Softube Modular

[j wazza]

but for a sine wave, why not just use the Doepfer A110 VCO in Modular, as intended?

specifically about sine waves, i use them for fm, and in fm synthesis, small differences in the carrier and modulator sounds can make a big difference to the sound at the end. On their own, the differences between 2 sine waves from different synths will be subtle or maybe not noticeable at all, but when used for fm, or other audio rate modulation i can hear a big difference, as this kind of modulation can add lots of harmonics and radically change the texture, the source sounds used for it affect the texture, analog source sounds = more analog texture at the end.

[WasteLand]

but for a sine wave, why not just use the Doepfer A110 VCO in Modular, as intended?

specifically about sine waves, i use them for fm, and in fm synthesis, small differences in the carrier and modulator sounds can make a big difference to the sound at the end. On their own, the differences between 2 sine waves from different synths will be subtle or maybe not noticeable at all, but when used for fm, or other audio rate modulation i can hear a big difference, as this kind of modulation can add lots of harmonics and radically change the texture, the source sounds used for it affect the texture, analog source sounds = more analog texture at the end.

Softube Modular has also a simple sine oscilator (they used it for testing, see the manual). seems to me, but you must see it through a scope, that is quite a pure sine..

but FM, Softube Modular is of course very suitable for it, it has 2 oscillators especially made for it...
one with true zero fm..

you but you want perfect sines? or imperfect sines?

i do a lot of FM... (or PM...)... so... a sine is a sine... o well not quite, it depends on the oscillator indeed. but mostly how they are build. but i believe, my memory! my memory!, it depends, sometimes waveforms are derived from other waveforms... but i believe it is mostly from the sine... but again, but we are talking emulations, this can be a slightly imperfect sine..

but look at the simple sine oscillator... or use the Melda free oscillator before softube modular... that produces, i checked it, but not scientific, a pure sine... (it is strangely an effect, but well, no prob..).

[tq]

@ j wazza: Gotcha, makes sense, but that's certainly not the standard setup. Personally, I would use modular for fx and sidechaining much more if the in/out routing weren't so limited. I guess this is part of the ergonomics issue with modular - it's such a fantastic sounding modular, but the playfulness and usability is certainly limited by the ergonomics, and here, they could learn from Cherry Audio (not so much when it comes to sound, though...).

As for IK Multimedia: I always do a backup of my sample SSD, which IMHO is a must have in case of larger collections, anyway (I do have more than 5 TB of samples) - so that never became an issue for me. But you are right that they charge you for re-downloading the large sound collections after a while, so you have to buy a "download token" (which is a very unfriendly policy, btw). Their software products are not part of this, though, so you can re-download these without issues.

This is oddly the opposite of UVI: They force you to download the large monolith files if you want to update the instruments, which wastes a lot of bandwidth - often you have to download 20 GB or so for minimal changes. People were begging them to change that and split the sound files from the instruments for ages, but seemingly, this seems to be a conceptual issue with how they encode or protect these containers...

Beyond that, I love their stuff. Criminally underrated because some people discard their libraries as "just sampled stuff", but they have a lot of gems in their collection.

[j wazza]

Softube Modular has also a simple sine oscilator (they used it for testing, see the manual). seems to me, but you must see it through a scope, that is quite a pure sine..

but FM, Softube Modular is of course very suitable for it, it has 2 oscillators especially made for it...
one with true zero fm..

you but you want perfect sines? or imperfect sines?

i do a lot of FM... (or PM...)... so... a sine is a sine... o well not quite, it depends on the oscillator indeed. but mostly how they are build. but i believe, my memory! my memory!, it depends, sometimes waveforms are derived from other waveforms... but i believe it is mostly from the sine... but again, but we are talking emulations, this can be a slightly imperfect sine..

but look at the simple sine oscillator... or use the Melda free oscillator before softube modular... that produces, i checked it, but not scientific, a pure sine... (it is strangely an effect, but well, no prob..).

