KVR Audio

kritikon · Post by **kritikon** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 5:58 pm

Hmmm, a quick listen on crappy PC speakers did indeed make me think it's pretty luscious. I'm def going to have to check out the demo properly though - am I imagining it or did I read in their blurb about it being high CPU - approx 100 x a bog standard reverb? I may have misread that though. Not entirely sure my 2 yr old mid range laptop could cope with that...and it reads like it's intended as a master reverb kinda thing - have to get my head around that as I haven't worked that way in 30 yrs or so. Does sound good though. Very good.

Funkybot's Evil Twin · Thu Jul 28, 2022 7:51 pm

Wrong Eq wrote: Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:48 pm What a nonsense.

It might be a bug. Teilo isn't one to make things up. We don't know the host, plugin format, sample rate, etc.

That said, I don't have the issue he reported and I tried to reproduce here on Windows, using Reaper.

savantaudio · Post by **savantaudio** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 8:30 pm

kritikon wrote: Thu Jul 28, 2022 5:58 pm Hmmm, a quick listen on crappy PC speakers did indeed make me think it's pretty luscious. I'm def going to have to check out the demo properly though - am I imagining it or did I read in their blurb about it being high CPU - approx 100 x a bog standard reverb? I may have misread that though. Not entirely sure my 2 yr old mid range laptop could cope with that...and it reads like it's intended as a master reverb kinda thing - have to get my head around that as I haven't worked that way in 30 yrs or so. Does sound good though. Very good.

Your mileage will vary based on many factors including sample rate at buffer size, but we are able to run around 80 instances on an entry level Mac studio m1, and around 120 on custom PC (vision daw). There are also some tips in the QuickStart guide to reduce CPU usage.

jens · Post by **jens** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 9:02 pm

kritikon wrote: Thu Jul 28, 2022 5:58 pm am I imagining it or did I read in their blurb about it being high CPU - approx 100 x a bog standard reverb?

Nah, here it is a 'lil more than 2x as much as Sonsig... (which means a 'lil more than 1/2 as much as AR Chambers)

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Thu Jul 28, 2022 9:16 pm

This sounds pretty damn fantastic, as far as I'm concerned!

teilo · Post by **teilo** » Fri Jul 29, 2022 2:37 pm

Wrong Eq wrote: Thu Jul 28, 2022 2:48 pm
teilo wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:44 pm
savantaudio wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:39 pm
teilo wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:15 pm Is anyone getting a weird warble on transients? Even on a piano, it's really bad.
Most likely bandwidth and RT High are set too high. Try reducing those for a more natural sound.
No, that's not it. It barely matters what they are set at.

Upon further experimentation, I've discovered this thing is super sensitive to input levels. I swapped out Pianoteq 7 for Arturia Piano V3. The latter sounded fine. Comparing the two, the only different was input levels. V3 has a much lower signal output by default then Pianoteq, even when both are set to 0db. If I drop Pianoteq to -6db, the problem seems to go away.

Even when the input meters on Quantuum are no where near in the red, like at -18db, it distorts and warbles badly. I can't imagine this was true of the hardware. At least on piano material, Quantuum does not like to go above -30db.
What a nonsense.

Ah, so you are sitting in my studio and can tell me with certainty that my ears are lying? I will be sending the dev rendered examples.

Wrong Eq · Post by **Wrong Eq** » Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:26 am

The problem I have with your dramatic post is that you frame your individual problem as a general problem, even accusing the maker that this is not a proper emulation.

izonin · Post by **izonin** » Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:13 am

teilo wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:15 pm Is anyone getting a weird warble on transients? Even on a piano, it's really bad.

Edit: user error, the plug-in works fine

Yep, it distorts quite noticeably, and there's lots of warbling/modulation. You can also check the thread on gearspace, where others are discussing this very issue.

I'm sure this bug will be fixed in the next update.

savantaudio · Post by **savantaudio** » Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:17 pm

izonin wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:13 am
teilo wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:15 pm Is anyone getting a weird warble on transients? Even on a piano, it's really bad.
Yep, it distorts quite noticeably, and there's lots of warbling/modulation. You can also check the thread on gearspace, where others are discussing this very issue.

I'm sure this bug will be fixed in the next update.

Sorry, but we have many units out there and have not had any user reports of distortion. We are not aware of any GS discussion regarding distortion. Are you able to share any audio examples?

