Wotja 22 - Generative Music App & Plug-in Host (Free, Pro; AUv3 / VST3)

[JamminFool]

"Auto" only works when you arm. Either method works. Doesn't really matter unless you are actually recording.

exactly. it's for when you don't want to record on the given track(s). plus, it's easier since you don't need to use ctl-click.

[zzz00m]

I did a lot of searches on Google, with a number of hits in the Ableton forum, and multi-channel MIDI has been asked about and never answered over the years. Live has plenty of audio routing abilities, and a method of getting external instruments and controllers into Live, but routing individual MIDI channels from a plugin on a track seems to not be a priority for Ableton.

I ran across this article at https://feelyoursound.com/multi-channel-daw-setup/

Unfortunately, Ableton Live does not support multi-channel MIDI plug-ins. Live removes all the channel information from the output notes and replaces everything with MIDI channel 1. This makes it impossible to re-route or filter the notes afterwards.

However, you can use Blue Cat's PatchWork to make multi-channel MIDI possible with a third party solution.

Note: Blue Cat just released a new product called "Connector". https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/P ... Connector/

Blue Cat's Connector is an audio & MIDI streaming plug-in that can be used to transmit audio and MIDI signals in real time between several computers or applications, or create your own routings within a single application, with minimal latency.

Might be worth a try. I picked it up recently at a discounted price, because it looked like it might come in handy somewhere. At the moment I'm stumped on how to bypass Live's limitations using Connector, if it removes channel information from plugins.

Maybe need to host Wotja wrapped in another plugin (like KV Element) that could host Connector alongside, which then transmits all the Wotja MIDI to the outside world. https://kushview.net/element/

I realize that a 3rd party solution isn't always ideal, but sometimes it's necessary... or maybe just fall back and use Reaper! That works!

[zzz00m]

Note: Blue Cat just released a new product called "Connector". https://www.bluecataudio.com/Products/P ... Connector/

Blue Cat's Connector is an audio & MIDI streaming plug-in that can be used to transmit audio and MIDI signals in real time between several computers or applications, or create your own routings within a single application, with minimal latency.

Might be worth a try. I picked it up recently at a discounted price, because it looked like it might come in handy somewhere. At the moment I'm stumped on how to bypass Live's limitations using Connector, if it removes channel information from plugins.

Maybe need to host Wotja wrapped in another plugin (like KV Element) that could host Connector alongside, which then transmits all the Wotja MIDI to the outside world. https://kushview.net/element/

Well this works! But it's a pain to set up. Recommend only if you MUST have Wotja running in Live.

Test setup:
1. Insert 2 MIDI tracks, each with an instance of Kushview Element.
2. In KV Element 1, host Wotja VST3 and Blue Cat Connector. Connect the MIDI pins between Wotja and BC Connector.
3. Set this 1st BC Connector to "Send" and select "Local Host".
4. In KV Element 2, host your multi instrument, such as Kontakt, and another instance of Blue Cat Connector. Connect the MIDI pins between BC Connector and your multi instrument. Connect the audio output pins between your instrument and the Element audio outputs. This is necessary to send the audio back to live.
5. Set this 2nd BC Connector to "Receive" and select "Local Host".
6. Hit play and Wotja transmits all MIDI channels to Kontakt from track 1 to track 2, completely bypassing Live MIDI routing, and the audio mix from Element 2 on track 2 is sent to the Live output.

[JamminFool]

hi zzz00m,
thanks for trying. i already accepted when i bought it that Wotja would not be convenient to use in Live since Live does not support it by design.

but that is why i am pushing so hard to get it sorted and working in Waveform since it should work there. i bought Wotja when it looked like pete was making efforts to sort it out.

and it did briefly work. but right now it is broken.

[zzz00m]

hi zzz00m,
thanks for trying. i already accepted when i bought it that Wotja would not be convenient to use in Live since Live does not support it by design.

but that is why i am pushing so hard to get it sorted and working in Waveform since it should work there. i bought Wotja when it looked like pete was making efforts to sort it out.

and it did briefly work. but right now it is broken.

Hey @JamminFool

I hear you! I would like to see it working in Waveform as well.

I consider both Waveform and Live as great fun tools for experimenting and getting inspiration from compared with conventional DAWs which typically don't offer a lot more than a great tracking and mixing environment.

All things said, I have used Cakewalk the longest and it's probably the quickest way for me to set up routing for a quick idea with virtual instruments. And now I would probably choose Studio One for a final mix because of the chord and arranger tracks. BTW, Reaper is a very cool example of the most flexible track routing I have ever seen, and makes me wish that all other DAWs worked like that, LOL! The virtual Swiss Army Knife of DAWs!!!

[riley4reason]

How is Wotja better than NoaTikl and MixTikl?

[impete]

How is Wotja better than NoaTikl and MixTikl?

Hi!

We have a couple of articles on that very question!

Please try these links:

https://intermorphic.com/help/#ntx-mtx-wj
https://intermorphic.com/help/#noatikl-mixtikl-v-wotja

I hope that helps, at least!

