advance "reverb and gate" effect on "Die another day" from Madonna

[Krakatau]

i'm opening this thread to find a detailed description of the advance "reverb and gate" effect used on the string section of the song "die another day" sung by madonna, edited twenty years ago (already!!!)

I assume there is a subbtle combination of classic reverb-and-gate effect depending on signal level and a gate effet controlled by a sequencer, because it's seems very accurate to be done with the only signal level , ...that would have been very tricky to get a satifying result !



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlbaJA7aO9M

[Krakatau]

...in fact my question is : - Any insiders that might describe to us the make up of these gated strings part of this production accurately ?

because it's really brilliant !

[tehlord]

If you're talking about the gated effect in the intro, it's just that. An on/off gate on the dry and wet signal. Nothing complicated about it really.

[Krakatau]

no just the intro ...but all the strings section reverb included, through the entire title
...so you undermean it's a sequenced gate ?

by listening a bit carefully it seems very likely that it isn't related to the signal level as it would be with a so to say classical "reverb and gate" effect (...or not ONLY at the signal level !!!)

[Krakatau]

let me here give you a cenesthetic comparison of a similar effect coming from a production of Michael Jackson, listen to the sample playing in the background from 2'47'`to 3'06'' you'll notice the repeating depth induce by the huge reverb included in the sample, i've been looking for a similar feel given mainly by surrealistic painters in their visual imagery

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjkAydP ... RT&index=6

depositphotos_210903204-stock-photo-original-oil-painting-based-salvador.jpg

1c11f1eccb1ce113f7b4deb77cf6d32b.jpg

download.jpg

the last one being from a cover from van der graaf generator during late sixties...

[Jac459]

Can you point to a specific moment of the song ? Because there is a lot going on.

From an "historical" standpoint in electronic music, I do consider that Mirwais (the producer of the song) was the first to really have high level of expressivity in electro. With sounds really transforming over time and following the music like if it was a real player. This is common now but it wasn't 20 years ago.
He also did a great song in the BO of Snatch (and a super famous song used on a Mac Do advertisement).

I am curious if you know an artist which was having the same level of control on his sounds BEFORE him ?

[Krakatau]

Can you point to a specific moment of the song ? Because there is a lot going on.

yes i can, as said before : between 2'47'' and 3'08'' you can hear in the backgroung this sample with a huge feel of dimension induce by the included reverb inside it

From an "historical" standpoint in electronic music, I do consider that Mirwais (the producer of the song) was the first to really have high level of expressivity in electro. With sounds really transforming over time and following the music like if it was a real player. This is common now but it wasn't 20 years ago.

i totally agree, it wasn't common at all, at these times

I am curious if you know an artist which was having the same level of control on his sounds BEFORE him ?

i'd love to, but i'm afraid not...

[Jac459]

yes i can, as said before : between 2'47'' and 3'08'' you can hear in the backgroung this sample with a huge feel of dimension induce by the included reverb inside it
 

Sorry, I was meaning on the madonna one. To me I would try 3 things to approach this:
1 - As said, a controlled gated reverb.
2 - A reverb using convolution with a huge hall for which you cut the tail very early (you can do that with Bitwig and Kilohearts, not too sure about others.
3 - A reverb allowing a control on the kind of reflexions you get and I would try to keep only early reflexion and suppress all the others...

Your question is more on how it was done, sorry. I am unable to tell.

[osiris]

Send the channel to another. Put the gate after the reverb. Voila. Gated Reverb. Your probably going to have to mess with filters so frequencies don't clash. I listen to the song and it's a simple on/off gate on a portion of the music. It could also be just a simple edit. In FL you can slice audio and drag it to whatever length you want.

[Krakatau]

Send the channel to another. Put the gate after the reverb. Voila. Gated Reverb. Your probably going to have to mess with filters so frequencies don't clash. I listen to the song and it's a simple on/off gate on a portion of the music. It could also be just a simple edit. In FL you can slice audio and drag it to whatever length you want.

