Good Bye Reaktor, good bye NI synths

[vertibration]

I think the only saving grace for NI and Izotope acquisition is to develop a DAW together combining their tech. Otherwise, what else can they do?

It seems users have drifted away, you really have to do something bold to bring them back.

[gentleclockdivider]

reaktor 5 was amazing , V6 is not... i remember when i was building my own synth for my synth with v5 and when i have upgraded to V6 the only thing that come in my mind was WTF !....i sold it...

Hmm.,weird you didn't like the
- new fiber bundles
-nested bundles
-unified core cell
-etc ..
So you sold it , lol

[foosnark]

NI's best work in terms of synths was from about 2006-2011. I think it's telling that they haven't had an exciting synth release in 10 years, and that many of their coolest products have not been updated in that time either.

Most of their stuff really could benefit from at least a UI update -- and in some cases a UI redesign from the ground up. Reaktor and Kontakt have always felt kind of awkward and hacky to me and they don't get better with age, though Blocks was at least an effort. And instruments like Razor should be able to run on their own (even if behind the scenes it's based on Reaktor technology).

When I got my "new" computer in summer 2019 I never installed Reaktor, and I haven't missed it.

Supercharger GT is decent. Raum gets some use, but only because it was free. That's about it for NI in my studio now.

[bmanic]

By far the biggest issue with Native-Instruments is the usability of their product range. There are so many cases where their software doesn't even bother searching the factory library default install locations for samples.

Form, Scanner XT, Battery 4 etc.. these ALL suffer from some abysmal programming where these programs don't search for the basic content once modified slightly. This leads the user to have to do a bunch of workarounds and saving samples all over the place, even if it's entirely based on the factory library (!!!). No other sample based software that I have has such huge issues finding samples from their own library when you modify them even a tiny bit.

Stuff like this wants me to ditch NI completely but I do realize they are still valuable due to some unique content and capabilities. I just hope Reaktor 7 gets a complete overhaul when it comes to basic usability. It should be 100% tweak, set and forget within the DAW. There is absolutely no excuse for projects not loading correctly when you've tweaked something. There should be no need to "re-save" and ensemble somewhere else and the in general abysmal preset saving system. It's incredibly idiotic and frustrating.

I'm definitely not purchasing any new NI software until they've fixed the most basic usability issues first.

[Tj Shredder]

i was thinking it could be great to be abble to export reaktor ensembles as vst and with a nice preset management

Export as VST plugin? Keep on dreaming!

The technology is in place, they did it with their Super 8. I guess there will be more to come, but they have to MPEify their Reaktor synths first…

[machinesworking]

As someone whose owned Komplete since v2 this thread pops up every 3 months on every music forum. NI are a great company, they offer a lot in Komplete, they're massive and move glacially, but Kontakt has no competition in terms of third party libraries, and Reaktor is still amazing. They offer great value so pretty much everyone owns Komplete. They constantly lag behind in terms of modern tech or upkeep-ing older software, this isn't anything new. No one whose owned NI product for 10 years or more should be surprised that they're just getting around to VST3, resizable GUI's and M1 support, or be surprised if they never offer MPE support for existing product.

These threads will com and go, and NI will still be around. I was annoyed that most of the content for Komplete Ultimate was rompler style instruments like Mysteria etc. but apparently they're doing really well with the whole "Play" line up.

[machinesworking]

i was thinking it could be great to be abble to export reaktor ensembles as vst and with a nice preset management

Export as VST plugin? Keep on dreaming!

The technology is in place, they did it with their Super 8. I guess there will be more to come, but they have to MPEify their Reaktor synths first…

I think a universal preset format that calls up the Reaktor Ensemble outside of instantiating the Reaktor ensemble would make sense. Unfortunately or not, I'm guessing that doesn't happen since they're invested in Komplete Control for universal preset management.

[Bombadil]

I use Kontakt. All I want is M1 Native. NI and IK both are draggng their feet, but at least IK has started to update..a couple of things.

[machinesworking]

I use Kontakt. All I want is M1 Native. NI and IK both are draggng their feet, but at least IK has started to update..a couple of things.

Personally I would rather see them get Reaktor M1 native first. I love Kontakt, but the M1 hardware out now only goes to 64GB RAM, I have 96 on an old Mac Pro, and honestly piecing together a Windows slave machine for Kontakt and EW is in the future here.

IK need to get Amplitube and MixBox native, then T-Racks. Mixbox is already a favorite FX rack here. Kind of surprised that SampleTank was first, but they must have wanted Syntronic 2 out, and for compatibility reasons SampleTank came along.

[vertibration]

Imagine NI comes out and says " We are only doing Maschine, and midi controllers for now on, no more software plugin support"

Everyone will be screaming

"How dare you stop supporting something I never use, and never intend to use"!!!!

