ROLI's writing on the wall happened

[zvenx]

I just came to post the same thing.. will repost since your link may not be clickable as a new user:

https://roli.com/stories/roli-reforms-a ... ed-to-know

"Does ROLI still exist as a company?

As part of the restructure, ROLI Ltd has gone into administration. The new company, Luminary, has taken over all the IP, staff, products, brands and assets of ROLI. However, the ROLI and LUMI brands will continue as before, including roli.com, playlumi.com and their associated social media pages.

Seems like just a name change after all.
rsp

[Echoes in the Attic]

Doesn't sound like a good idea to focus on Lumi. I sent that thing back immediately. Terrible feel and build quality. Still love my seaboard rise though.

[Tj Shredder]

All the MPE solutions ATM are only halfway there IMO and so leave most users in a mixed state of love and frustration without real alternatives while being rather expensive.

Except for the LinnStrument. The best purchase I made in decades. The complete opposite of frustration… Even learning it isn‘t frustrating, though I need to work on my discipline…; - )

Rather expensive is relative. A good instrument can‘t be cheap. No difference to violins or guitars. Way cheaper than a piano for sure… (isn‘t teaching piano the new glory aim of Luminary… )

The only disadvantage of my LinnStrument investment was, that I got interested in synths again and I am not at all immune against those GAS addiction supporting business models you mentioned. I could resist an upgrade to Equator 2 for their ridiculous upgrade fee (lost money for them). But with these news there is hope it will be sold for little in the future…; - )

[pdxindy]

All the MPE solutions ATM are only halfway there IMO and so leave most users in a mixed state of love and frustration without real alternatives while being rather expensive.

Except for the LinnStrument. The best purchase I made in decades. The complete opposite of frustration… Even learning it isn‘t frustrating, though I need to work on my discipline…; - )

Same for me... the Linnstrument is brilliant. Also one of my best music purchases ever!

[ThomasHelzle]

All the MPE solutions ATM are only halfway there IMO and so leave most users in a mixed state of love and frustration without real alternatives while being rather expensive.

Except for the LinnStrument. The best purchase I made in decades. The complete opposite of frustration… Even learning it isn‘t frustrating, though I need to work on my discipline…; - )

Rather expensive is relative. A good instrument can‘t be cheap. No difference to violins or guitars. Way cheaper than a piano for sure… (isn‘t teaching piano the new glory aim of Luminary… )

The only disadvantage of my LinnStrument investment was, that I got interested in synths again and I am not at all immune against those GAS addiction supporting business models you mentioned. I could resist an upgrade to Equator 2 for their ridiculous upgrade fee (lost money for them). But with these news there is hope it will be sold for little in the future…; - )

Great if it works for you, it didn't for me (I tried it for a couple of weeks) and I think it doesn't for many other people either.
I'd want way more tactile feedback and a less slippery surface.
The Seaboard on the other hand is too imprecise and the silicon mud piles get in the way of sliding while keeping a certain pressure constant.

But I look forward to the Osmose. That looks like the best approach I've seen so far for a piano-like keybed.
As for other layouts, I actually hope that Rolis demise will encourage others to fill the gap with new and better concepts. Would actually be fun to work on something like that...

These days, MPE synths are plenty and I didn't find Equator 1 or 2 worth all the hassle they put up.
Going Windows 10 only 3 years before Windows 8.1 runs out of support pissed me off and is an idiotic move for a hardware driver that is also needed to update the firmware for the seaboard block I have, especially since it worked just fine before on 8.1.
There wasn't any need for this move...

Short sighted turtles all the way down.
Or lambs?

Cheers,

Tom

[zerocrossing]

All the MPE solutions ATM are only halfway there IMO and so leave most users in a mixed state of love and frustration without real alternatives while being rather expensive.

Except for the LinnStrument. The best purchase I made in decades. The complete opposite of frustration… Even learning it isn‘t frustrating, though I need to work on my discipline…; - )

Rather expensive is relative. A good instrument can‘t be cheap. No difference to violins or guitars. Way cheaper than a piano for sure… (isn‘t teaching piano the new glory aim of Luminary… )

The only disadvantage of my LinnStrument investment was, that I got interested in synths again and I am not at all immune against those GAS addiction supporting business models you mentioned. I could resist an upgrade to Equator 2 for their ridiculous upgrade fee (lost money for them). But with these news there is hope it will be sold for little in the future…; - )

Great if it works for you, it didn't for me (I tried it for a couple of weeks) and I think it doesn't for many other people either.
I'd want way more tactile feedback and a less slippery surface.
The Seaboard on the other hand is too imprecise and the silicon mud piles get in the way of sliding while keeping a certain pressure constant.