a perfect digital sine will always sound the same, but i use analog sines for the imperfections, using them for fm exaggerates these imperfections, sometimes too much and its hard to stay in tune , but i find the sound i get at the end is richer, less crispy, thin, harsh or bright when using analog sines for fm rather than pure digital ones like in fm8. this is true for the rubicon being fm'ed by another rubicon, but with a real analog sine i like it even more.

pure digital fm can also sound great, and because of the more stable tuning you can do more complex multi oscillator fm and create complex harmonics without going out of tune. i use both and sometimes combine them, sending fm8 into softube modular, or vice versa

[j wazza]

@ j wazza: Gotcha, makes sense, but that's certainly not the standard setup. Personally, I would use modular for fx and sidechaining much more if the in/out routing weren't so limited. I guess this is part of the ergonomics issue with modular - it's such a fantastic sounding modular, but the playfulness and usability is certainly limited by the ergonomics, and here, they could learn from Cherry Audio (not so much when it comes to sound, though...).

As for IK Multimedia: I always do a backup of my sample SSD, which IMHO is a must have in case of larger collections, anyway (I do have more than 5 TB of samples) - so that never became an issue for me. But you are right that they charge you for re-downloading the large sound collections after a while, so you have to buy a "download token" (which is a very unfriendly policy, btw). Their software products are not part of this, though, so you can re-download these without issues.

This is oddly the opposite of UVI: They force you to download the large monolith files if you want to update the instruments, which wastes a lot of bandwidth - often you have to download 20 GB or so for minimal changes. People were begging them to change that and split the sound files from the instruments for ages, but seemingly, this seems to be a conceptual issue with how they encode or protect these containers...

Beyond that, I love their stuff. Criminally underrated because some people discard their libraries as "just sampled stuff", but they have a lot of gems in their collection.

yeah it would be better if softube modular had more than 2 audio input channels, or a sampler module, and agree that cherry audio's workflow is much better, also bitwig the grid has a great workflow, but both are lacking the sound quality of softube modular. i think uhe is going to make a fully modular synth one day that hopefully will be the best of both worlds.

backing up samples is a good idea, but agree its an unfriendly policy from ik.

uvi are great, and some of the synth sample libraries are more like hybrid synths than pure samplers, with nice unison, modulation etc

[Rastkovic]

i think uhe is going to make a fully modular synth one day that hopefully will be the best of both worlds.

I hope we don't have to wait so long and Softube updates their Modular as soon as possible...

[martinjuenke]

Just a quick comment on this instrument:
The more I play with, the more I'm impressed.
So many possibilities but channeled by their non-overwhelming module selection (high qulity stuff all of them) into creative boosting instead of wooing me into an unproductive rabbit hole (like other modulars tend to do).
A teaser (not from me):
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLGmN ... uHb03WmCIa

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

I just picked this up recently and haven't had a chance to dig in for more than a few seconds, but I definitely plan to (hoping Braids goes on sale sometime soon - not paying $45 for a single module).

Question: are there workflow tips to working with this? Like keyboard or mouse shortcuts to move modules quickly or quickly find and add the right type of module? Like, most modules are organized by collection and not type, which is just dumb IMO, but sequencers and utility modules are in fact organized by type (which I want for everything). Any way to change that? Any way to move multiple modules at once? Anyway to quickly scroll horizontally?

I find the workflow extra clunky compared to the VCV world, where despite having like 2,000 modules, things are easier to work with and navigation is much better.

[Arashi]

Question: are there workflow tips to working with this? Like keyboard or mouse shortcuts to move modules quickly or quickly find and add the right type of module? Like, most modules are organized by collection and not type, which is just dumb IMO, but sequencers and utility modules are in fact organized by type (which I want for everything). Any way to change that? Any way to move multiple modules at once? Anyway to quickly scroll horizontally?

Unfortunately, no. The workflow is pretty bad and is badly in need of lots of quality of life improvements across the board. You can’t even insert a new module between two existing ones without manually dragging them all around to make space for it. It’s kinda ridiculous. The good news is they recently did a major UI overhaul of Amp Room, which is a similar modular platform (but for building guitar effects chains), and it seems likely they’re working on something similar for Modular.

