Why did you leave Studio One?

[jamcat]

To compare, Studio One was released only 3 years before Bitwig, and it has caught up to (and surpassed) Cubase, Pro Tools, and Logic Pro in popularity.

I don't think Bitwig is purposefully trying to stay small. No one in business has a goal of not selling product!

I think the real reason for CLAP is a stab at relevance. VST, AU, and TDM/RTAS/AAX is what put Cubase, Logic, and Pro Tools on the map, respectively. And Bitwig is hoping CLAP will do the same for them.

[billcarroll]

To compare, Studio One was released only 3 years before Bitwig, and it has caught up to—and surpassed—Cubase, Pro Tools, and Logic Pro in popularity.
...

Studio One was first released in 2004 under the name KRISTAL Audio Engine (KAE), then another few iterations until purchased by Presonus. Interesting history.

https://kreatives.org/platform/blog/fro ... studio-one

I'm not sure how you're measuring popularity, but the number of users worldwide is a title held by Cubase or FL Studio. Hard to tell. I'm sure the numbers are out there somewhere. FL Studio, Cubase, and Ableton Live each have more market share than Studio One. Bitwig is a much smaller market, obviously.

[jamcat]

wrong button

[jamcat]

Studio One was first released in 2004 under the name KRISTAL Audio Engine (KAE), then another few iterations until purchased by Presonus. Interesting history.

They're not at all the same thing. Studio One evolved from K2, which was a development project that was built from a completely new and separate code base from KRISTAL Audio Engine.

I'm not sure how you're measuring popularity, but the number of users worldwide is a title held by Cubase or FL Studio.

Not current, active users.
(That would probably be Ableton.)

Again, I'm looking at long term trends, and out of Studio One, Cubase, Pro Tools, Logic, and Bitwig, it looks like only Studio One has long term upward movement.

[BKSchatzki]

That’s fair. Cubase is a monster DAW. And I’ve never tried Bitwig, precisely because I know that’s how I’ll react to it. I look at specific features and think they’re cool, but a workflow is way more than the sum of its parts.

To me, the only things that I still wish for in Studio One are inserts and sends in the track controls of the arrange view like ProTools, a better approach to adjusting track sizes, and more meaningful plugin labeling than just numbering them. But that’s such a subjective thing.

[jamcat]

I want to see better automation in Studio One.

Specifically:

• Ability to reassign existing automation data to a new instrument/track and/or parameter
• Automation part containers for easy copy/paste, duplication, and moving of automation data
• Quantize/Humanize automation points

[jamcat]

Studio One was first released in 2004 under the name KRISTAL Audio Engine (KAE), then another few iterations until purchased by Presonus. Interesting history.

They're not at all the same thing. Studio One evolved from K2, which was a development project that was built from a completely new and separate code base from KRISTAL Audio Engine.

To elaborate on this a bit more, KristalLabs actually became PreSonus Software. But the K2 codebase was never used in any publicly available software until the release of Studio One.

KristalLabs was founded by former Steinberg employees Wolfgang Kundrus and Matthias Juwan, who developed Cubase/Nuendo (Kundrus) and the VST3 spec (Juwan) while at Steinberg. K2 was built upon—and improved on—the knowledge Kundrus and Juwan gained developing KRISTAL, which was built upon—and improved on—the knowledge Kundrus and Juwan gained developing Nuendo/Cubase SX and its implementation of VST3. This is why Studio One is like a better Cubase.

[billcarroll]

Some good quotes from the article I posted above. I love how Studio One got the name.

I’m used to working on the Windows platform since I started programming as a kid. K2 was primarily developed using Visual Studio. The project file name used to be “studioapp” and it is still named this way today for Studio One. The majority of the code was written in a platform-agnostic way from the very beginning. I bought a used Power Mac from a co-worker and started porting my underlying application framework CCL to macOS with XCode.