But I look forward to the Osmose. That looks like the best approach I've seen so far for a piano-like keybed.
As for other layouts, I actually hope that Rolis demise will encourage others to fill the gap with new and better concepts. Would actually be fun to work on something like that...

These days, MPE synths are plenty and I didn't find Equator 1 or 2 worth all the hassle they put up.
Going Windows 10 only 3 years before Windows 8.1 runs out of support pissed me off and is an idiotic move for a hardware driver that is also needed to update the firmware for the seaboard block I have, especially since it worked just fine before on 8.1.
There wasn't any need for this move...

Short sighted turtles all the way down.
Or lambs?

Cheers,

Tom

The bottom strip of the Rise is perfectly playable and bump free for slides. Takes practice to get pitch right, but so does any fretless instrument.

Anyway, YouTube is chock full of great Rise performances. I’ve heard one good Linnstrument performance during it’s entire lifespan. Only one. While I’ve never had the chance to play one, I can’t ignore that evidence. Even Roger Linn can’t play it well. I’ve heard many great Eigenharp and Continuum performances. For me, the best would probably be the Continuum, but the price has kept it out of reach. Not that I couldn’t come up with the money, but this is a hobby for me and I have a hard time sinking that much into a single instrument, and at the same time I’m very happy with the Rise 49. Is it great for everything? No. I need to also have a polyphonic aftertouch traditional keyboard as well. I’d love to get a 61 key Osmose, but it seems like they can’t even produce the one in the hopper.

Anyway, it’s sad that it went down this way. I read the Glassdoor posts and it sounded like the cliché of the CEO who’s great at having a vision and cheerleading for it, but horrible at managing people and forming a coherent strategy. I’ve worked for a bunch of people like that in the past, so I’m well aware of what the good people at Roli went through. I’m optimistic that with the reigns pulled away from him, the company may rise from the ashes and continue in a new way. We’re all free to have our own opinions, but to many the Rise was the best MPE controller for the money.

[digitalboytn]

[quote=machinesworking post_id=8202351
Angus had a team...

General Custer used to have a team too...

But they ran into some serious trouble on the prairie and because the batteries were flat on their cell phones, they couldn't call in an airstrike or contact the vulture capital company to renegotiate their funding arrangement

[pdxindy]

I’ve heard many great Eigenharp and Continuum performances. For me, the best would probably be the Continuum, but the price has kept it out of reach.

I have the Continuum. I find it too hard to play. It requires a lot of finger strength. And the way you have to press down into the surface for each note, which is different than weighted keys, meant I was never able to play a fluid quick run. I'm selling it cause after a year or so I knew I would never be able to play it in a way that made me happy. Maybe just not made for my type of hands.

The Linnstrument on the other hand. It doesn't need a lot of finger strength but rather precision. That suits me. These days I even play it sometimes with pitch quantizing off which means needing to hit the note right in the horizontal center. And I can play fast fluid passages, easy chords, subtle pitch slides. I've found various little techniques that are totally different than what one would do on a standard keybed. I had to let go of some keyboard thinking/muscle memory in that regard.

Just as the Continuum is never gonna work for me, maybe the Linnstrument would never work for someone else. But it does for me in that what wants to come out does without it feeling like the device is getting in the way.

[ThomasHelzle]

The bottom strip of the Rise is perfectly playable and bump free for slides. Takes practice to get pitch right, but so does any fretless instrument.

Sure, but then you lose slide - and on my Seaboard Block I can't pitch or slide with high pressure, no matter where I try, the material clumps up in a rubbermudpile. So basically I can either use slide and pitch with very limited pressure or full range pressure with very limited X or Y.

I'm not saying that the existing MPE controllers can't be played more or less successfully, but to me none of the ones I've seen/tried were fully there to become the new guitar.
It's still an early adopters playground with relatively high to very high prices for experimental hardware of questionable long term maintainability.

Compare that to my 100 year old Harmonium - I learned to tune the brass tongues with a knife in 5 minutes, can replace the wood mechanics if need should be, would even try my luck on the bellows if I had to.
Not MPE though...

