Each Face Retains the Mask it Wore

[eassae]

Dude, those are beasts..mid / far field monitors...you could practically fill a small hall with the sound from those things! They're also 3 way monitors I think, so will always work best in a seriously acoustically treated room.

This was in a studio, and yeah the sound was so immersive even at low volumes. Super great experience. But, mixes didn't translate well.

[tomtom1]

But, mixes didn't translate well.

one of the american mixing "legends": - (i forgot the name (sorry)) - they say that his most important instance of monitors were his old ghettoblaster. how many ppl do listen music on their phones?

[eassae]

But, mixes didn't translate well.

one of the american mixing "legends": - (i forgot the name (sorry)) - they say that his most important instance of monitors were his old ghettoblaster. how many ppl do listen music on their phones?

Yeah, the Yamaha NS-10s still continue to be somewhat popular to this day. The avantone mix cubes are super popular for checking mixes.

Sorry to turn this into a gear thread

[Opaque]

Enjoyable listen, the opening sounds beautiful, and the development really flows. Could you reveal which instrument you used for the melody in the beginning (I presume it's a Kontakt instrument)?

[ChameleonMusic]

Enjoyable listen, the opening sounds beautiful, and the development really flows. Could you reveal which instrument you used for the melody in the beginning (I presume it's a Kontakt instrument)?

Thanks for having a listen and leaving some feedback - appreciated.

You're the 2nd person to ask about the opening sounds, so I'll copy and paste what I showed to them earlier in the thread:

The Beginning section:

Kontakt library called RIFF GENERATOR...bought it very cheap in a sale last year. Not keen on the preset riffs etc - I just ignore them, but it is very easy to create your own from scratch...

Gen 1.jpg

The screenshot shows the main view where you can draw in note patterns + all the expected editing features - velocity, volume, pitch etc etc etc + you can create up to 8 variations on your basic pattern...I used just 2 for this piece, with very subtle little pitch and timing variations.

You'll see that the sound actually consists of 5 layers (each with their own independent editing channel) - Music Box Large / Music Box Small / Kalimba / Sine 1 / Sine 2

Gen 2.jpg

The above jpeg just shows the wide range of built in effects and processors, including which ones were actually active here.

[ChameleonMusic]

But, mixes didn't translate well.

one of the american mixing "legends": - (i forgot the name (sorry)) - they say that his most important instance of monitors were his old ghettoblaster. how many ppl do listen music on their phones?

On phones - a helluva lot, believe me...sometimes via bluetooth speakers..sometimes on the phones themselves!

I have a definite routine when checking my mixes:

Studio Monitors Studio Monitors Studio Monitors Studio Monitors

and then when i think it's in the right area...

Kitchen Hi Fi
Small Bluetooth Speaker
Car Sound System
Phone
Domestic Headphones

If it's sounds good on all of the above then it's pretty much done!

[ChameleonMusic]

But, mixes didn't translate well.

one of the american mixing "legends": - (i forgot the name (sorry)) - they say that his most important instance of monitors were his old ghettoblaster. how many ppl do listen music on their phones?

Yeah, the Yamaha NS-10s still continue to be somewhat popular to this day. The avantone mix cubes are super popular for checking mixes.

Sorry to turn this into a gear thread

Gear thread - don't worry about it...threads go in weird directions sometimes...had one afew years ago that discussed Renaissance Polyphony for about a week!

NS-10s genius is all about this quote: "They're brutally unflattering to mixes, but that's their job. But never, ever use them as a sole pair of monitors. Just a cross check."

Something sounds good on 'em it'll sound good on anything is the idea, maybe? Personally, I found them tiring on the ear at times and unbalanced across the frequency range with a sort of 'ugly' low range. Got a couple of music tech mates who still use them and swear by their sound 100% though.

avantone mix cubes -Wouldn't want to use them as my main monitors, but. yeah... perfect for checking mixes in so many ways...

Main point is - Its frequency response is very heavy on the mid‑range, which is the section of any mix that is most likely to survive in most listening environments: a comparatively limited number of playback systems manage serious low‑frequency output, and high frequencies are very easily lost in many situations....

Get your balance right on an Auratone it's much more likely to translate across a wide range of systems.

Good for a quick mono compatibility check as well + the design of the cabinet design resists unwanted resonances.

[ChameleonMusic]

quite the engaging listen, nice mix of traditional
and electronic sounds. it kept my interest to the
end. mix came over very well balanced, too. enjoyed.

Thank you!

[tomtom1]

that discussed Renaissance Polyphony for about a week!

boring! I am allowed to say that because I had to write missas during my studies according to the old rules (we started with the rules for creating melodies and with two-part counterpoint ...)

let's talk about studio monitors!

Kitchen Hi Fi
Small Bluetooth Speaker
Car Sound System
Phone
Domestic Headphones

If it's sounds good on all of the above then it's pretty much done!

btw. what are you doing if, let's say, on the car sound system and on the kitchen hi-fi one element pops out just a bit too much for your taste - but on your studio monitors and headphone it's all good. will you rebalance your piece? or do you have to make compromises? I would be really interested in how best to "behave" in such situations.

