KVR Audio

imrae · Post by **imrae** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 9:02 am

simmo75 wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:58 pm
BertKoor wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:20 pm
simmo75 wrote: Tue Jun 29, 2021 8:11 pm no excuses for such slow development then
Yeah, with 9 woman it takes just 1 month to produce a baby.

In my experience large teams/cooperations move slower because of the increased number of communication channels.
Good to know, thanks! Is that a Dutch thing?

This is the famous book that popularised the idea https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mythical_Man-Month

I found it a good read. As always with management books you shouldn't assume that all the conclusions map to all problems. But it does a good job of identifying and discrediting some bad ideas.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 9:17 am

I can only recommend to the people who always claim that developers work slowly, or that they are lazy, or stuff like that, to get into software development, and start to write their own programs. I'd be curious to see how quickly they can develop some more complex software then. Bug free, of course.

Anyway, to cut it short: Software developers aren't lazy. The contrary is the case, especially with so much new tech that they have to learn the whole time. They aren't slow either. Rather very fast. I think everyone who has (like me) written some simple scripts can imagine how tedious and difficult software development is. Especially with bigger projects. It's easy to say that they're all lazy and slow, when you're sitting lazily and slowly in your armchair, and write on the internet.

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 12:05 pm

chk071 wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 9:17 am I can only recommend to the people who always claim that developers work slowly, or that they are lazy, or stuff like that, to get into software development, and start to write their own programs. I'd be curious to see how quickly they can develop some more complex software then. Bug free, of course.

Anyway, to cut it short: Software developers aren't lazy. The contrary is the case, especially with so much new tech that they have to learn the whole time. They aren't slow either. Rather very fast. I think everyone who has (like me) written some simple scripts can imagine how tedious and difficult software development is. Especially with bigger projects. It's easy to say that they're all lazy and slow, when you're sitting lazily and slowly in your armchair, and write on the internet.

This is very much a straw man - of course development takes time - just how much exactly is the question.

And we can easily compare the actual and practical development progress of DAW vendors who have few employees (MuLab) with those who have a big or even huge number of employees. (Ableton Live).

For this we do not need to have even just the slightest coding skills/experience ourselves.

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 12:35 pm

Given I had never heard of MuLab, maybe some of the employees in Ableton are in 'Marketing' not coders

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 12:58 pm

Well, certainly - and a lot of other stuff - but if they have (say) 375 employees, it certainly won't be one developer and 364 people doing other stuff...

Even if it was >>only<< ten coders, it would be ten times as much as Mulab and about five times as much as Reaper.

And assuming it's a lot less than ten, it still paints quite a grim picture, as every single employee has to be paid, regardless of what he/she is doing (or not doing) - doesn't it?

jens · Post by **jens** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 1:03 pm

Luhmann's system theory explains this well by the way - a company such as Ableton is a system that has the sole interest of feeding itself.

whannel · Post by **whannel** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 2:41 pm

EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 1:45 pm
SLiC wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 9:05 am
whannel wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 8:00 am I guess we can now just speculate over whether they'll follow the massively successful 'free lifetime updates' route.
So massively successful that no one else at all in the industry does it? FL started about the same time as Ableton...one of them is massively successful
Lol! Exactly this. Ableton employs hundreds of people - Image Line has a handful. I know that the amount of net operating income a company generates may not be a good metric to some, but that alone speaks volumes IMHO.

Does any other company in the industry have the popularity to be able to do it?

SLiC · Post by **SLiC** » Sun Jul 04, 2021 3:27 pm

whannel wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 2:41 pm
EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 1:45 pm
SLiC wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 9:05 am
whannel wrote: Sat Jul 03, 2021 8:00 am I guess we can now just speculate over whether they'll follow the massively successful 'free lifetime updates' route.
So massively successful that no one else at all in the industry does it? FL started about the same time as Ableton...one of them is massively successful
Lol! Exactly this. Ableton employs hundreds of people - Image Line has a handful. I know that the amount of net operating income a company generates may not be a good metric to some, but that alone speaks volumes IMHO.
Does any other company in the industry have the popularity to be able to do it?

They have proved they can stay in business with this model, I assume with new users and upgrading existing users. Assuming they keep finding new users or upgraders they have a business model. FL Studio certainly has a lot of users as once you buy it you are a user for life!

The question will be does RS have the popularity to sell subscription or sell or Reason 12 (as a Rack or a DAW) to new users?

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:43 pm

Looking at the latest beta entries, it seems like almost whole DAW is now in HD - is that the case?

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:15 am

antic604 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:43 pm Looking at the latest beta entries, it seems like almost whole DAW is now in HD - is that the case?

The beta entries?

THE INTRANCER · Post by **THE INTRANCER** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:55 am

EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:15 am
antic604 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:43 pm Looking at the latest beta entries, it seems like almost whole DAW is now in HD - is that the case?
The beta entries?

Reason Studio's have a competition for people to design a better Reason GUI...

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:06 am

THE INTRANCER wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:55 am Reason Studio's have a competition for people to design a better Reason GUI...

Don’t be sore you never made the finals.

<3

THE INTRANCER · Post by **THE INTRANCER** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:14 am

EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:06 am
THE INTRANCER wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:55 am Reason Studio's have a competition for people to design a better Reason GUI...
Don’t be sore you never made the finals. <3

I didn't even know the Scots were part of it, and I expected them to lose their games, but the Scots have always had low expectations anyway and enjoy the experience, win or lose. I'm hoping for an Italy win. England cheated their way through with Sterling's dive.... they don't deserve to be in the final.

When is Reason 12 out, September ?

JamminFool · Post by **JamminFool** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:27 am

THE INTRANCER wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:14 am
EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 4:06 am
THE INTRANCER wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 1:55 am Reason Studio's have a competition for people to design a better Reason GUI...
Don’t be sore you never made the finals. <3
I didn't even know the Scots were part of it, and I expected them to lose their games, but the Scots have always had low expectations anyway and enjoy the experience, win or lose. I'm hoping for an Italy win. England cheated their way through with Sterling's dive.... they don't deserve to be in the final.

pretty sure that's not what he meant.

antic604 · Post by **antic604** » Sat Jul 10, 2021 6:18 am

EnochLight wrote: Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:15 am
antic604 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:43 pm Looking at the latest beta entries, it seems like almost whole DAW is now in HD - is that the case?
The beta entries?

Sorry, it was late

I mean this: https://reasonbeta.reasonstudios.com/hc ... n-graphics

Last time I checked it was listing things that were not in HD,incl. sequencer, mixer, channels itself in the rack, etc. Now it only mention regroove mixer and rack navigator.

So, is almost everything in HD now? I don't want to d/l 3GB and make mess on my HDD just to find out

Reason 12 announced