Plogue OPS7 (bit-accurate DX7 emulation!)

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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KVRAF
4528 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:29 am

PLease add the option for gui scalling between 80 and 90 % , 75 is just a bit too small for me
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies

KVRist
272 posts since 12 May, 2004

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:33 am

fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:50 am
And it seems the emulation is not so "faithful" after all :hihi:

Actually, I'm glad it isn't. Besides having effects, we also have an Extend button. When active, it allows us to choose other waveforms besides the sine for the operator, add feedback, noise, and vibrato and also pan the operator. Nice additions to the model, that I have to check.
Hmmm…those sound like SY/TG-77 features to me.
On a number of Macs

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fmr
KVRAF
10416 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:47 am

Weasel-Boy wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:33 am
fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:50 am
And it seems the emulation is not so "faithful" after all :hihi:

Actually, I'm glad it isn't. Besides having effects, we also have an Extend button. When active, it allows us to choose other waveforms besides the sine for the operator, add feedback, noise, and vibrato and also pan the operator. Nice additions to the model, that I have to check.
Hmmm…those sound like SY/TG-77 features to me.
Some yeah, although the waveforms are not the same (I have a TG77 and a SY99). But is definitely way more advanced than the DX series ever were.
Fernando (FMR)

KVRian
802 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:58 am

Speaking of which, the waveform choice in the extended mode of OPS7 wasn't explained clearly in the manual, so we have update it to show our take on it. We use the concept of a base waveform, and progressive mathematical morphs to it

https://twitter.com/chipsounds/status/1 ... 44816?s=20
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com

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fmr
KVRAF
10416 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:04 am

davidv@plogue wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:58 am
Speaking of which, the waveform choice in the extended mode of OPS7 wasn't explained clearly in the manual, so we have update it to show our take on it. We use the concept of a base waveform, and progressive mathematical morphs to it

https://twitter.com/chipsounds/status/1 ... 44816?s=20
That's the same concept followed in the SY/TG series, AFAIK. But how did you reach saw and square, then. The 16 waveforms of the SY/TG series were all sine related (mathematically derived).

Curiously, in your tweet you refer that the synth contains all the waveforms of all the previous Yamaha FM synths and more. So, I presume its the variant parameter. But again, some sort of graphical representation would help (a lot). The way it is, we have to go in a trial and error basis, playing one after the other.
Fernando (FMR)

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KVRAF
21906 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:43 am

briefcasemanx wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:48 am
What's the most intuitive fm synth UI? The newest Reason one?
Does this look very intuitive to you? :D

Image

KVRian
802 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:50 am

fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:04 am
That's the same concept followed in the SY/TG series, AFAIK. But how did you reach saw and square, then. The 16 waveforms of the SY/TG series were all sine related (mathematically derived).
We cheated a little to get the OPL3 square and other bits. most are math mods of simpler waves though.
fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:04 am
Curiously, in your tweet you refer that the synth contains all the waveforms of all the previous Yamaha FM synths and more. So, I presume its the variant parameter. But again, some sort of graphical representation would help (a lot). The way it is, we have to go in a trial and error basis, playing one after the other.
Its the first time we make a synth with this many features, this feedback is great to improve it. Our UIS are all generated on the fly from xmls and svgs, so its something we can tweak even without changing code. (we should eventually offer skins like chipsynth SFC)
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com

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KVRAF
4528 posts since 22 Mar, 2009 from gent

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:51 am

fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:43 am
gentleclockdivider wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:28 am
fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 8:48 am
Do we have any graphical representation when choosing the algorithm? Or do we have to refer to some sort of external document to check which one we want?

Right now, I only saw a knob to choose the algorithms, and it only displays a number. Even the DX7 had the algorithms displayed in the top of the panel.

Also, I see no way to deal with the envelopes graphically, we can't copy envelopes from one operator to other envelopes... I used sys-ex editors with better GUIs (sorry if this sounds harsh).
A few pages back you wrote that you bought it !
If you did , you would know that the operator stuctures are shown and cop- paste between op's is already possible
I bought it, but it seems your reading capacity is not very good. :roll:

Once an algorithm chosen, its structure is shown, that's true. But if I want to choose ANOTHER algorithm, how do I choose it? Do you happen to know by memory all the 32? Even the DX7 had the pictures shown in the panel. Or your advice is to go through all of them until I find the one I want?

