpcake · Post by **mumpcake** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 9:56 pm

I don't mind the Cakewalk/Bitwig model where you buy the product and any releases in the next 12 months are covered. Rent to own options make sense as well. "Keep paying or lose what you have" won't fly though.

glokraw · Post by **glokraw** » Sun Feb 14, 2021 11:01 pm

Cakewalk By Bandlab is free, and has been for a long time, with an impressive list of fixes and enhancements ongoing. They have their own solid funding. No subscriptions needed.

https://www.bandlab.com/products/cakewalk

Cheers

Spring Goose · Post by **Spring Goose** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:02 am

chk071 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 5:14 pm But... but... I want to win one as well.

Guess I wasn't even signed up for the newsletters. Although I'm sure I at least got some of them...

I'm signed up to the newsletters, and i didn't get an invite to the survey. Maybe the survey is only for people who bought 13.

clipnotic · Post by **clipnotic** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:05 am

They should bring Rent-to-own, because I would never just rent something.

Then they should change the "Komplete" description, because no bundle offers really everthing.

They also should add a bundle without their synths and FX, but with their orchestral, cinematic and sample instruments, because I still have enough synths and FX plugins. At the moment you have to buy the Komplete Ultimate Collector's Edition for 1.599 Euro, if you want all instruments with a discount, but for that price you can also buy much alternatives!

And you also get summer and other sales from other companies.

Finally, at the moment they are not offering anything I would pay for.

ralphsc · Post by **ralphsc** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:09 am

Right now I don't see a reason to update from Komplete 11. I'm afraid a subscription model will be the future, it just makes sense from a developer's perspective. Constant, predictable revenue. From the POV of the customer, on average, you pay more. For example I have an Adobe subscription and I feel like I've given them more money since they changed to this revenue model.
I'm surprised the DAW developers haven't done it yet... thankfully..

DJ Warmonger · Post by **DJ Warmonger** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:18 am

ralphsc wrote: ↑Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:09 am Right now I don't see a reason to update from Komplete 11. I'm afraid a subscription model will be the future, it just makes sense from a developer's perspective. Constant, predictable revenue. From the POV of the customer, on average, you pay more.
I'm surprised the DAW developers haven't done it yet... thankfully..

... and just where did you get this idea?

For once, I don't buy any subscriptions. There are always alternatives with permanent license.

For example I have an Adobe subscription and I feel like I've given them more money since they changed to this revenue model.

For my graphics-editing purposes I picked Affinity Photo + Designer

Affordable one-time purchase.

pixel85 · Post by **pixel85** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:30 am

ralphsc wrote: ↑Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:09 am Right now I don't see a reason to update from Komplete 11. I'm afraid a subscription model will be the future, it just makes sense from a developer's perspective. Constant, predictable revenue. From the POV of the customer, on average, you pay more. For example I have an Adobe subscription and I feel like I've given them more money since they changed to this revenue model.
I'm surprised the DAW developers haven't done it yet... thankfully..

Adobe has monopoly for Photoshop so they cwn do whatever they want. Of course there's free Krita (my alternative to PS) but it doesn't have all the functionalities of PS.
Audio developers need to have something special to offer. Unfortunately subscription in this case is tge best recipe for "quantity over quality". Bringing new plugins and samples just for the case of justification of paying every month.
Reason Studios is one example: $20/month for new samples every month. I can't imagine how it can satisfy people for longer period of time than a few months before tgey realize that they don't use 99% of those samples.
NI has only Maschine extensions to offer for current customers. New customers may not be so happy to see thqt majority of their software can't be scaled and doesn't have vst3 (so when everyone will jump to vst4, NI may still be on vst2) - I believe that this stuff is important for new young customers.

We will see what will happen. It looks like the future is all about renting/subs and owning nothing. For me it's a recipe for disaster but nobody cares about future anymore. Just another brick in the wall.

clipnotic · Post by **clipnotic** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:38 am

ralphsc wrote: ↑Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:09 am Right now I don't see a reason to update from Komplete 11. I'm afraid a subscription model will be the future, it just makes sense from a developer's perspective. Constant, predictable revenue. From the POV of the customer, on average, you pay more. For example I have an Adobe subscription and I feel like I've given them more money since they changed to this revenue model.
I'm surprised the DAW developers haven't done it yet... thankfully..

Subscription models are just working, if many people use them. As Adobe started with that for Photoshop, I stopped using it and meanwhile I have good alternatives. But Photoshop still is the industry standard, so they can still do it. But NI is not Adobe and there are much more alternatives for synths and sample libraries available.

Thankfully I'm using a "full download" DAW with lifetime updates since almost 20 years, but would they change to a only subscription model, I would also stop using it, also if it would be for free.

EDIT:
By the way, at the moment you can read good examples about problems with subscription / cloud based models in the Goodbye Roland Cloud thread!

Komplete 13, ladies and gents