KVR Audio

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon May 24, 2021 4:07 pm

Thanks URS.

I loaded up the file Chappelle attached. Though similar. It is not what the earlier discussion was struggling with.

There is a curve to the Alpha Juno Saw pulse it seems. Now.....I understand some of that conversation but I don't have a full grasp of it.

Thanks for the WT Chapelle. It is still quite usable.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 4:14 pm

a curve?

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 4:15 pm

ah, the highpass?

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 4:31 pm

Like these?

https://u-he.com/urs/SawPWMx1-4WavetablesHighpassed.zip

Just had to roughly estimate where the cutoff of the HP would be, based on the OP.

Note that these won't always sound correct as the alpha-Juno has a fixed highpass before (or after? Can't remember) the chorus section. Such that, the perceived "curve" of the sawtooth depends on the frequency of the oscillator. It's probably better to use the "perfect" waveforms I posted before and add a highpass filter in the synth (or after) to match the "belly" of the waveform. Just like one would for a Minimoog sawtooth (but there definitely before the lowpass filter).

LeVzi · Post by **LeVzi** » Mon May 24, 2021 5:56 pm

Thanks Urs, those wavetables are pretty cool too. So the Alpha Juno's Saw PWM was a pretty wierd thing at the time then ? I don't know the AJunos full history, but this has caught my attention, obviously thanks to the What The patch.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 6:33 pm

It was pretty novel, sure. I haven't followed the prior argument in this thread, but I'm pretty sure we came to the conclusion that Roland used the bits of the digital phase counter to "chop" the waveform, or the PWM signal. The dual PWM can be obtained for instance by subtracting the highest bit of the phase counter from the normal pulse signal (saw + bias) before the comparator.

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon May 24, 2021 6:57 pm

Urs wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:14 pma curve?

Yeah.....
The OP first post has some pics that show a slight parabolic curve and depending on the PW the curve flattens out and almost appears to go in the opposite direction.

A few seem to agree it is keytracked hi pass making the curve.

Thanks for sharing the WTs. A bit different than the pics but they quite beefy all the same.

The WT in Ana2 has a similar parabolic curve to the pictures. But the curve seems to remain constant through PW changes. It sounds a bit more delicate than the ones you shared. It has 2 pulses.

Lol...... I'm not sure any of us could tell what's what if we did a blind test.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 7:04 pm

Well, thing is, the "curve" depends on the setting of the highpass filter in the synth, and the note you play... analogue oscillators are commonly pretty perfect. But as people hardly ever see them in isolation, people attribute the waveform they see to the oscillator. Most of the time, the quirk of the visible oscillator waveform is actually a highness filter or some other process in the chain...

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon May 24, 2021 7:05 pm

These WT make me wanna open up Bazille and see if I can get close.

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon May 24, 2021 7:07 pm

Urs wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 7:04 pm Well, thing is, the "curve" depends on the setting of the highpass filter in the synth, and the note you play... analogue oscillators are commonly pretty perfect. But as people hardly ever see them in isolation, people attribute the waveform they see to the oscillator. Most of the time, the quirk of the visible oscillator waveform is actually a highness filter or some other process in the chain...

Kkkkkkl

You just summed up 7 pages of arguing.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Mon May 24, 2021 9:10 pm

alixp · Post by **alixp** » Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:52 pm

so they're not Alpha Juno saw pwm wavetables but on another thread about Alpha Juno pwm saw there was some info on D-50 saws and how they could be pwm'd. i set it up the same way in vital, but that had too much level difference, so i remade it with line source. i've really been enjoying the sound they have, def going to use these a lot.

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.44.43 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.44.57 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.45.16 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.45.30 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.45.42 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.46.02 PM.png

Screen Shot 2021-06-13 at 4.46.08 PM.png

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:05 am

Cool. What is the frame count and sample per frame of these?

alixp · Post by **alixp** » Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:25 pm

Scrubbing Monkeys wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:05 am Cool. What is the frame count and sample per frame of these?

i believe the wavs are exported in the same format serum uses

Scrubbing Monkeys · Post by **Scrubbing Monkeys** » Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:31 pm

alixp wrote: ↑Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:25 pm
Scrubbing Monkeys wrote: ↑Mon Jun 14, 2021 11:05 am Cool. What is the frame count and sample per frame of these?
i believe the wavs are exported in the same format serum uses

256 frames at 2048 samples/frame?

I don't have Serum but I think it can use various frame count and sample. Not sure.

Roland Alpha Juno-2 pwm sawtooth