Expressive E Imagine, physical modeling synth plugin in collaboration with AAS

[Michael L]

In this video by AAS, the player just used Chromaphone, the Expressive E Touche and pitchbend.

It shows why you don't need Imagine if you own Chromaphone.

[aMUSEd]

Whereas AAS's previous releases have used mathematical modelling to recreate the sound of real acoustic instruments, Imagine uses the same principles to generate unfamiliar tones that nonetheless exhibit realistic acoustic phenomena. It is thus possible to combine the attributes of drums and flutes, or tuned percussion with wind instruments, to create entirely new tones.

You can do all that in Chromaphone too. In fact with much more control by the sounds of it. The problem is it lacks some of the expression capabilities Imagine has - which I had hoped they would add.

[zzz00m]

I don't see any problem with Imagine, or any reason to buy it if you already own Chromaphone 3, as I do. I'm much more interested in Osmose.

Imagine is intended for a different use case...

[psynical]

Imagine is for sale on plugin boutique, which means there is also now a demo available...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... 57-Imagine

[aMUSEd]

Imagine is for sale on plugin boutique, which means there is also now a demo available...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... 57-Imagine

Yeah - so I caved. I like the sound and use of macros but it really needs full MPE - I am missing the ability to do smooth polyphonic pitchbends

[tommyzai]

I just noticed this thread. Anything AAS is involved in is worth investigating . . . IMO.

[M32]

Posting here as there doesn't seem to be any forum or official support for the Expressive E Imagine software.

I bought it about a year ago, tried it, got frustrated and haven't used it until recently.

I'm going to go on a bit of a complaint-rant here, mostly because this program has so much wasted potential. It's a crippled design that almost reduces it from a brilliant sounddesign tool to a dumb preset-browser.

With just a few simple tweaks, the quality of this product could be vastly improved.

I've submitted some bugs via mail, and got the reply 'that's for the next update'. That was almost a year ago. There's not going to be an update. this is abandonware. Possibly they'll re-use the engine for another cash-grab plugin somewhere down the line.

That's my cynical thinking. But somehow i hope someone might pick up on this and actually do something with it. Maybe i send them a copy of this post.

Here's the main big problems to the engine:

Everything revolves around pre-made instrument layer presets with obscure names. Clearly there's a few sound engine models that are used for all of these. But there's no way to select these individually, or easily see which presets are based on which.(1)

You can't even copy an instrument preset with its current settings from layer A to layer B, or save your own layer presets. (2)

There's mallet exciter category, noise/bow and sequencer.
Pretty neat sequencer, but you lose all tweakability on an instrument that uses it. You can only play a preset or change the sequence.
If you had only two categories, and the sequencer in addition, that would make the sequencer actually worthwile. Or you should at least be able to use the sequencer with a user-made sound (3)

The macro's are pretty cool, again with thousands of presets for the modulator. However a simple sample and hold is not one of them.(4)

Also, there is no way to delete all routings of a macro at once. You have to manually reset each routing to zero. Very time-consuming (5)

The instrument layer also doesn't have a proper level vca ADSR at the end. Bit of a shame, since this limits the sounddesign greatly. (6)
Mallet presets will turn full on and full off gate-style for the held duration of a note. sounds very unnatural. Less so when using mpe to control the gain, but sometimes you want to use this thing with a sequencer or arp.

There's a defect in the modulators, they can be multi-segmented, but generate unwanted clicks every time it goes from one segment to the next, even i f the value at the crossover is the same. (7)

parameters gain, oct, release and pan have sliders, you cannot type in absolute values, and it is a nightmare to dial in: oct(?) changes the pitch in semitones, but sometimes randomly skips a value, so it becomes near-impossible and time-consuming to for example detune one layer to a fifth. (8)

MPE/Midi mappings (the supposed main feature of the vst) have tons of bugs, for example mapping to the general gain/oct/rel/pan does not work correctly. mappings get created for the wrong parameter, can't be deleted, etc. (9)

The UI looks cool, but is horrible for my workflow, which is with full light on and being quite some distance from the screen.

A 2nd UI skin with white background, and more contrasting, primary colours for the different functions would be vastly easier to work with.
Especially since modulation values are indicated by thin dark purple rings around functions on a black background. (10)


issues 2,5,8 and 10 are super basic,quick and simple to implement.

1, 3, 4 and 6 would make this an instrument i can recommend.

7 and 9 are just bugs and i'm surprised these haven't been noticed or fixed. It almost feels as if they have no beta-testing team.


I made some nice sounds, using an external sequencer, lots of frustration and max4live lfo's. On its own the program is severery crippled and impossible to recommend.




bonus features i would love: individual low/highpass filters for layer A and B, possibly with their own ADSR. there's plenty of unused space on the effects page for the knobs.

[c_voltage]

Imagine is for sale on plugin boutique, which means there is also now a demo available...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... 57-Imagine

Sorry where at PB demoversion of this plug ? Or i misunderstood something.
(BTW now Imagine and Noisy at sale at PB)

[jamcat]

I've submitted some bugs via mail, and got the reply 'that's for the next update'. That was almost a year ago. There's not going to be an update. this is abandonware. Possibly they'll re-use the engine for another cash-grab plugin somewhere down the line.

I had an identical experience with Expressive E two or three years ago regarding Arché Collection. You hit the nail on the head with how this company operates. They are a scam. Never give them your money for anything.

