Re: Midi Keyboard for beginners

[Teksonik]

[MOD NOTE]
This post is actually a reply to a post that was removed because it was from a spammer trying to start a conversation so that they could post "useful" links in the topic. I'll leave the rest of the topic as it is useful.
[/MOD NOTE]

Personally I would recommend getting a 61 key controller.

Sure 25 keys would allow you to poke notes into a piano roll but you won't be able to play full pads and keys like piano etc. It all depends on your budget, your skill level as a player, and what you want to accomplish.

The good thing about 61 or even more so 88 key controllers is that you can grow into them. I think you'll find 25 keys rather limiting after a short time.

Oh and your post is in the wrong sub-forum. This should be in the hardware sub-forum or as a beginner the "Getting Started" sub-forum would be better:

viewforum.php?f=74

[jackoo]

if you plan to use two hands, 49 keys is a bare minimum.

[ed_anger]

He’s making house and trance, a 25 key controller is just fine, and one with pads will help.

OP, at the low end most aren’t very different, some are just keys, some a mix of keys and pads, some just pads. The MPK is ok, it’s cheap and not very durable, the more money you spend the more options and durability you get.

[BONES]

If you are just starting out or not, I think it is hard to go past Arturia's KeyStep. It uses mini-keys, which you won't care about but which will save you a ton of space. It's a great feeling set of keys, though, with aftertouch, and 2.5 octaves is a very handy number of keys. KeyStep also comes with a great arpeggiator/sequencer that might come in handy for the kind of music you're making. It doesn't have any pads but you can use the keys just as easily for drum programming. It also works well with other hardware, as well as with your computer, so it should be useful for a long time to come. There is a good reason you see them in so many YouTube videos.

[glokraw]

@ lingdhync: Consider getting two very very different keyboards. Looking down the highway a few years, a used 88 key, piano-action keybed synth like an Alesis QS8.1 is a good versatile unit that will build your hand strength, such that when you get on some really fast and quality keys as mentioned, you might dazzle yourself. There will also be useful bread&butter sounds in such a sample-based & synth sounds unit, to explore and put to use.

And occasionally there may be times you want to set up keyboard splits, where 88 notes will prove handy. Also, there are some daft softsynth keyboard mappings out there, where the desired range will be available above or below the key count of products meant for other worthy purposes.

And there will be times when one device can control the other, to good effect,
as there will not be that much duplication in features. Buying used, be smart
like you were buying a car, and buying new, the full-replacement warranty can
dry a lot of future tears, as gear failure ratios are baked-in, just simple math.

As someone getting started, you'll meet new people in new locations, so the portability
and low power requirements of a Keystep, are a plus, and it's output options will let you
connect in with other musician's rigs.

https://www.vintagesynth.com/misc/qs81.php

Have fun!

[cryophonik]

…people are telling me to get a 25 key since it would be best for a beginner since they aren’t that many keys to mess with.

How many hands and fingers do beginners have? I must be way out of touch because I always thought it was the same number as professionals

If you wanted to learn violin, would you cut off three of the strings and retune that one remaining string when you need to hit higher or lower notes? No, of course not. That would make things more difficult, not easier.

25-key controllers have the advantage of being cheap and compact. It doesn’t matter if you’re a beginner or a pro, three-note and four-note chords often cover more than an octave range, melodies can easily cover a two-octave range, and when you start changing chords and creating melodies, you will inevitably need to hit those octave buttons to accommodate your chord progressions, melodies, and bass lines, whether you’re a complete newb or seasoned pro. I’d actually argue the opposite of what most people are telling you. A seasoned pro can hit the octave button and re-voice their chord progressions, melodies, and bass lines on the fly without missing a beat far easier than a beginner can. For a beginner, it’s easier to work with 49, 61, or 88 keys IMO. If you can figure out that 25 keys covers two full octaves, then you can figure out that 49 keys covers four full octaves, etc.

[crickey13]

Korg microkey, AKAI MPK or Arturia Keystep. I would advise against two octave keyboards because you can't input all chords on these small things, 3 or 4 octaves at minimum.