For now, the only reason to put up with Modular and just deal with the crappy workflow (and rather high CPU usage) is it sounds WAY better than everything else. Like, not even close. Granted, VCV’s “Audible Instruments” are surely using the same open source code as the branded Mutable modules in Modular, but the overall module quality and signal path in Modular blows everything else out of the water. I have all the modules (bought them all during a big sale), but most of the time I just use the stock Doepfer stuff, along with the (excellent) modules that came with Model 72 and Model 84, because it sounds so damn good.

Here’s hoping it will someday be as fluid and easy to work with as VCV and Voltage.

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Unfortunately, no. The workflow is pretty bad and is badly in need of lots of quality of life improvements across the board. You can’t even insert a new module between two existing ones without manually dragging them all around to make space for it. It’s kinda ridiculous. The good news is they recently did a major UI overhaul of Amp Room, which is a similar modular platform (but for building guitar effects chains), and it seems likely they’re working on something similar for Modular.

For now, the only reason to put up with Modular and just deal with the crappy workflow (and rather high CPU usage) is it sounds WAY better than everything else. Like, not even close. Granted, VCV’s “Audible Instruments” are surely using the same open source code as the branded Mutable modules in Modular, but the overall module quality and signal path in Modular blows everything else out of the water. I have all the modules (bought them all during a big sale), but most of the time I just use the stock Doepfer stuff, along with the (excellent) modules that came with Model 72 and Model 84, because it sounds so damn good.

Here’s hoping it will someday be as fluid and easy to work with as VCV and Voltage.

That's what I was afraid of but thanks for the response. Amp Room is indeed much better in this regard so hopefully they improve the workflow. Also, the Modular browser would really benefit from some Type views or tags. Hopefully some day.

[Ploki]

it's better but load times and gui responsiveness of Softube is still -way- behind some other plugins.
I just sometimes don't bother with it because i get tired of handling it, despite the fact that they do sound wonderful and have an exceptionally well tuned parameter ranges.
I just go for quicker alternatives instear

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

it's better but load times and gui responsiveness of Softube is still -way- behind some other plugins.
I just sometimes don't bother with it because i get tired of handling it, despite the fact that they do sound wonderful and have an exceptionally well tuned parameter ranges.
I just go for quicker alternatives instear

Yeah, that's always the problem with a crap workflow. If it's just not enjoyable to use and the user experience sucks, you'll stop using it. Hopefully Softube uses their own products, has heard the complaints, and plan on improving this.

[Arashi]

it's better but load times and gui responsiveness of Softube is still -way- behind some other plugins.
I just sometimes don't bother with it because i get tired of handling it, despite the fact that they do sound wonderful and have an exceptionally well tuned parameter ranges.
I just go for quicker alternatives instear

Yep. There are a lot of ideas I just don't try because the thought of having to bring in a dozen modules and manually move everything around to organize it all sounds like too much work. I always love the result, but usually end up just building basic subtractive synths because the workflow resists experimentation (and experimentation is really what modular is all about).

[martinjuenke]

To make a long comment story short:
"Other modulars sound worse, but I can work better with them, therefore I use the worse sounding modulars."
Well, not my cup of tea obviously...

[fmr]

To make a long comment story short:
"Other modulars sound worse, but I can work better with them, therefore I use the worse sounding modulars."
Well, not my cup of tea obviously...

This "sound worse" thing seems to me like a mistfication. I don't think that, for example, the Vult modules sound so much worse (this is just an example, I could give you more). And a modular, by concept, is something where you build your own sound. It would be pretty stupid (IMO of course) to have a modular to recreate a Minimoog or something of the kind. Yet, if you don't count the (severely overpriced) two Buchla replicas, the Mutable Instruments (which are just three) and the Intellijel, the rest is basically bread and butter. I really don't care how "good" they sound - they will sound like thousands of things we already have.

The modules that come from the 72 or the 84 may sound wonderful (I don't know and I don't care), but what else do they bring to the table?

Personally, that's not what I want a modular for.