CLAP... thoughts?

[_leras]

Would you say that CLAP is a replacement for Juce for people wanting to start plug in development?

It's not a replacement for JUCE (and most of this also applies to iPlug, etc). It's a different kind of thing on a different level of abstraction, so to speak. CLAP is more of a language for a host and a plugin to talk to each other, while JUCE is a complete "toolkit" or "framework" for building software (not limited to plugins, even though it's popular for plugin development) that takes care of talking to the operating system and provides you with all kinds of utility functionality.

CLAP and JUCE (or some other toolkit) solve very different problems and there are apparently already unofficial modules that add CLAP support into JUCE.

Not really, it depends on what a developer wants to do. JUCE is a lot more than just a way to create a plug-in, and we certainly hope that it picks up CLAP officially.

Thanks both for answering, That, of course, makes perfect sense.

[zvenx]

i really don't understand the negativity through the thread?
if you don't see the benefit, don't use it, it won't effect you in any way!!!
....
(sorry, i don't do memes)

yes it does...
just like the anti vst3 and the anti mac silicon group have said about those, developers adding this to their formats of delivery, takes development and testing time away from products that I would use.
CLAP didn't make the day now have more than 24 hours.

(cough cough Z3 for instance).

rsp

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Time will tell eh?
rsp

Hasn't it already though? It's not like the VST3 adoption has been fast.

It wasn't about adoption it was about capability and functionality (and specifically on a host that can soar without vst2 compatibility with properly coded vst3 plugins (not wrapped)), my post that is.
rsp

Oh I got that, but that whole line of thought also implies that "properly coded VST3 plugins (not wrapped)" are a thing, as if people are coding for VST3 first and foremost, and then porting to other formats. I don't believe that's going to ever happen except maybe at Steinberg.

[zvenx]

They are a few others, but indeed not as many as we Cubendo users would like.
rsp

[Super Piano Hater 64]

i really don't understand the negativity through the thread?
if you don't see the benefit, don't use it, it won't effect you in any way!!!

It's a problem as old as human history. You might call it cooperation blindness. Instead of a world where people can work alongside each other and improve things for everybody, we see a world ruled by a zero-sum game where the only way for Bob to improve his own life is to make things worse for Alice, and vice versa. So, things might be really bad for Bob, but if he sees Alice trying to help, he can only interpret that as a threat and label her The Enemy. You've seen this a million times. We all have, even if we didn't realize it. There are entire nations trapped in this mindset. It might be the whole reason we have stories where the villain and the hero end up as friends.

[vurt]

you humans are weird

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

They are a few others, but indeed not as many as we Cubendo users would like.
rsp

There may already be more developers interested and committed to coding CLAP plugins and porting to other formats than there are in total developers coding in VST3 then porting to others. And Clap's been out for 2 days and VST3 for over a decade!

Note: I don't know if that's actually true, but it feels true.

[zvenx]

lol.. indeed it feels so... KVR for you.
Are we up to 8 threads here yet? lol

I actually joined DUC today to see what the discussion was on Avid's forum about CLAP.
Strangely enough I didn't find any thread about it. Not even a one.. odd that no pro tools user who uses duc, would have seen avid's name on the evaluating list and not ask on their forum.. unless of course someone did and avid removed it.
rsp

[vurt]

i really don't understand the negativity through the thread?
if you don't see the benefit, don't use it, it won't effect you in any way!!!
....
(sorry, i don't do memes)

yes it does...
just like the anti vst3 and the anti mac silicon group have said about those, developers adding this to their formats of delivery, takes development and testing time away from products that I would use.
CLAP didn't make the day now have more than 24 hours.

(cough cough Z3 for instance).

rsp

which doesn't really effect you, unless you are sat around waiting specifically for "new thing" rather than using all the stuff you already have. in which case, i would suggest clap is not the problem.

[zvenx]

But a delay in technology I will use does affect me. It isn't preventing me from working now of course, but software improvements are made for a reason, including better workflow and allowing quicker delivery of project to my clients.

That does affect me.
rsp

[vurt]

well imo it's steinbergs fault for not listening to the devs.
if they had worked with these developers to make vst3 better we wouldn't be here now.

[rasmusklump]

The steinberg fanboys are firing on all cylinders again...

[zvenx]

well imo it's steinbergs fault for not listening to the devs.
if they had worked with these developers to make vst3 better we wouldn't be here now.

And you may be right.. won't argue with you on that..
I indeed have been 'victim' of SB's stubbornness in other areas..

rsp

[zvenx]

The steinberg fanboys are firing on all cylinders again...

lol. yes just us.. not the anti SB fanboys .. just us pro sb fanboys

Without Asio and vst2 how many of us would be in music professional or as a hobby?
rsp

[Super Piano Hater 64]

But a delay in technology I will use does affect me. It isn't preventing me from working now of course, but software improvements are made for a reason, including better workflow and allowing quicker delivery of project to my clients.

That does affect me.
rsp

For many of the developers adopting CLAP, the best alternative to this delay was a much longer delay in the near future, followed by a series of additional longer delays after that.

Let's take u-he as an example here, because they're kind of relevant. Until recently, most of their codebase was "VST2 first," as Urs himself has stated in other threads. Their automatic test suite was VST2-based. Their VST3 support was in many ways VST2-based under the hood. It was all fine, until it wasn't, and Steinberg decided to fling legal threats at anyone who still used VST2 for anything. They were faced with a non-negotiable compulsion to drop VST2 support in the not-too-distant future, and even scrub all VST2-related code from their codebase.

What would you suggest they do here? Ignore the looming legal problem until it blew up in their faces? Lots of plugin developers are in more or less the same situation, and most of them likely haven't yet made a move away from internal VST2 support, so keep in mind that your answer can be taken as advice.

With the VST2 apocalypse, Steinberg gave the whole industry an enormous yak to shave. Try not to be angry with them for shaving it as a team.