Thank you.
Hans

izonin · Post by **izonin** » Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:30 pm

savantaudio wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:17 pm
izonin wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:13 am
teilo wrote: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:15 pm Is anyone getting a weird warble on transients? Even on a piano, it's really bad.
Yep, it distorts quite noticeably, and there's lots of warbling/modulation. You can also check the thread on gearspace, where others are discussing this very issue.

I'm sure this bug will be fixed in the next update.
Sorry, but we have many units out there and have not had any user reports of distortion. We are not aware of any GS discussion regarding distortion. Are you able to share any audio examples?

Thank you.
Hans

Ah, the distortion turned out to be from an overloaded limiter on the master bus... Just user error, as usual.

Sorry everyone for the misleading post!

cbtw · Post by **cbtw** » Sat Jul 30, 2022 2:22 pm

Wrong Eq wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:26 am The problem I have with your dramatic post is that you frame your individual problem as a general problem, even accusing the maker that this is not a proper emulation.

I agree. This is not Gearspace, after all.

savantaudio · Post by **savantaudio** » Fri Sep 16, 2022 5:18 pm

In response to questions regarding the plugin filters vs the hardware filters (from another thread):
The short answer to whether we will make the plugin sound more like the 90s hardware is yes; I think it is conceivable that a future update will have different filter options that allow for "flavors" that are closer to the 90s hardware filters.
That being said, I think that many who compare the plugin at certain presets to the hardware underestimate the importance that these filters can have in shaping the sound. We maintain that the plugin will still cancel with the hardware (to -75-80dB) when the RT60Low and RT60High filters are not engaged (You can quickly test this by loading any "plate" presets on both units).
As we discussed earlier in this thread, we attempted to design our filters in the 2772 to be more reminiscent of the original 80s hardware, and herein lies the main difference contributing to the various degrees of phase distortion and modulation.
When you read threads comparing the 80s and 90s/2000s hardware, there are often sharp divides between those who prefer the sound of the original 80s hardware (more character, depth, "3D") and the modern hardware (more natural, less artifacts, etc.). Aside from some of the distortions caused by older converters and sampling rates, these differences are largely due to the differences in filters. The filters on the modern hardware units are more accurate in the sense that their phase is more tightly aligned. This is especially important for an algorithm that relies on precisely coordinated (e.g. "QUANTized") calculated resonances.
In smaller room sizes, such as those found in the 80s hardware, the sound is sometimes filtered over 500 times a second. Imagine the amount of phase distortion that can quickly compound. This is why the designer limited the RT60 lengths of these smaller rooms in the hardware. If you would attempt to create a bathroom with a decay time of 100 seconds, it would sound quite nasty.
So why do many prefer the sound of the 80s hardware if it is less accurate? Probably the same reason many of us prefer vintage microphones or hardware... there are often desirable characteristics due to distortions and non-linearities. In the case of the 80s room simulator, these phase distortions are sometimes closer to what might occur in the natural world. Additionally, our ear is easily drawn to these distortions, and in my opinion help to create greater perceived L/R depth and motion. By comparison, the modern hardware rooms might feel a little too precise and clean.
The final thing I would like to mention is that the 90s hardware and our plugin are fixed to a single room size, while the 80s hardware had seven different room sizes. Longer presets like Taj Mahal were not really intended to run on the smaller room size algorithm in the 90s hardware. This is why you might hear increased modulation/distortion at longer reverb times in our plugin when the filters are engaged at more extreme settings RT60Low and RT60High multiples. You are hearing a bit of that 100 second bathroom effect we described earlier.
There are some nice comparisons posted in a review https://www.amazona.de/test-savant-audi ... ll-plugin/ between our plugin, the 80s hardware and the 90s hardware. In our opinion, the character of the plugin sits somewhere in between the two hardware units.

martinjuenke · Post by **martinjuenke** » Mon Oct 30, 2023 5:28 pm

Seems that Savant Audio Labs will release a
Quantec Room Simulator
plugin soon:

budweiser · Post by **budweiser** » Mon Oct 30, 2023 5:47 pm

Ok. Credit card ready for day one.

jtsterays · Post by **jtsterays** » Mon Oct 30, 2023 5:52 pm

Pretty bold considering Relab is already on the QRS but im sure Savant wont disappoint.

Quantum Evolution - Quantec Yardstick 2402 Room Reverb Emulation