KVR Audio

Echoes in the Attic · Post by **Echoes in the Attic** » Sun Oct 02, 2022 6:06 pm

I recently picked up a used copy of Live 10 since I missed some things about live, even though Bitwig is my main DAW. Haven't used live since V8. Playing around with it I've been pretty shocked by how much it crashes loading factory Max for Live devices. It's happened 3 times in the last couple days. Simply swapping out devices.

Just curious if M4L in Ableton Live 11 is more stable?

Also, I remember that the M4L devices used to induce latency equivalent to the audio buffer, which could be crazy in a high buffer setting (which might be necessary on some portable devices like surface pro). I'm guessing this isn't an issue any more since it was built tight into Live? I tried stacking lots of M4L audio devices and didn't notice latency so that's good.

Rastkovic · Post by **Rastkovic** » Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:26 pm

I noticed some old M4L devices are no longer useable. Maybe that could be the reason? Doesn't have any crashes with "factory" or newer M4L devices in Live 10.

Echoes in the Attic · Sun Oct 02, 2022 11:50 pm

Rastkovic wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:26 pm I noticed some old M4L devices are no longer useable. Maybe that could be the reason? Doesn't have any crashes with "factory" or newer M4L devices in Live 10.

I'm on Live 10 and experienced crashes only with factory M4L devices. I don't have any other than the factory packs. Happens quite frequently and shuts the whole program down.

Rastkovic · Post by **Rastkovic** » Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:41 am

Yes, there are also very old factory M4L devices. I think, I got a problem with one of these....

https://www.ableton.com/en/packs/max-7- ... e-machines
https://www.ableton.com/en/packs/big-three

Maybe there is no real backwards compatibility:

https://help.ableton.com/hc/en-us/artic ... x-versions

Rastkovic · Post by **Rastkovic** » Mon Oct 03, 2022 7:25 am

You can also try to manually "update" Max. The bundled Max version in Live 10 is actually 8.1.11. Simply download the newest Max version and tell Live where the application is stored. You don't need to buy the Max full version for this....

https://cycling74.com/downloads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFxC0Tu-dpU

pdxindy · Post by **pdxindy** » Mon Oct 03, 2022 1:56 pm

Echoes in the Attic wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 11:50 pm
Rastkovic wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:26 pm I noticed some old M4L devices are no longer useable. Maybe that could be the reason? Doesn't have any crashes with "factory" or newer M4L devices in Live 10.
I'm on Live 10 and experienced crashes only with factory M4L devices. I don't have any other than the factory packs. Happens quite frequently and shuts the whole program down.

It's been a while since I had Live installed. I bought the Live 11 Suite upgrade, but never even installed it. Before that Live was still crashing regularly with included M4L devices.

My impression is that users generally agree 11 is more reliable, but I have no first-hand experience.

legendCNCD · Post by **legendCNCD** » Tue Oct 04, 2022 12:43 pm

I only have crash sometimes - and this is strange - when a project loaded has a M4L. If I open M4L - whatever plugin - before loading a project which has one/many the project opens properly.

Live 10.1.42 or something like that (not at the machine now)

zeep · Post by **zeep** » Tue Oct 11, 2022 8:55 pm

The only M4L device that ever crashes Live is Convolution Reverb Pro. I found some old discussions about this crashing and apparently (sadly) it was never fixed. The non-pro is 100% stable btw.

pottering · Post by **pottering** » Tue Oct 11, 2022 11:17 pm

Discovered recently in a post by user "ecuk" on Ableton's forums that Ableton started to make a release notes page for the Packs.

https://www.ableton.com/en/release-note ... ase-notes/

Or at least for some Packs.

I think it only covers changes from around the middle of 2021 onwards.

jonljacobi · Post by **jonljacobi** » Fri Oct 14, 2022 4:46 pm

About all I can say is that it doesn't if you don't use it. I think about all I use is the convolution reverb, and that not very often. I do remember it not being very stable.

legendCNCD · Post by **legendCNCD** » Fri Oct 14, 2022 6:03 pm

Ok, so it is convolution reverb we use a lot too.. spectral blur doesnt seem to crash.

Echoes in the Attic · Post by **Echoes in the Attic** » Fri Oct 14, 2022 7:09 pm

My crashes came with the drum synth devices, and I think one of the vintage type M4L synths. But of course this is in Live 10, sounds like 11 is more stable then with these?

kimearo · Post by **kimearo** » Sat Oct 22, 2022 1:34 pm

Hi. Have not notice that while I've been using live. Dunno if M4L devices stability depends much on OS,I used macos El Capitan with Live. I did not use a lot of M4L devices though.

Does Max for Live still crash Ableton Live a lot?