So about those Limiters with sidechain capabilities...

[kintsugi]

Other than Pro-L2, what are they? Anybody?

Done a LOT of searching to no avail. Usually the comment is "Pro-L is one of the few limiters to offer external sidechain" or similar, but nobody seems to list the other few.

The search results are pretty contaminated by Fabfilter topics, and excluding the brand name helped me find only Blue Cat's Protector.

Appreciate your help!

[imrae]

Most limiter plugins are brickwall limiters; for high-ratio compression without brickwall, lots of compressors can do the job. Brickwall limiters are generally used as a finalising tool rather than a creative effect (where high-ratio compression and/or saturation would do a similar job).

If the GR is driven by a sidechain input, one can no longer guarantee that the output will be limited to the threshold.

Why would you use this feature?

[kintsugi]

Stem "mastering" in the sense of making other people's life easier when the job needs to be done really, really quick and dirty. Yes, I know it's "wrong" but sometimes it's better to just do what you're asked. I guess that's why FF included the option?

Examining TDR Molot GE in this role later today, as it does have a sidechain, and a limiter. Light bus style compression with a bit of vibe at the same time could make it a mean workhorse if the limiter does what it should.

edit
To whom it may concern:
Well the TDR Molot GE "limiter" is actualy a (nice sounding) clipper so it won't do for these purposes.

[imrae]

If any processing is done to the stems, that invalidates the brickwall limiting you printed. Piling up artefacts doesn't make life easier.

[cron]

Most limiter plugins are brickwall limiters; for high-ratio compression without brickwall, lots of compressors can do the job.

Seconding this. The whole concept of brickwall limiting as we know it goes out the window when the limiter isn't listening to the signal it's supposed to be limiting, so a hard knee compressor capable of high ratio and very fast attack should produce an almost identical effect

[kintsugi]

Guys please try to understand it isn't about fidelity, quality or being technically correct, it's about a mix having the absolute same sound whether it's played back as a single stereo mixdown or a bunch of separate stems. There is a use for this and it's not even fringe.

So to reiterate the original purpose of the thread, what are the other few? Anybody know?

[imrae]

You could also achieve that by not limiting and instead turning everything down to avoid clipping.

As is usual practice when sending material for mastering.

[kintsugi]

It's not going to be sent to mastering. It's going to be sent to a dub stage. The limiter provides density (crucial) and yeah a little bit of level control, and should ideally preserve the sound that got approved in the first place -
all the while allowing the low parts of the mix to get ducked to sfx, the middle registers to get ducked to dialogue, etc.

So please stop derailing the topic if you don't have an answer, and thank you for your interest. The question is, once again - which limiters allow sidechaining?

[Karbon L. Forms]

Presswerk has both internal and external sidechain.

[kintsugi]

Haha, thanks for mentioning Presswerk, absolutely great sound but not what I'm looking for.

But you helped me remember a gem I already have: DC8C3 by Klanghelm (similar toolbox with main + simplified views) and what I totally forgot: it does brickwall limiting when setup correctly (yay manual!). 2-3dB of reduction, a tiny bit of saturation, and it's just what I've been looking for. Klanghelm - the gift keeps on giving, with 8x oversampling.

Will put it to deep testing but man the first impressions are excellent.

[ScrLk]

I think the feature is unique to Pro-L so I suggest using that.

[dug dog]

DC8C3 by Klanghelm
Will put it to deep testing but man the first impressions are excellent.

Reviving this old thread as there seems to be very little info "out there" on this topic. How did the DC8C do?
(My current budget doesn't allow purchase of the Fabfilter limiter.)

[MogwaiBoy]

You could also achieve that by not limiting and instead turning everything down to avoid clipping.

As is usual practice when sending material for mastering.

Exactly

To me it seems like a solution looking for a problem. It's a pretty complex thing to pull off and if the worry is about artifacts then why use a limiter at all. Stems for film/games need plenty of headroom anyway.

The only valid use-case I can think of is techno producers being able to remix their own tracks live.

[Held]

MTurboComp can be used as a limiter (either the Melds M1 device or customize the settings yourself) and has a side-chain input.

[dug dog]

Stems for film/games need plenty of headroom anyway.

The only valid use-case I can think of is techno producers being able to remix their own tracks live.

I appreciate the real world use perspective. My interest in the topic is purely theoretical at this point.