New track type?

[UncleAge]

I'll admit I hadn't fleshed the idea out completely. But the more I think about it the more it makes sense. It would probably work best right above the device panel (live/bitwig) as a collapsible area/track but I think it could be done. And depending on it's features could make a lot of drum plugins unnecessary. Not all, but quite a few.

[vurt]

It would work the same as a drum plugin. 1 on the sequencer's screen would be the same as 1, 17 and 33 on the timeline. Just like a drum plugin.

but on the project timeline, we can add different patterns at different points, which we do by adding blocks of midi as loops.

or we can do it "live" by loopig play and switching patterns.
is this more what you mean?
im just wondering how you envisage (ooh big word) the drums coming in and out, changing pattern or whatever without the timeline?

[UncleAge]

Ah, now I see the confusion. I wasn't clear. First, it would be new functionality, not replacing current workflows. I envisioned it as a native version of a drum plugin. Like Microtonic or anything else, the patterns would be selected via an onscreen button or selector and/or respond to midi events as well.

You could turn the device on/off via automation or some other mechanism. I don't transfer my midi to the daw's timeline for drum plugins so I hadn't considered this type of workflow. hmmm...food for thought...

[vurt]

ah, I see, so it does have a timeline of sorts, just no note data.

i guess, maybe, they don't feel it's worth the time to code, when most people have already got one of the plug ins that can work this way?
when they can just allow automation that's already in place, control those drums?

personally if im using drums, i like to map them on the timeline, that way i can see where i may want to add a flourish of some sort, and just add it, rather than working out how to trigger a one off looping bit, to be different for one beat...
but that's me!

[Dalle]

maybe this helps

What’s the difference here?

[UncleAge]

It's been a while since I used Live, does that screen scroll with the timeline? I know the timeline's cursor appears on screen but I can't remember if the clip stays static.

[xbitz]

AL/BWS/Reaper because of Push, Maschine, Akai AP40, Fire, MPC Live, Arturia Beatstep etc. ...


and DrivenByMoss (especially for the Reaper one)

[UncleAge]

i guess, maybe, they don't feel it's worth the time to code, when most people have already got one of the plug ins that can work this way?

and it's that statement that lead me to wonder why this one thing was not attempted. i mean it was always there in fruity/fls but other daws left it up to plugins. they tackled amp sims, eq's, compressors, every type of synth and fx plugin but no drum machine with a sequencer. you can even say that the drum racks are like ni's battery in a way (excepting that you can load in synths not just sounds).

but now that you all have made me aware of the different workflows i'll let it rest. and thanks xbitz for posting the vids. that guy should get paid for his contributions.

[vurt]

i don't think you should let it lie, just because there's other ways
.if you still feel it's something that would improve things for you

nothing wrong with ideas, it's when they become expectations it gets annoying

[UncleAge]

i don't think you should let it lie, just because there's other ways
.if you still feel it's something that would improve things for you

nothing wrong with ideas, it's when they become expectations it gets annoying

i really enjoyed you all's input. it wasn't how i worked and so i had tunnel vision thinking about it. now that i am aware of how other's get it done i'm going to give that avenue a shot. who knows, it might push me in new directions. i still like the idea. i'll pass it on to the bws devs even though i am sure they gave it thought a long time ago.

[vurt]

i think something like bitwig, or bidule, maybe mulab too, would be the best environments for it.
they can be used in a less linear fashion (live too i guess). something more linear focused like samplitude or cubarse probably wouldn't work so well.

[xbitz]

yepp, this is why operators are really great in BWS

with they can be broken out from the 8bar loop cage pretty easily using only one page + clip looping

[UncleAge]

yepp, this is why operators are really great in BWS

with they can be broken out from the 8bar loop cage pretty easily using only one page + clip looping

good thing i'm on a staycation this week. i can dive into this because i have plenty of extra time. things like pan, repeats, shifts, reverse, pitch(coarse/fine) and a few other things are per note/sound and seem to be there. i'll bet i can pretty much get there from here. thanks again for posting the vids

[ReleaseCandidate]

You mean a step sequencer view like in some DAWs
E.g.
Logic
https://support.apple.com/guide/logicpr ... acefc9/mac
Cakewalk and Studio One
https://www.presonus.com/learn/technica ... Sequencing
and Tracktion's Waveform?

[koolkeys]

I think a few hosts do have something similar, but honestly, none of them can compete with dedicated plugins. FL Studio has a fleshed out version because that was how it was built. Traditional linear tracks WERE the new track types for FL Studio.

Linear timelines are built to take advantage of time, whether it be measures, beats, timecode, or whatever. A static pattern window kind of breaks that idea, and the only way to make it worth having is if you can automate and change those patterns over time. But then you have to be able to record those changes as you run through the timeline (unless you're only doing live work and not recording your changes, in which case most hosts aren't built for that). Since you already have to have a timeline of sorts to record those changes, it just makes sense to do what most hosts do and have a "drum" view in their piano roll or MIDI editor.

Just rambling and thinking out loud here, so hopefully my thoughts make sense (they do to me, lol). I just think it's something that isn't worth the time when most hosts already include something that can do it far better, and there are dozens of plugins to do the same.

Brent