[BONES]

Lookup the third-party multi-sample library support for HALion and compare it to the third-party multi-sample library support for Kontakt. It's not even close. Composers rely on Kontakt libraries for their arrangements. HALion can't even begin to replace what's out there for Kontakt.

I wasn't thinking about content so much as features. Because NI don't make much of the useful content, do they? And depending on your needs, you might find everything you're after in HALion. That said, I've had whatever version of HALion ships with Cubase for a couple of years now and I've not so much as opened it because I am so heavily invested in 3rd party Kontakt Player stuff. But I have been exposed to Presence in Studio One, because that's what it loads into every channel when you drop a MIDI file in, and it's surprising how much good content is tucked away in there. So I'm not willing to write HALion off until I've explored it a bit. After all, how many different orchestra or acoustic guitar libraries do you need?

NI's best work in terms of synths was from about 2006-2011. I think it's telling that they haven't had an exciting synth release in 10 years, and that many of their coolest products have not been updated in that time either.

Are you serious? Did you not notice Massive X? That's about the biggest synth release I can think of in the last 5 years. It doesn't interest me but you can't deny that it's a really impressive bit of kit that can compete with just about anything else on the market.

Reaktor and Kontakt have always felt kind of awkward and hacky to me and they don't get better with age, though Blocks was at least an effort.

But that's not how most people use them. I don't own either because all I need is the player so I can load ensembles/libraries and I imagine that's how 90% of users work with those products. The ensebles/libraries all have their own GUIs so what Reaktor and Kontakt do is of no consequence.

And instruments like Razor should be able to run on their own (even if behind the scenes it's based on Reaktor technology).

I don't see what difference it makes. It certainly doesn't affect my usage of those things and it makes for good consistency with patch libraries and the like.

Form, Scanner XT, Battery 4 etc.. these ALL suffer from some abysmal programming where these programs don't search for the basic content once modified slightly. This leads the user to have to do a bunch of workarounds and saving samples all over the place, even if it's entirely based on the factory library (!!!).

Or you can tell it to go and find the samples itself - Search Library, Search Location or whatever - then save the project and never have to worry again. The only times I've ever had those problems was when building a new PC. The first time you open a project on the new machine, you let it search for the samples or whatever, then save the project and it never comes up again. And, to be fair, I've only ever had that issue with Battery and Reaktor, Kontakt seems to be a bit smarter.

[machinesworking]

Imagine NI comes out and says " We are only doing Maschine, and midi controllers for now on, no more software plugin support"

Everyone will be screaming

"How dare you stop supporting something I never use, and never intend to use"!!!!

A little confused by this, but then Kontakt is a staple here.

My attitude would be that it's the nature of capitalism, some companies like U-He will probably support their software until Urs dies, but most need to make money, and if a product isn't making money they see no reason to continue to spend money on it. I'm not annoyed or interested in belittling peoples frustration with software though. It's weird to think of all the money I've spent on code that doesn't work anymore, because the developer never released serial from call and response, or it doesn't work on modern computers etc.

[pierb]

Are you serious? Did you not notice Massive X? That's about the biggest synth release I can think of in the last 5 years. It doesn't interest me but you can't deny that it's a really impressive bit of kit that can compete with just about anything else on the market.

LOL

Don't you think maaaaybe you might be exaggerating a tiny little bit there?

I do like Massive X, it sounds great and has a couple of cool features, but it still seems like an unfinished product in many aspects. In terms of flexibility and features it doesn't even come close to PhasePlant. Heck, even Vital allows you to add more than 3 stereo effects and even... drag and drop effects!

[Dencheg]

As an L2 English speaker, I find myself from time to time contemplating on using [] to reduce the redundancy of languages. So that I wouldn’t wonder if it’s [biggest synth] release or biggest [synth release]. Apparently, Avenger is a bigger one, since the author considers using FullHD resolution either dated or not really bright (if you ask me, FullHD is the smartest approach cause it allows to use both modern and older plugins).
But I digress. Massive X wasn’t biggest. I think Yamaha CS80 was

[BONES]

Yamaha CS-80 was released in 1977, not quite in the right time-frame, even for a joke.

I do like Massive X, it sounds great and has a couple of cool features, but it still seems like an unfinished product in many aspects. In terms of flexibility and features it doesn't even come close to PhasePlant. Heck, even Vital allows you to add more than 3 stereo effects and even... drag and drop effects!

So what? If you need more effects, you add them in the mixer. I prefer synths with no effects at all. But you're missing the point, which is that the Massive X launch was huge, way bigger than the hype around Vital or PhasePlant (both of which I own, neither of which I have ever found any use for). I'll guarantee it has way more registered users than those two combined, too.

Just to give you an idea, when you search for "massive x vsti" you get 8,220,000 results, when you search for "phase plant vsti" you get 313,000. Even if only 1 in 10 of those results for Massive X are positive, it's still two-and-a-half times more positive results than Phase Plant can get. So just because NI doesn't feel relevant to you, doesn't mean it's the same for the majority of the market.