[thecontrolcentre]

Keystep is a great little keyboard if you're ok with mini-keys. Mine gets a lot of use and is the only mini-keys I would recommend. Usually they're pretty awful. I'm also a big fan of the Novation SL series too. Get one of the 61 key versions if you have enough space. My ReMOTE SL25 turned out to be a great purchase. It's been the heart of my midi setup for about 16 years

[ROTMetro]

As someone who just jumped in and bought a whole bunch of gear I would recommend going slow. Figure out what DAW your are going to use first. Figure out what your goals are. Are you making electronic music or wanting to play Chopin's Nocturnes. Are you a technical person or do you get overwhelmed when presented with too many options? I got a Novation SL MKIII and it is amazing, but it pushed my brain way past tilt for the first couple of weeks trying understand everything. Things like the ARP feature are super cool, but I went too fast and didn't even consider do I want an ARP in my keyboard. In my case it worked, but if I didn't need that maybe I overspent. Or if I didn't go with Ableton for a DAW I definitely did.

[BONES]

It doesn’t matter if you’re a beginner or a pro, three-note and four-note chords often cover more than an octave range, melodies can easily cover a two-octave range, and when you start changing chords and creating melodies, you will inevitably need to hit those octave buttons to accommodate your chord progressions, melodies, and bass lines, whether you’re a complete newb or seasoned pro.

Except a newbie isn't going to be doing that shit, are they? Fvck, I've been doing this for 40 years and I don't do that shit. By the time this guy is read for that stuff, he'll be able to make his own informed choice on where to go next. Right now he just wants to get started so something compact is going to be more than enough.

[syntonica]

Head on down to your nearest Banjo Barn and plink on a few keyboards. Figure out what size and weighting feels good to you. Keyboards come in synth action, semi-weighted and weighted (like a real piano).

As for the number of keys, you only need to learn 12 of them to cover an octave. Having more than that definitely won't cause any confusion.

I agree you want bare minimum 3 octaves, although 4 or 5 are better for full chord voicing. If you'll most be doing basses and leads, then 3 is fine. You'll want to look at how much space you want to dedicate to it and how portable it needs to be as well.

Listen to your hands, not us yokels on an inneryubes forum.

[syntonica]

I forgot to mention, I once needed a keyboards controller once at almost midnight for... um... reasons. I went to the nearest store that carried some crappy keyboard and got a nifty Casio with MIDI in and out. It was like 30 bucks and it turned out to be a terrific feeling keyboard despite the overly cheesy sounds that came out of it.

Moral of the story is that you don't need to spend a lot of money on your first keyboard to get something usable.

[mixyguy2]

…people are telling me to get a 25 key since it would be best for a beginner since they aren’t that many keys to mess with.

How many hands and fingers do beginners have? I must be way out of touch because I always thought it was the same number as professionals

If you wanted to learn violin, would you cut off three of the strings and retune that one remaining string when you need to hit higher or lower notes? No, of course not. That would make things more difficult, not easier.

25-key controllers have the advantage of being cheap and compact. It doesn’t matter if you’re a beginner or a pro, three-note and four-note chords often cover more than an octave range, melodies can easily cover a two-octave range, and when you start changing chords and creating melodies, you will inevitably need to hit those octave buttons to accommodate your chord progressions, melodies, and bass lines, whether you’re a complete newb or seasoned pro. I’d actually argue the opposite of what most people are telling you. A seasoned pro can hit the octave button and re-voice their chord progressions, melodies, and bass lines on the fly without missing a beat far easier than a beginner can. For a beginner, it’s easier to work with 49, 61, or 88 keys IMO. If you can figure out that 25 keys covers two full octaves, then you can figure out that 49 keys covers four full octaves, etc.

Exactly, well said. Having more keys available makes things easier, not harder. Cost is the only possible reason I can think of to get a smaller keyboard..I can't see how smaller size might come in handy unless you're living out of your car or something.

For better or worse (sounds like better from what the mod said) the OP is gone, so it's impossible to nail down "the" keyboard for that person, but as others have said, the best keyboard, whether for a beginner or not, depends on what they want to do with it. For something less demanding like EDM or rap or whatever, a smaller keyboard might be plenty, but if you're talking about playing jazz or (some) rock or classical, you'd want a full-sized keyboard or at least 61 keys, possibly with fully weighted action (you'd definitely want that for classical, but that describes very few people looking at buying a keyboard, esp a MIDI controller). But there are all kinds of in-betweens.

[ed_anger]

Here’s a typical house/trance type track, seriously, tell me you need 88 keys for this:

[chk071]

I definitely felt limited with 25 or 32 key keyboards. 49 keys is perfectly fine for me.

Of course, it really depends what you are doing. If you want to play some piano pieces, the more keys the better. If you want to experiment with synth sounds, or dial in some simple sequences/melodies, 49 keys is definitely enough for me. If you want to go higher or lower, you can transpose an octave.

Just like so many things which are generally asked here, it's more of a personal thing. I.e. it depends what you are doing.