And the heavy influence from K2

The K2 application prototype was pretty sophisticated and it had some of the fundamental designs people know and love today from Studio One already laid out.

I like Studio One and it has some incredible features. I'm not knocking it in any way. I just stopped using it because Cubase was a better fit for me when it comes to traditional DAW needs. I always loved the transform track feature, and the way you can get detailed performance info on every plugin. Those should be standard features in every DAW.

[Dogbert]

studio one was my favourite daw at windows.
but for me just not usable with the sync issue.
Doing daws and fohs for almost 30 years now.
so i think i know how to setup things.

Again, what sync issue?
And why it's not massively reported in the official forum?

[dellboy]

studio one was my favourite daw at windows.
but for me just not usable with the sync issue.
Doing daws and fohs for almost 30 years now.
so i think i know how to setup things.

Again, what sync issue?
And why it's not massively reported in the official forum?

Someone did post here back along in October about this, but one sole person having issues does not prove much at all. I notice that the person was on Mac Silicon which might have a bearing on it.......

viewtopic.php?t=587386&start=180

[jamcat]

I notice sergenas only has those 2 posts and hasn’t been back since.

I also notice that his problems (phasey audio) happens 70 tracks into songs with 200-300 audio tracks. (This is going to make BONES mad.)

Sergenas also said that PreSonus support told him his problems are related to specific plugins he’s using.

I have some experience with this, and some insight I can share.

First, I believe his problem is the result of using the VST2 versions of his plugins. VST2 is an inferior format that isn’t sample-accurate, unlike VST3.

For a while I was using Expressive E Arché Collection. These plugins seemed promising when they were released (even winning “Best of Show” from SonicState at NAMM 2019.) But they have since proven to be buggy abandonware and were never updated for VST3 or M1, or to fix their own phasey sync issues.

Arché Collection are physically modeled solo strings. I tried to create a virtual string section with them, but when I got to around 20 instances, I started getting really bad sync issues. Some instances would start playing really late. Attacks became weird and abrupt. There was a horrible phasey sound, and they would almost completely disappear in mixdown. All of this happened on Windows only, by the way. I could mixdown without any phase issues or audio loss on the Intel MacBook Pro I had at the time.

My solution was to ditch Arché Collection for Audio Modeling SWAM Solo Strings. They sound way more realistic and they support VST3 and M1, and I can use dozens of instances of them on both Windows and my M1 MacBook Pro up until I run out of CPU, without any issues.

[syntonica]

...
First, I believe his problem is the result of using the VST2 versions of his plugins. VST2 is an inferior format that isn’t sample-accurate, unlike VST3.
...

So not true. VST2 is as sample accurate as the programmer makes it. VST3 is inferior due to extremely poor midi handling, resulting in possible timing issues. VST3 is over-engineered and under-specced.

[jamcat]

You are incorrect on all of that. Stop listening to programmers who can't figure out VST3 and get away from their cult of fail.

Think about it: if they can't properly code VST3 plugins, why would you trust their VST2 plugins?
Everyone else is doing just fine.

[HcDoom]

I want to see better automation in Studio One.

Specifically:

• Ability to reassign existing automation data to a new instrument/track and/or parameter
• Automation part containers for easy copy/paste, duplication, and moving of automation data

This!!! Cant believe after all these years they still havent implemented this features properly. I mean, I love S1 - its my only DAW - but dealing with automations gives me headaches sometimes.

[billcarroll]

studio one was my favourite daw at windows.
but for me just not usable with the sync issue.
Doing daws and fohs for almost 30 years now.
so i think i know how to setup things.

Again, what sync issue?
And why it's not massively reported in the official forum?

Someone did post here back along in October about this, but one sole person having issues does not prove much at all. I notice that the person was on Mac Silicon which might have a bearing on it.......

viewtopic.php?t=587386&start=180

A quick Google search for “studio one PDC issues” turns up quite a few hits for v5 and v6.