Why does Microsoft hate us (#@$ Windows 10)

[jancivil]

that's just so full of shit, the wild exaggeration, the obvious deflection behind it all, and now this.
I did give up a couple of things that were discontinued a few yrs ago I hadn't used recently like at all.

I'm about to move up to Big Sur, which requires a little bit of research; not doing anything hasty. Not getting warnings, tho.
So no NI email warning. None of it has failed that wasn't discontinued, and I was able to install eg., Kore years and numerous further iterations down the line until about two years ago. 2011 discontinued, I finally found it too much trouble in 2019. It has 32-bit parts of its code, it went by the wayside with a strict x64 OS.
BFD Drums, new version, works here. didn't come with a warning, the minimum system requirements can be looked up and known, or seen on, oh, IDK, KVR. No VSL warnings, in fact I didn't see a warning in an email regarding the planned change in licensing to iLok afaik. No warning from Kuassa. No warning from IKM. No warnings, it's not a thing.

I have seen discussion in couple of emails by AudioModeling indicating their successes in testing for Big Sur and progress in testing for M1 architecture, even re., their iOS app, but an email functioning in the first place advising me not to update? Yeah, no. Orchestral Tools, not getting any warning.
Pretty sure they aren't looking at my system or know me or what OS version I'm using like at all.
It's a strange damn point to me.
I was given a couple of licenses to beta test things projected to work under Big Sur from NI, but I'm pretty sure they based that on history, not knowing what version I'm on or whether or not I have updated it, in fact I had not and I think they take someone on that list as knowing the lay-of-the-land.
it's known, everybody who is serious already has the info. I would if anything find it annoying to get a lame email doing that.
One of them was tested for a while - Battery 4 - and they still have the red X mark on the compatibility page. It probably works for most people but they aren't going to get in front with it yet. Reaktor, same.
Why do I need a warning? Are there folks that unable to keep up somehow? Jesus.
You seem to understand as much about this as you know about me having 'not much'.


Learn how to argue something straightforwardly and not _entirely_ fallaciously. You know, with facts, knowing something; this tired old narrative is frankly pathetic. I'm not a great big Apple fan, but that's really straining for a diss. Maybe people who can't get past 32-bit need a lot of help knowing what year it is, I donno.
I tend to doubt you're using any apple OS, because that's pretty much

[ghettosynth]

But...this hasn't been a problem, at least not for me, with the latest updates, and I'm pretty sure it's much worse every time Apple updates MacOS, and 50% of all developers sends out emails mentioning that you should NOT upgrade your OS if you want their software to work.

I haven't found the bug fix updates too problematic on Mac OS. The major updates often cause problems though.

e.g., from NI:

CRITICAL compatibility warning with the upcoming Mac OS X 10.11 El Capitan upgrade
Before upgrading to the latest version of Mac OS X – version 10.11 El Capitan, please consider these potentially serious issues concerning your KOMPLETE, TRAKTOR, and MASCHINE products. Two major issues have been identified:

1. NI plug-ins do not pass the AUDIO UNITS validation in Mac OS X 10.11 – Logic Pro affected
...
2. Incompatibility with some older NI hardware
...

There have been regular delay warnings on every major Mac OS from multiple vendors. Here's one from Sound Radix

As for our plugins, we have been working with Apple to prepare them for use on macOS Catalina. Once testing is complete and we know there would be no disruption to your creative workflow, we will notify all of our radical users. Until then, please continue to use macOS Mojave or earlier.

So it's six of one, half a dozen of the other. I pretty much always delay mac OS upgrades, but, once things are working, they seem to remain stable.

Windows 10 is more of a random crapshoot and has broken compatibility with two of my audio interfaces.

It's more than that though. Win 10 is a more stable and faster OS generally and I like a lot about it. However, Microsoft is continuing to force you to use more of their services, e.g., making it difficult to create a local login on a new system. I'm at that point where I'm more interested in keeping some old software running on a second machine that I don't need to upgrade constantly than I am with buying new software for that machine.