At a certain degree, I agree with this 2nd statement, the gate seems accurate at some times and absent at others, this is why I expect a sequenced triggering in the strings section rather than a conventional reverb and gate process chain based on the only input signal level

Or, indeed, as you're pointing at, a detailed work of sliced audio of the strings sountake

[Krakatau]

yes i can, as said before : between 2'47'' and 3'08'' you can hear in the backgroung this sample with a huge feel of dimension induce by the included reverb inside it
 

Sorry, I was meaning on the madonna one. To me I would try 3 things to approach this:
1 - As said, a controlled gated reverb.
2 - A reverb using convolution with a huge hall for which you cut the tail very early (you can do that with Bitwig and Kilohearts, not too sure about others.
3 - A reverb allowing a control on the kind of reflexions you get and I would try to keep only early reflexion and suppress all the others...

Your question is more on how it was done, sorry. I am unable to tell.

Oooops ...silly me !

On this peculiar case, I assume that it cannot be either 2 or 3 because there is this typical artifact (or what is usually considered as) in where the end of the initial reverb is reappearing at the
reopening of the gate, giving this typical feel associated to the "reverb and gate" effect (that's seems brilliant to me here to have fund a relevant use into a production), ...or eventually by slicing in detail the soundtake that might contain the entire string section

[bluesawsq]

Not related to the OP's question, but the sound quality is awful on that 'Madonna - Die Another Day (Official Video)'. Some strange phase issue, and the right channel is much louder than left. I guess they somehow messed up the encoding for Youtube.
You can easily find the same track with much better sound quality:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNYlNmWfnxo

[Jac459]

yes i can, as said before : between 2'47'' and 3'08'' you can hear in the backgroung this sample with a huge feel of dimension induce by the included reverb inside it
 

Sorry, I was meaning on the madonna one. To me I would try 3 things to approach this:
1 - As said, a controlled gated reverb.
2 - A reverb using convolution with a huge hall for which you cut the tail very early (you can do that with Bitwig and Kilohearts, not too sure about others.
3 - A reverb allowing a control on the kind of reflexions you get and I would try to keep only early reflexion and suppress all the others...

Your question is more on how it was done, sorry. I am unable to tell.

Oooops ...silly me !

On this peculiar case, I assume that it cannot be either 2 or 3 because there is this typical artifact (or what is usually considered as) in where the end of the initial reverb is reappearing at the
reopening of the gate, giving this typical feel associated to the "reverb and gate" effect (that's seems brilliant to me here to have fund a relevant use into a production), ...or eventually by slicing in detail the soundtake that might contain the entire string section

Yeah I think you are right for 3.
For 2, it could be an IR closing and reopening.(like a drum loop for example).
But I agree with you, it is unlikely.

[kingozrecords]

I don't really like fl studio 21, tbh - But their new reverb built in does most of these things, and I'm impressed with it. Too bad they simplified the controls a bit, one of the better clients.

The old ssl xverb on a bus track with a noise gate does it well. Not sure how the new one sounds.

My big problem with the new fl studio 21 is that the macros to disable plugins smartly does not seem to affect the cpu usage as it should, furthermore; even disabled automation channels seem to slow the whole process. What's really disappointing is that even if you are a stickler for details, and disable effect chains on your rack; the toll on memory is nearly the same, with no unsetting. I was surprised when working on a large track using synths, that even after consolidating; I was still peaking, and there was dissonance resulting from latency.

Furthermore, Edison, unlike in fl studio 11 is no longer un-impeded by lag and latency (not sample accurate, so to avoid these phenomenon) and you are forced to arm tracks for the purpose of recording. Nothing ever did it as smoothly as the old edison.

Overall, if fl studio cleans these things up; with the new controls for crossfading, and the less finnicky midi-channel naming conventions set in place (the bane of fl studio 20); there's a lot of hope for the product.