When electronic music sounded new, like the future... what went wrong!

[vurt]

@ both of you. the issue is i can't let go of my ego. i have been trying to do it for decades. i cannot not care. i see no point to it anymore. there have been a few who have done it successfully, but it is so incredibly hard to let go of my rock and roll. the ableton crowd did it, good for them, i won't call them out, i know them as friends. i cannot personally let go of my ego. i need to rock. it's inside me.

are you high? like really, really f**king high?

make sense, once! i dare you!!

[dellboy]

@dellboy

you need to get to chiastic slide and earlier. a little after that they just started playing with the concept of sound as sound. i saw them in the later stages and they just blasted heavy metal clips at the audience. it was thought provoking, but almost intolerable. i think they were making a point. they were already bored a little beyond that.

OK, I just had a quick run through of "chiastic slide" .

Not my sort of thing.

Just a loop running through for a lot of it. And then in the middle it sounded like a sample of the theme music of the BBCs "Old Grey Whistle Test" was being played. Probably not. Just saying.

The funny thing is that I found a Youtube of a guy reviewing it who was a dead ringer of an underground "beatnik" from the 1950s. He could have been commenting on some obscure new funky jazz trio that you had to "get"- to get it. Nothing changes.

[Dasheesh]

yep, ems were those guys:

[Dasheesh]

the further we go into the "future", the more we regress. stop doing what you are told. make your music. if you don't have any practice we will all call you. we hear it. it's really not hard.

[donkey tugger]

Too much sinthesiser.

[vurt]

the further we go into the "future", the more we regress. stop doing what you are told. make your music. if you don't have any practice we will all call you. we hear it. it's really not hard.

who?

[Dasheesh]

i am not going to call bitches. obviously. that is not what men do.

[vurt]

i am not going to call bitches. obviously. that is not what men do.

but you said you were going to call people with no practice?

it would be nice to know who we are discussing.

[himalaya]

Reminds me of this old chestnut...

"I thought using loops was cheating, so I programmed my own using samples. I then thought using samples was cheating, so I recorded real drums. I then thought that programming it was cheating, so I learned to play drums for real. I then thought using bought drums was cheating, so I learned to make my own. I then thought using premade skins was cheating, so I killed a goat and skinned it. I then thought that that was cheating too, so I grew my own goat from a baby goat. I also think that is cheating, but I’m not sure where to go from here. I haven’t made any music lately, what with the goat farming and all."

That 'old chestnut' doesn't work. It's constructed on an awkward premise which aims to falsely create an equivalence between too many disparate items.

Items in category A:
A drum kit (ie: an instrument), a synth preset, a sample (of an instrument), programming beats and music yourself, is all about creating your own music.

Items in category B:
A pre-made music loop, a sample of a music melody or chord progression is music that is already created.

If the mission for you as a musician is to create your own, original music piece then you are good to use all the items from category A. This is how you will accomplish it. But if you also add items from category B, your music piece will no longer be exclusively original, as it will contain musical phrases created by somebody else. It's as simple as that.

Mind, this is not a value judgement one way or another. It's not about judging whether using pre-made loops is good or bad. It is simply about the differentiation, that, if your aim is to make music that comes exclusively from you, then presets, drum kits, programming in your DAW is all valid and these are in no way equivalent to using pre-made loops.

This should also release Dashseehs from his worries. You can use presets. Treat them as 'instruments'. You don't need to build an 'instrument' yourself in order to make music on it.

Having said all that, you are welcome to become a farmer and tend to your goats. Goat milk is apparently very healthy. This is the last category. Category FAAMNAJ (Failed As A Musician Need Another Job).

[vurt]

there's plenty of sampled looped based music that becomes more than a reuse of the loops.
there's creative use of loops as oppose to just dropping the loop on the track as is!!!

[himalaya]

there's plenty of sampled looped based music that becomes more than a reuse of the loops.
there's creative use of loops as oppose to just dropping the loop on the track as is!!!

Granted! I wasn't writing about this at all.
If you do as you propose, your music piece will no longer be exclusively your own as it will contain music created by others. Makes sense so far?

Even if you mangle the loops creatively beyond recognition, you know that your music is not wholly original, since it...contains music created by others. Even if you mangle it all creatively.

So! I'm not referring to how creative you are with somebody else's loops. I am writing this in context of somebody who wants to create original music all by themselves, without any music content created by others. This is where that 'old chestnut' falls apart because it equates using pre-made loops with presets or instruments. Which is just silly.

[I was actually expecting people to misconstrue what I wrote. Ha!]

[Dasheesh]

i am not going to call bitches. obviously. that is not what men do.

i will totally call someone that is a gimp, so good call.

[Dasheesh]

the problem with loop based loops is they think it's a real instrument, but obviously it's a copy of a real instrument.

[himalaya]

the problem with loop based loops is

That you have too many loops?

[vurt]

there's plenty of sampled looped based music that becomes more than a reuse of the loops.
there's creative use of loops as oppose to just dropping the loop on the track as is!!!

Granted! I wasn't writing about this at all.
If you do as you propose, your music piece will no longer be exclusively your own as it will contain music created by others. Makes sense so far?

Even if you mangle the loops creatively beyond recognition, you know that your music is not wholly original, since it...contains music created by others. Even if you mangle it all creatively.

So! I'm not referring to how creative you are with somebody else's loops. I am writing this in context of somebody who wants to create original music all by themselves, without any music content created by others. This is where that 'old chestnut' falls apart because it equates using pre-made loops with presets or instruments. Which is just silly.

[I was actually expecting people to misconstrue what I wrote. Ha!]

but say you take a drum loop, slice to its parts, individual hits.
then they are just samples,single instrument sounds.

same with a chord sequence, slice it down to individual chords, it's no different to playing a one finger chord patch

sound is sound. is my point not misconstruing anything, just at some point, you get down to samples rather than loops.
why do this you may ask?
well, there are many reasons, one being availability and sometimes as a nod of appreciation to an artist or genre...

i personally as in imo, think it can be your own piece regardless of the provedanve of the sounds, it's what is done with them that matters most.