[zerocrossing]

Imagine is for sale on plugin boutique, which means there is also now a demo available...
https://www.pluginboutique.com/product/ ... 57-Imagine

Sorry where at PB demoversion of this plug ? Or i misunderstood something.
(BTW now Imagine and Noisy at sale at PB)

As far as I can tell, there is no demo version. At least, I couldn't find one, so that's an instant no-buy for me. Also, I bought Noisy when it was released because the developer said, "MPE was coming." Well... that sure was a lie. Or maybe they meant, "in the year 2422." Also, I noticed that a month ago my Touché just stopped working. It literally sits on a desk unmoved. Expressive E will never get a dime from me, and I suggest others avoid them. I feel sorry for the saps who preorded the Osmose.

[aMUSEd]

Posting here as there doesn't seem to be any forum or official support for the Expressive E Imagine software.

I bought it about a year ago, tried it, got frustrated and haven't used it until recently.

I'm going to go on a bit of a complaint-rant here, mostly because this program has so much wasted potential. It's a crippled design that almost reduces it from a brilliant sounddesign tool to a dumb preset-browser.

With just a few simple tweaks, the quality of this product could be vastly improved.

I've submitted some bugs via mail, and got the reply 'that's for the next update'. That was almost a year ago. There's not going to be an update. this is abandonware. Possibly they'll re-use the engine for another cash-grab plugin somewhere down the line.

That's my cynical thinking. But somehow i hope someone might pick up on this and actually do something with it. Maybe i send them a copy of this post.

Here's the main big problems to the engine:

Everything revolves around pre-made instrument layer presets with obscure names. Clearly there's a few sound engine models that are used for all of these. But there's no way to select these individually, or easily see which presets are based on which.(1)

You can't even copy an instrument preset with its current settings from layer A to layer B, or save your own layer presets. (2)

There's mallet exciter category, noise/bow and sequencer.
Pretty neat sequencer, but you lose all tweakability on an instrument that uses it. You can only play a preset or change the sequence.
If you had only two categories, and the sequencer in addition, that would make the sequencer actually worthwile. Or you should at least be able to use the sequencer with a user-made sound (3)

The macro's are pretty cool, again with thousands of presets for the modulator. However a simple sample and hold is not one of them.(4)

Also, there is no way to delete all routings of a macro at once. You have to manually reset each routing to zero. Very time-consuming (5)

The instrument layer also doesn't have a proper level vca ADSR at the end. Bit of a shame, since this limits the sounddesign greatly. (6)
Mallet presets will turn full on and full off gate-style for the held duration of a note. sounds very unnatural. Less so when using mpe to control the gain, but sometimes you want to use this thing with a sequencer or arp.

There's a defect in the modulators, they can be multi-segmented, but generate unwanted clicks every time it goes from one segment to the next, even i f the value at the crossover is the same. (7)

parameters gain, oct, release and pan have sliders, you cannot type in absolute values, and it is a nightmare to dial in: oct(?) changes the pitch in semitones, but sometimes randomly skips a value, so it becomes near-impossible and time-consuming to for example detune one layer to a fifth. (8)

MPE/Midi mappings (the supposed main feature of the vst) have tons of bugs, for example mapping to the general gain/oct/rel/pan does not work correctly. mappings get created for the wrong parameter, can't be deleted, etc. (9)

The UI looks cool, but is horrible for my workflow, which is with full light on and being quite some distance from the screen.

A 2nd UI skin with white background, and more contrasting, primary colours for the different functions would be vastly easier to work with.
Especially since modulation values are indicated by thin dark purple rings around functions on a black background. (10)


issues 2,5,8 and 10 are super basic,quick and simple to implement.

1, 3, 4 and 6 would make this an instrument i can recommend.

7 and 9 are just bugs and i'm surprised these haven't been noticed or fixed. It almost feels as if they have no beta-testing team.


I made some nice sounds, using an external sequencer, lots of frustration and max4live lfo's. On its own the program is severery crippled and impossible to recommend.




bonus features i would love: individual low/highpass filters for layer A and B, possibly with their own ADSR. there's plenty of unused space on the effects page for the knobs.

Yeah I agree - and it's basically just a remodelled Chromaphone anyway with some additional modulation (all of which AAS users have been asking for in Chromaphone since it first came out)

[c_voltage]

As far as I can tell, there is no demo version. At least, I couldn't find one, so that's an instant no-buy for me. Also, I bought Noisy when it was released because the developer said, "MPE was coming." Well... that sure was a lie. Or maybe they meant, "in the year 2422." Also, I noticed that a month ago my Touché just stopped working. It literally sits on a desk unmoved. Expressive E will never get a dime from me, and I suggest others avoid them. I feel sorry for the saps who preorded the Osmose.

Oh ok i see, thanks.

Sadly although, i quite liked presets demonstration (but also have Chromaphone 2).
But yes, without demo (and considering such feedbacks) happy pass. Especially BF ahead of.

[tlkmx]

Did they ended up updating it ?
I have chromaphone 3 and it seems like this add the needed modulations but i'm weirded out that it doesnt do mpe. From them its odd af

[tlkmx]

Lol actually no mpe and i dont see where they talk about including it. It's shyt

[SLiC]

I was convinced this would be MPE- once the Osmose came out…I haven’t given up all hope…