Cheers,

Tom

[gaggle of hermits]

Sure, but then you lose slide - and on my Seaboard Block I can't pitch or slide with high pressure, no matter where I try, the material clumps up in a rubbermudpile. So basically I can either use slide and pitch with very limited pressure or full range pressure with very limited X or Y.

you're either way overcooking it or there's something wrong with the way the sensors are calibrated. i hit 127 without getting anywhere near that kind of pressure even with the sensitivity set to where it needs more pressure to hit the max.

maybe you're exaggerating but there's no point where going to maximum pressure makes it hard for me to move a finger either vertically or horizontally. moving over the keywaves is going to mean some change in pressure but that's where you either go to the top or bottom strip or use something else like a linnstrument where there's no physical obstacle.

[ehdyn]

Some of my stuff is registered with FXpansion, some of it with Roli.

They said don’t worry about it we’re going to merge everything soon.

That was approximately two years ago.

Not sure what’s best to do now.. would be good to have a statement from Angus/FXpansion as well.

Judging by how they abandoned Guru/Tremor etc.. I don’t have high hopes.

[ThomasHelzle]

Sure, but then you lose slide - and on my Seaboard Block I can't pitch or slide with high pressure, no matter where I try, the material clumps up in a rubbermudpile. So basically I can either use slide and pitch with very limited pressure or full range pressure with very limited X or Y.

you're either way overcooking it or there's something wrong with the way the sensors are calibrated. i hit 127 without getting anywhere near that kind of pressure even with the sensitivity set to where it needs more pressure to hit the max.

maybe you're exaggerating but there's no point where going to maximum pressure makes it hard for me to move a finger either vertically or horizontally. moving over the keywaves is going to mean some change in pressure but that's where you either go to the top or bottom strip or use something else like a linnstrument where there's no physical obstacle.

Interesting. I am totally unable to move my finger around with 100% / 127 pressure when the setting is at linear where I have the full pressure range available.
When I change the curve in the dashboard to a point where I can move without bulging the rubber and getting stuck, I lose most of the pressure range so pretty much all sensitivity is lost and I'm down to something like a very cheap aftertouch keybed where it behaves more like an on/off switch.
I find velocity also annoying, no matter what setting I use.
The dashboard would need way more options to fine tune things to make sense for a controller like this.

I do not think I can change the sensor calibration, can I?

A Seaboard Block this is, several years old, not much used.

I actually did like the QuNexus by Keith McMillen in the pressure department the most when I tried it many years ago, but it had other problems...

Cheers,

Tom

[aMUSEd]

I have a QuNexus but never use it, that I find also requires too much pressure to play and then it activates the aftertouch too easily so it's hard to get the balance right. I like the look of the Osmose but I think I would miss the ability to slide smoothly up and down the whole keyboard as well as up and down each key. I find my Seaboard block has just the right feel for me, the older Grand was very sensuous to play but that did bunch up too easily. I just wish I had more octaves; was planning to get another but then started selling out everywhere.

[gaggle of hermits]

I find velocity also annoying, no matter what setting I use.

I do not think I can change the sensor calibration, can I?

it sounds to me as though the seaboard hardware has a problem. i don't think there's a way for users to alter the sensor sensitivity thresholds, just the user curve in the dashboard app. if this is across the board, it might be an issue in the controller rather than the sensor. when i returned my first one it had a dead sensor, but that only affected part of the keyboard - just one keywave iirc. from that i assume there are multiple sensors arranged across the seaboard so to have them all doing the same thing sounds like it's either a firmware thing or there's a single converter that multiplexes between the individual sensors that isn't getting the right readings because of a dodgy resistor or something.

either way, it's a tech-support issue.

[ThomasHelzle]

I have a QuNexus but never use it, that I find also requires too much pressure to play and then it activates the aftertouch too easily so it's hard to get the balance right. I like the look of the Osmose but I think I would miss the ability to slide smoothly up and down the whole keyboard as well as up and down each key. I find my Seaboard block has just the right feel for me, the older Grand was very sensuous to play but that did bunch up too easily. I just wish I had more octaves; was planning to get another but then started selling out everywhere.

Interesting. The one I tried was the most sensitive controller I've ever used, but still with a wide pressure range. But this was 7 years ago...
One of the worst I've tried in the latter regard is the Launchpad Pro MK3, the polypressure range is so tiny, one can hardly articulate at all and the three hard coded setting aren't helping much.
Even my ages old cheap MPD18 beats most newer controllers in that regard (after modding). It even does polypressure and plays pretty well.

Cheers,

Tom