Best wishes, Pete

[impete]

hi zzz00m,
thanks for trying. i already accepted when i bought it that Wotja would not be convenient to use in Live since Live does not support it by design.

but that is why i am pushing so hard to get it sorted and working in Waveform since it should work there. i bought Wotja when it looked like pete was making efforts to sort it out.

and it did briefly work. but right now it is broken.

Hi! I've not forgotten, but have been caught-up in a working on some other high-priority work in Wotja 22, which is coming in release 22.1.1

I hope to get back to the question of Tracktion next week!

Best wishes,

Pete

[JamminFool]

hi zzz00m,
thanks for trying. i already accepted when i bought it that Wotja would not be convenient to use in Live since Live does not support it by design.

but that is why i am pushing so hard to get it sorted and working in Waveform since it should work there. i bought Wotja when it looked like pete was making efforts to sort it out.

and it did briefly work. but right now it is broken.

Hi! I've not forgotten, but have been caught-up in a working on some other high-priority work in Wotja 22, which is coming in release 22.1.1

I hope to get back to the question of Tracktion next week!

Best wishes,

Pete

great to hear and a huge relief!
thanks, pete.

[impete]

great to hear and a huge relief!
thanks, pete.

It might be worth considering joining our Beta program? If you're interested, please get in touch via the contact page on the Intermorphic website. That would make it easier to share experimental builds etc. to try to nail-down your issue!

Best wishes, Pete

[impete]

I have spent a couple of days going over the PC top to bottom, scratching my head, reinstalling my audio drivers and performing a factory reset on the interface. No improvement! I finally rolled the VST3 back to 22.0.10 which solved the problems on most of my DAWs.

I initially started seeing major problems starting with VST3 version 22.0.11.

There is something else going on. Not griping, but just trying to help keep the focus on problem solving. I'm satisfied with 22.0.10 for the moment, and am able to use that version of the plugin, so not a showstopper for me personally. I hope for the sake of your product and other users that you get the issue solved!

Just trying to get all my ducks in a row in advance of next week!

22.0.11 is what - for me - solved the problem of routing MIDI in Tracktion Waveform Pro; and I verified this at the time with Waveform, Cakewalk, Reaper (NB the latter two were also fine with previous builds).

However: from what I understand, some of you report that 22.0.11 actually caused a regression with at least some DAWs in terms of MIDI connectivity.

So, I'd be grateful if anybody with problems with routing of MIDI from the Wotja VST3 in the current build (22.1.0) could let me know:
- what DAWs you're having problems with (and a rough headline summary of the problem(s))
- what DAWs you *don't* have problems with (this is also very important to know!)
- at what Wotja version you're (fairly!) certain any problems got resolved and/or fixed.

Thanks in advance for any/all feedback!

Best wishes, Pete

[impete]

Hi all,

I've just read in the low-level documentation that the VST3 format doesn't allow more than 2048 MIDI events per audio block.

So, if your Wotja implementation is emitting a *lot* of MIDI event data (e.g. controllers etc.), and if your audio block size is "large", then MIDI events would inevitably "go missing" due to the way that VST format works.

I think this is highly unlikely to be the cause of any problem, but is well worth mentioning!

Best wishes, Pete

[impete]

Hi again folks,

I think I can now see the source of the "MIDI Routing" issue, and it is down to the way that MIDI event times are supposed to be timestamped (the JUCE documentation is ambiguous in this area).

I'll be experimenting along these lines..

Best wishes, Pete

[JamminFool]

Hi again folks,

I think I can now see the source of the "MIDI Routing" issue, and it is down to the way that MIDI event times are supposed to be timestamped (the JUCE documentation is ambiguous in this area).

I'll be experimenting along these lines..

Best wishes, Pete

this is what i have been reporting in my posts starting halfway down on page 43 of this thread, where i show a picture of the timestamps before and after being routed, and suggested the same. i am fairly confident that this is the source of the problem. i have my fingers crossed.

[JamminFool]

Just trying to get all my ducks in a row in advance of next week!

22.0.11 is what - for me - solved the problem of routing MIDI in Tracktion Waveform Pro; and I verified this at the time with Waveform, Cakewalk, Reaper (NB the latter two were also fine with previous builds).

However: from what I understand, some of you report that 22.0.11 actually caused a regression with at least some DAWs in terms of MIDI connectivity.

So, I'd be grateful if anybody with problems with routing of MIDI from the Wotja VST3 in the current build (22.1.0) could let me know:
- what DAWs you're having problems with (and a rough headline summary of the problem(s))
- what DAWs you *don't* have problems with (this is also very important to know!)
- at what Wotja version you're (fairly!) certain any problems got resolved and/or fixed.

hi pete,

i have already fully documented my issue in Waveform in this thread, so i'm pretty sure you know about that.

but i also have an the issue in Loomer Architect. it is still in beta, so i hesitated to mention it here before, but I mention it now because it fails to pass any MIDI from Wotja to another VST at all, whether between tracks, or when the VST directly follows Wotja in the same track (which works with all other MIDI generating VSTs I tested in Architect).

the interesting thing to note here is that Loomer Architect also uses JUCE. Just like Waveform.

so more evidence that JUCE may be stripping badly formed MIDI messages.