[CrystalWizard]

Using windoze 7 on one machine-rock solid, it stays offline. I recently aquired a w10 machine. I can’t say it’s the biggest pita ever but the amount of finagling, trying like hell to avoid the sometimes hellish upgrades, constantly being “reminded” to use the crap default programs, trying to get rid of all the crap bloat, etc. I see why i avoided w10 for this long, it’s a crap os imo. And that’s before the spyware (oops telemetry).
I have one other machine with a minor hardware problem which i will be repairing. It’s my older (but still quite good) windoze7 music box. It will also live offline.

[fmr]

DELETED

[Googly Smythe]

If you're using Windows Pro you can use gpedit to tell Windows not to update drivers. Solves a lot of issues.

[starflakeprj]

...

I could find 9 emails that I haven't already deleted from my mailbox. But I know there are plenty more.

Eventide, Waves, Roland Cloud, Topaz Labs, Reason Studios, iZotope, Sonarworks, FXpansion, AIR, SentinelOne

They recommend NOT to upgrade to the new OS. In many cases probably because they just haven't tested enough themselves (and the software might still work), but in some cases they really need to update the software to make it work. In some cases the software will never get support for the new OS.

If Microsoft would have done the same, there would have been a riot (both on the internet and on the streets). But when Apple are doing it...then nobody care, it isn't important?

I had a Macbook Pro around 2012-2015 (my own) and have had a Macbook Pro (first Intel, now Apple A1) since early 2018. So your assumption is incorrect I'm afraid.

[starflakeprj]

But...this hasn't been a problem, at least not for me, with the latest updates, and I'm pretty sure it's much worse every time Apple updates MacOS, and 50% of all developers sends out emails mentioning that you should NOT upgrade your OS if you want their software to work.

I haven't found the bug fix updates too problematic on Mac OS. The major updates often cause problems though.

Yeah, you are right, the bug fixes hasn't been any problems for me on my Mac either, but on the other side, I don't have anything else than Reason installed (and will test Bitwig once I reactivate the "subscription" again. Probably I won't install any VSTs or AUs though.

I do have to admit though that I'm a little nervous every time I go through with a Windows update, but, I just checked the number of installed software according to "Add or remove programs", and it's more than 1300. So the risk of something going wrong should be bigger than for the average person.

[Jafo]

If you're using Windows Pro you can use gpedit to tell Windows not to update drivers. Solves a lot of issues.

You can also download gpedit from Microsoft. I forget where I got this script, but here it is:

Code: Select all

@echo off 
pushd "%~dp0" 

dir /b %SystemRoot%\servicing\Packages\Microsoft-Windows-GroupPolicy-ClientExtensions-Package~3*.mum >List.txt 
dir /b %SystemRoot%\servicing\Packages\Microsoft-Windows-GroupPolicy-ClientTools-Package~3*.mum >>List.txt 

for /f %%i in ('findstr /i . List.txt 2^>nul') do dism /online /norestart /add-package:"%SystemRoot%\servicing\Packages\%%i" 
pause

Definitely worked a month ago (fresh install).

[lunardigs]

omg this thing is annoying. I feel like I've had like 800 patches I was *forced* to install just this year...and the latest, I installed one just yesterday...and this morning it tells me I need yet ANOTHER update. Are you kidding me? Linux compatibilities are a pain but so is this, I'm seriously considering the switch. Or even upgrading to Win 7. arghh...

Anyone on Linux, how bad have compatibility issues been for you with plugins, DAWS, etc? And what do you use for a UI? Wine? (The software I mean, the drink is a given lol)

Here's what I'd say, in complete honesty ... Linux would be a PITA, too. That is, in the beginning of using it. You won't quite know what to do; it'll be somewhat familiar, but still confusing.
Yet, in time, you'd discover a great many pleasant things about it--powerful, liberating things.
Yes, it would take some work and education. Good news is that Linux help is abundant on the net ... Ultimately though, you'd be building on a very strong foundation, that no one company can jerk you around with in a cavalier way.