I also said nothing about copying the Operator. I mentioned the Envelopes. Why should I copy an entire Operator, if I only want the Envelope? Actually, I think I rarely wanted to copy an entire operator. But the envelopes... ALL THE TIME.
True , sorry about that
Eyeball exchanging
Soul calibrating ..frequencies

KVRist
146 posts since 5 Sep, 2011

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:52 am

David first of all congratulations on the awesome synth!! love it!!

just some feature requests:

- It would be awesome to have a layer A and B link button on the global settings instead of coping each time you make a parameter tweak on one sound and

-Also It would be cool if we would have a layer panning knob besides the detune knob in the global settings section.

- Another feature I would like to see implemented is the analogue noise, I don't know how you feel about this but it would be awesome to implemented as a settings option, because some patches really come alive when crushing the Dx7/OPS7 thru some distortion and the analog noise plus the aliasing really help to give the sound some character.

Love the extended features that one is a surprise and one that makes this a monster of fm synth!!!

Plogue for the WIN!!! :party: :party: :party:

PAK
KVRian
1035 posts since 20 Feb, 2003

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:11 pm

briefcasemanx wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:48 am
What's the most intuitive fm synth UI?
I've always thought FM7 did a really nice job with its grid layout. Once understood it made it visually simple to see what was routed where, and all in a fairly compact area too.

All of these "do it like the DX7 diagram" layouts are.. what's the word I'm looking for? Crap. Yeah. :cry: :party:

KVRist
36 posts since 18 Jan, 2016

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:16 pm

Does this mean we'll be getting MTS-ESP in the other chipsynths? :love: (or did we already get it and I didn't notice?)

User avatar
fmr
KVRAF
10416 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:33 pm

davidv@plogue wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:50 am
fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:04 am
Curiously, in your tweet you refer that the synth contains all the waveforms of all the previous Yamaha FM synths and more. So, I presume its the variant parameter. But again, some sort of graphical representation would help (a lot). The way it is, we have to go in a trial and error basis, playing one after the other.
Its the first time we make a synth with this many features, this feedback is great to improve it. Our UIS are all generated on the fly from xmls and svgs, so its something we can tweak even without changing code. (we should eventually offer skins like chipsynth SFC)
Yeah, for a synth like this, the way you used to build GUIs isn't the best, I'm afraid. You said it yourself - this synth is much more complex than the others you have created.

You defintely should follow a much more graphical approach. After all, we are not in the eighties anymore and the advantage of using a computer is to be able to "see" things. What's the advantage of just seeing knobs and text boxes?

Graphical editing of envelopes, being able to copy and paste elements between operator, being able to see and choose from a graphical representation of the algorithms, being able to see and choose form a graphical representation of the wavefomrs, some sort of graphcal representation of the keyboard response... all of these are things that would improve a lot the user experience.

IMO, of course :shrug:
Last edited by fmr on Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)

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fmr
KVRAF
10416 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:35 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:43 am
briefcasemanx wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:48 am
What's the most intuitive fm synth UI? The newest Reason one?
Does this look very intuitive to you? :D

Image
WOW :lol:
Fernando (FMR)

KVRian
802 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:42 pm

zachy9 wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:16 pm
Does this mean we'll be getting MTS-ESP in the other chipsynths? :love: (or did we already get it and I didn't notice?)
Oh shoot, I added it in PortaFM 1.096 but didn't get around to backporting it to SFC and MD. Its really an quick UI file fix that I didnt have time to change.
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com

KVRian
802 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal

Post Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:52 pm

fmr wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:33 pm
You defintely should follow a much more graphical approach. After all, we are not in the eighties anymore and the advantage of using a computer is to be able to "see" things. What's the advantage of just seeing knobs and text boxes?
I'm afraid you do not know the work involved in making the sorts of UIs you want. You will have to look elsewhere I'm afraid. If I had the budget of other developers I wouldn't hesitate to put more thoughts in our UIs. With our size we focus on the sound and on the research.
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com

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