[ChameleonMusic]

that discussed Renaissance Polyphony for about a week!

boring! I am allowed to say that because I had to write missas during my studies according to the old rules (we started with the rules for creating melodies and with two-part counterpoint ...)

let's talk about studio monitors!

Kitchen Hi Fi
Small Bluetooth Speaker
Car Sound System
Phone
Domestic Headphones

If it's sounds good on all of the above then it's pretty much done!

btw. what are you doing if, let's say, on the car sound system and on the kitchen hi-fi one element pops out just a bit too much for your taste - but on your studio monitors and headphone it's all good. will you rebalance your piece? or do you have to make compromises? I would be really interested in how best to "behave" in such situations.

I taught someone Renaissance Counterpoint via Zoom during lockdown (they're NOT on social media so I can safely say that I was bored shitless - don't think it showed as I tend to be VERY enthusiastic when in 'teaching mode')! Yeah, those exercises in polyphony...aaaargh! And don't get me started on Species Counterpoint...please, seriously...don't!

btw. what are you doing if, let's say, on the car sound system and on the kitchen hi-fi one element pops out just a bit too much for your taste - but on your studio monitors and headphone it's all good. will you rebalance your piece? or do you have to make compromises? I would be really interested in how best to "behave" in such situations.

Annoying answer is - IT DEPENDS on what the discrepancy is etc.

Longer answer:

If I find something a bit unbalanced on one system, I will ALWAYS listen again on all the other systems to compare and contrast...sometimes a few times.

If it's clear that it's a reasonably significant difference, then yes, I will find a compromise solution and adjust the mix and then recheck everything on ALL systems once again.

If I decide that it's only a minor issue and possibly just down to a particular peculiarity with one audio system, then I either ignore it completely or maybe tweak it very, very subtly.

The biggest balance issues that usually arise at this stage are:

Frequencies - particularly at the top and bottom ends.

Stereo problems on the very smallest systems - linked to a slight lack of mono compatibility. (always will be a significant bit of compromise here - never perfect at all)

Balance between individual musical lines.

Lack of 'air' or space in the loudest sections...they just don't 'breathe' enough - again, particularly on smaller systems.

[jancivil]

I only have three things: on the actual system I make the thing on with flat-ish phones (HD 280); on the MBP speakers, which are pretty small; and on some more consumer phones with a kind of pronounced smile EQ characteristic. There are more apparent issues with what I do on the last of these. I have some weird high-end phones which were I paranoid about highs I might want to bring out; the mids on that are just weird.
You should not listen to what I make while driving anyway, I don't own an automobile so good luck.

I find lack of space or oxygen in a mix more a product of things using too much of the field - too wide - than anything.
the 280s are not unlike the NS-10s, which I used to have, it doesn't help you sound good particularly.

[ChameleonMusic]

I only have three things: on the actual system I make the thing on with flat-ish phones (HD 280); on the MBP speakers, which are pretty small; and on some more consumer phones with a kind of pronounced smile EQ characteristic. There are more apparent issues with what I do on the last of these. I have some weird high-end phones which were I paranoid about highs I might want to bring out; the mids on that are just weird.
You should not listen to what I make while driving anyway, I don't own an automobile so good luck.

I find lack of space or oxygen in a mix more a product of things using too much of the field - too wide - than anything.
the 280s are not unlike the NS-10s, which I used to have, it doesn't help you sound good particularly.

MIXING - I think the main thing might be to get some sort of routine that works for you personally, but to also keep a little bit of flexibility in there as well?

NS10s - never understood the 'legend'!

I find lack of space or oxygen in a mix more a product of things using too much of the field - too wide - than anything.

All those bloody dance tracks on the Music Cafe with so many simultaneous, wild, whirling arpeggiated effects that swing rapidly from extreme left to right coupled with massively wide mixes with nothing in the centre + huge washes of reverb over everything + so much fuckin' compression and / or limiting it's painful to listen to!

[eassae]

NS10s - never understood the 'legend'!

Yeah, they overheat when you even remotely push them in amplitude, so they distort heavily. I don't really buy the philosophy of if it sounds good on crap speakers it will sound good anywhere. Maybe I'm wrong, but what if it just sounds good on crap speakers? I guess it makes sense if you're just checking your mix on them, but not mixing with them.

[eassae]

You should not listen to what I make while driving anyway, I don't own an automobile so good luck.

Ha:) I also figure that if you're listening to music through a phone speaker, then you're not listing to music, so I never even bother checking on a phone. I can see that it's different if you're doing music for picture.

[jancivil]

I find lack of space or oxygen in a mix more a product of things using too much of the field - too wide - than anything.

All those bloody dance tracks on the Music Cafe with so many simultaneous, wild, whirling arpeggiated effects that swing rapidly from extreme left to right coupled with massively wide mixes with nothing in the centre + huge washes of reverb over everything + so much fuckin' compression and / or limiting it's painful to listen to!

it's because all of their information about mixing is this echo chamber at KVR and NO ONE talks about narrowing the stereo field (UNLESS IT'S BASS which HAS to be mono). everything is left up to some magical mythical mastering engineer too