About pro audio software: I've personally been using Linux for pro audio, exclusively, since ~2015. Nearly 8 years. The first thing I noticed, having so fewer software options, was a kind of clarity which came by clearing out all the plugins and other junk, which I really didn't need. This was a very nice and unexpected thing.
That said, more and more software options are becoming available for Linux, on going. Especially with the proliferation of JUCE.

About pro audio hardware: Unfortunately, there aren't many options. Although, very fortunately, those options look like RME. Yes, RME is expensive, but it's excellent stuff.
On the budget side, there's Focusrite. Which I don't have experience with, since I run an RME Fireface UFX. Nevertheless, they're really good and work great with Linux.
In fact, just about any audio interface with a Class Compliant mode (no need for a proprietary driver) should work with Linux. The good news is that iOS/Android (phone and tablets) has created a big market for Class Compliant hardware.

You can certainly leave Windows for Linux. I think you'd be glad in so many ways if you do, and stick with it. I can't say it will make your life easier, in the near term, until you learn it. Although, you'll certainly have more freedom ultimately, and you won't feel like you're being abused constantly.

[Synthdance]

...

I could find 9 emails that I haven't already deleted from my mailbox. But I know there are plenty more.

Eventide, Waves, Roland Cloud, Topaz Labs, Reason Studios, iZotope, Sonarworks, FXpansion, AIR, SentinelOne

They recommend NOT to upgrade to the new OS.

That’s because they are lazy bums and their codebase is ancient and they use outdated libraries. Big Sur was announced several months ahead of release, with various public betas available during this time. If one cannot update the software with all that time available, one should stop supporting MacOS and stick to Windows or stop coding altogether, IMHO.

[metamorphosis]

omg this thing is annoying. I feel like I've had like 800 patches I was *forced* to install just this year...and the latest, I installed one just yesterday...and this morning it tells me I need yet ANOTHER update. Are you kidding me? Linux compatibilities are a pain but so is this, I'm seriously considering the switch. Or even upgrading to Win 7. arghh...

Anyone on Linux, how bad have compatibility issues been for you with plugins, DAWS, etc? And what do you use for a UI? Wine? (The software I mean, the drink is a given lol)

It is much improved by using win10simplifier, but I stick with win7 for audio.
The hard drive access has gotten slower and slower with win10, to the point that nobody can use it without an ssd drive anymore. WHich is... BIZARRE.

[legendCNCD]

The hard drive access has gotten slower and slower with win10, to the point that nobody can use it without an ssd drive anymore. WHich is... BIZARRE.

Well, its the same on OSX, 10.11 was totally unusable on HDD where 10.7 ran ok on it... also it robbed 4GB memory, all the machine had. 3x boot times etc hilarious if it wasnt supposed to be used for working...

[ghettosynth]

Ok, but, are any of you running any machine without an SSD? Really? You can buy an SSD big enough for a boot drive for the cost of a pizza or two.

[Dasheesh]

let me get this strait, you lost old software in a microsoft update so you want to move to apple, who won't do that? good luck man.

On topic, Microsoft just announced the death of windows 10 in 2025, so there's your warning. Microsoft expects the world to have moved on from current standards and tech by 2025. welcome to the wonderful world of computers.

[Passing Bye]

let me get this strait, you lost old software in a microsoft update so you want to move to apple, who won't do that? good luck man.

No, he clearly didn't mention loosing any software or switching to Apple or macOS, but he clearly mentioned Linux and how he is sick of updating Windows, again

omg this thing is annoying. I feel like I've had like 800 patches I was *forced* to install just this year...and the latest, I installed one just yesterday...and this morning it tells me I need yet ANOTHER update. Are you kidding me? Linux compatibilities are a pain but so is this, I'm seriously considering the switch. Or even upgrading to Win 7. arghh...

Anyone on Linux, how bad have compatibility issues been for you with plugins, DAWS, etc? And what do you use for a UI? Wine? (The software I mean, the drink is a given lol)