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FapFilter wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:37 am I personally think when doors automatically unlock when it recognizes the authorized person(s), keys will be seen as hassles too.
Rather for comfort reasons. But, yes, surely they would be seen as a hassle, when there is a system which works, and requires less work. That's also what I said earlier: Why would there be a reason for a physical dongle, if it all can be done virtually on your computer?

What I rather didn't understand is how people can argue that a software should have no protection at all, and they feel like thieves when there is such a protection scheme. That's something I don't understand. I never felt like a thief when I have to ring people's door bell, or wait until they unlock their cars. Actually, it's pretty short sighted to argue for no copy protection at all, because, it simply will lead to developers having to make up for the loss of piracy, meaning that the software will have to be more expensive.

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Yes, but what if some of such systems will actually slow down the performance, and / or require permanent online connections, while some others won't?

And i didn't say no protection at all, but at least in my opinion, some of these protections are still “unneccessary“ burdens on actual customers, that warez users won't have to face.

Even some high profile companies like Fabfilter, both with their price tags - but also by their reputation - use simple key files, while others think they must lock their stuff so deeply that it will actually cost system performance and sometimes also stability, needs constant C/R, etc and will get cracked nevertheless.
Thankfully the market is big enough so everyone can buy (or get even for free - the completely legal way even) whatever they think is doing great for them
Last edited by FapFilter on Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:59 am, edited 2 times in total.
The GAS is always greener on the other side!

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Then you should choose your software wisely, and steer clear of software which does that. Self-resonsibility is a great thing.

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Of course
The GAS is always greener on the other side!

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chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:30 am It's not your door. You only purchased the license to use the door. ;) Or, to get the analogy right, you only rented the house to live in it. You don't own it. And, the house owner/insurance company/whatever surely want's to make sure that everything is secured properly.
Man, you're really bad at it. Renting software exists too, and this is not it. :P
Let's agree to disagree and stop going off topic. :wink:

On topic: I still use Cubase 9.5, and except for the scalable interface I can't think of anything they could add to make me upgrade. :shrug:

Ok, the Padshop upgrade looks nice too. :oops:

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T-CM11 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:59 am
chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 11:30 am It's not your door. You only purchased the license to use the door. ;) Or, to get the analogy right, you only rented the house to live in it. You don't own it. And, the house owner/insurance company/whatever surely want's to make sure that everything is secured properly.
Man, you're really bad at it. Renting software exists too, and this is not it. :P
You purchased the license to use the software. You don't own the software.

And, I'm not bad at it. I'm just describing how it is. I'm afraid you are jumping to wrong conclusions.

I don't need the gazllionth discussion about this either, but, it seems that some misconceptions just can't be killed for good. "My software is mine, and I can do whatever I like with it." "I'm treated like a thief." "They don't listen to the customer." (best combined with the narcissistic belief that everything I want is what everyone else wants). Sorry, but, that's all nonsense.

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According to this thread, when the dongle is gone, people will stampede to Steinbergs door to grab a dongleless copy of Cubase. It will be a new dawn. Cubase will be reborn. Millions of copies more will be sold than ever before. Cubase will become the most popular DAW ever.

Meanwhile, in other news, a flock of flying pigs was sighted in New York city.

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chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:40 am
FapFilter wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:35 am Yes, that's my big complaint with this stuff too, that those who actually pay for their stuff are getting punished
If it's done properly, you won't even notice the copy protection.

Besides, do you also feel punished by door locks, car locks, speed limits, or signs which tell you that you're entering private property? I don't get the thinking, TBH.
None of this has anything to do with software. Why do you need to look for excuses for those companies? I don't get your thinking.
Anyway, your later analogies don't make any sense either. What's the point of having a door lock if everybody else has access to it anyway (pirated software)?

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dellboy wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:20 pm According to this thread, when the dongle is gone, people will stampede to Steinbergs door to grab a dongleless copy of Cubase. It will be a new dawn. Cubase will be reborn. Millions of copies more will be sold than ever before. Cubase will become the most popular DAW ever.

Meanwhile, in other news, a flock of flying pigs was sighted in New York city.
If that counts for anything (it doesn't), I'm NOT selling my copy of C11 precisely because I'm waiting for dongle-free authorisation. That would make me use 10x more.
Music tech enthusiast
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:06 pm You purchased the license to use the software. You don't own the software.
Discussions about ownership are always about semantics. How many limitations can be placed on something to start saying that you don't own it? And that's even without complicating it with local legal differences.

If I call a bridge a boat, does it stop being a bridge? If enough people start doing that, it will. Software publishers call it a license, local law may back them up, but in practice it's no different from owning physical products - they come with limitations too.
If you buy a Roland JV1080, nobody will dispute that you own it - yet you're not allowed to distribute its waveforms.

DRM exists because they can get away with it. Imagine: It's 1972. A goon squad comes to your door and thrashes your typewriter - because your neighbour told the manufacturer that you're not using their approved ink with it. Call the police and they'll (try to) arrest those guys.
Fast forward a few decades, manufacturers of inkjet printers are doing exactly that (in a digital way... DRM). And now that's all fine!

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pixel85 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:59 pm Anyway, your later analogies don't make any sense either. What's the point of having a door lock if everybody else has access to it anyway (pirated software)?
Not a subject for this topic, or this forum, but...
You've heard of digital(-ly controlled) door locks, right? (controlled by an app, controlled by a manufacturer's server)
IOT devices - often without decent security - people gobble it up. They want to live in places that they can't even enter if some server fails somewhere.

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It doesn't have to be on a manufacturer's server, it can be locally inside the unit in / at your door.
Also, if things should fail like because of a power loss or malfunction, there's no problem that you could still use a physical key as a mechanical backup / override.
The GAS is always greener on the other side!

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FapFilter wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 1:35 pm It doesn't have to be on a manufacturer's server, it can be locally inside the unit in / at your door.
Also, if things should fail like because of a power loss or malfunction, there's no problem that you could still use a physical key as a mechanical backup / override.
Sure, that's how it should be... but that's not what's happening on the IOT market. Already now, local network controlled devices are becoming a(n) (often very expensive) niche... while they still exist. I can't predict the future, but probability based on current events isn't meaningless.

Would you be surprised that one day, all software (incl. music) will be streamed from servers? That might sound extreme - but so was subscription-only software 15 years ago.

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pixel85 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:59 pm
chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:40 am
FapFilter wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:35 am Yes, that's my big complaint with this stuff too, that those who actually pay for their stuff are getting punished
If it's done properly, you won't even notice the copy protection.

Besides, do you also feel punished by door locks, car locks, speed limits, or signs which tell you that you're entering private property? I don't get the thinking, TBH.
None of this has anything to do with software. Why do you need to look for excuses for those companies? I don't get your thinking.
Anyway, your later analogies don't make any sense either. What's the point of having a door lock if everybody else has access to it anyway (pirated software)?
You're just drawing the wrong conclusions. You can get into any house as well, it's simply a lot of effort, and it's probably very risky, so, it's a question whether it's worth the effort.

Anyway, I'm sure it won't be long until this thread is locked if we go on discussing this.

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chk071 wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 2:22 pm Anyway, I'm sure it won't be long until this thread is locked if we go on discussing this.
DRM is an aspect of (music) software. It's hard to discuss it without getting "political". Should it be a forbidden subject because it's a difficult line to draw? It's not up to me, so I'm not going to try answering that question. :wink:

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