Push 3 or Maschine MK3 or others?

[BrainBeatMusic]

Hi guys, I am an Ableton Live user and this week's release of the Push 3 it has gotten me interested in possibly investing in a controller/ sequencer/groovebox-type device that might keep my music creation interesting and hopefully more efficient. I already have a launch key 25 and a minifreak which both are great but my gas makes me feel like there is something missing.

I mostly have nearly exclusively made music using VST plugins as I have not gotten into sampling much yet but do have a good collection ready waiting if I do. So what I am wondering is if I do make the investment in something what should it be? I am probably not looking for a Dawless setup unless it is the obvious choice or in the case of the push as an optional upgrade. I am in Australia so has to be available locally and priced under my current $1500 AUD budget and am in no hurry to buy so am willing to wait if more devices are coming.

So far below are what I am looking at with their +/- but would love any feedback from those who have used the devices.

Ableton Push 3 (not standalone)

+Integrated with Ableton Live
+Newly released ( should have long-term support)
+Upgradable to stand-alone in future.
+Can host a USB controller
+Audio interface (limited but expandable)
+Works with native and most Max for live plugins
+Mpe
+8x8 pad grid with lots of dedicated buttons and dials

-$1499 AUD (at the upper limit of my budget)
-Doesn't support vst
-Doesn't have arrangement view so you still need a PC to finish most tracks
-Limited audio interface may need extra hardware to expand.
-Only usable with Ableton Live? (I assume)
-Upgrade costs $100 more than buying standalone


Native Instruments Maschine MK 3

+ Its priced a bit cheaper than much of the competition
+ Full Factory Library (8 GB) + KOMPLETE SELECT
+ On sale with higher Komplete tiers
+ Works with most DAWs
+3rd party VST support
+ enough controls to get what you want to do
+ a good selection of ports for connecting other devices to it
+midi in and out

- A few years old and possibly up for another facelift
-no touch screen (I hear some don't like this)
- not upgradable to standalone in future
- I hear it can take some menu diving to find some things
- I think you can't host a USB midi controller

[BrainBeatMusic]

reserved for more devices

[fedexnman]

Do you already own Live 11 ? Look Push3 is still cheaper than iPhone14 , after you buy the charger cord , charging block and case to go with it. $1000 .... You could also go the USED route and get a Push2 and also get a USED Maschine Micro MK3 for under that.

[fedexnman]

Or a USED Launchpad Pro or X and a USED Maschine .... I'd go the PUSH3 route personally ...

[VariKusBrainZ]

If you’re after something that can operate standalone then the MPC Live and such are great. Can be had for cheap 2nd hand and internal drive can be upgraded from its measly 16 gigs

[SLiC]

If your a Live user then PUSH is as good as it gets. Maschine is OK for beats, but it's no Live! Remember as well if you love the PUSH 3 controller you can upgrade it to 'standalone' at a later date- cant do that with the Machine controller!

I also have an MPC Live, but the workflow is totally different, quite a steep learning curve if you are not used to MPCs but with PUSH you will be at home strait away.

As has been said, never been a better time to pick up a cheap PUSH 2 (I am about to sell mine as I just bought a PUSH 3 Standalone!) or just bite the bullet and get a PUSH 3 controller but you may be in for a wait as they all seem sold out!

[BrainBeatMusic]

Thanks for the responses so far I really appreciate it. Yes I have Live 11 Suite already and while I occasionally experiment with other DAWs I don't think it is likely I will be changing.

I meant to say something about the Akai products I am not interested in running dawless so while I am sure they are good I don't think I would be happy with any of them. As they I think are mostly setup for just using samples that is not how I prefer to make my music so while they are probably great groove boxes I am not sure they are on my list.

On the topic of 2nd hand I am probably not that interested too unless I can get a great deal, especially for the Maschine options as half the point in getting them is to have the software which unless they are selling that too I think I heard it was over $100 USD to get a new one. Doing a quick eBay search I didn't find many local ones for sale at the moment too and most seem closer to retail pricing while still being 2nd hand. I would also prefer to have a warranty if possible when you are spending that much on a device you would want some piece of mind that it is going to work for the next few years.

Lastly, I am in no hurry to buy anything I was hoping to just start a discussion with the who have devices and see what they like and don't like. Given the Push and other devices have been released recently I am thinking there will have to be a Maschine MK4 sooner than later and would be willing to wait for it if there was a chance it was going to offer similar functionality and upgrades that the Push 3 has. I am also happy to wait for a Push to arrive in a local music store to see it in person and maybe see if it might even come with a discount closer to the end of the year (Black Friday etc).
One possible cheaper option I am wondering about that should at least give me a drum machine is the Roland AIRA T-8 which is only $299 AUD but may be a waste if I were to get one of the more full-featured devices.

[SLiC]

I can't really think of a reason why you would want a Maschine controller over the the Push Controller unless you really prefer Maschine workflow over Lives workflow. Given that all the PUSH3 controllers sold out and seem to be on 8-10 weeks backorder it could be a long wait either way!

[fedexnman]

Yep 8 weeks ...crazy ...

[pdxindy]

Hi guys, I am an Ableton Live user and this week's release of the Push 3 it has gotten me interested in possibly investing in a controller/ sequencer/groovebox-type device that might keep my music creation interesting and hopefully more efficient. I already have a launch key 25 and a minifreak which both are great but my gas makes me feel like there is something missing.

I suggest you look for a way to get your hands on a Push 2 and try it out some. Maybe there is a local store or something. And if you do, try doing everything you want for working.

I think a lot of Push videos are incomplete and often create something of a false impression. What I mean by that, is they show only part of the process. Many of such videos it is all set up for performing something so it looks very fast... but doesn't show the prep work that went into it.

Doing sound design on the Push is clumsy compared to on the computer. Whether you find Push a workflow advantage depends on what and how you do it. If you mainly work with Ableton Instruments and FX, Push is smoother, but less so with 3rd party plugins. If you use Arrange more often, Push is less useful.

I found the big screen and mouse more efficient than using Push so mine ended up packed in the closet. That's why I suggest you look around for a hands on opportunity before spending what is quite a bit of cash.

[rod_zero]

Push (not stand alone) can load your plugins into tracks.

You can also configure which parameters and the order they are presented (in Live) to any controller using a remote script, as Push, so yes you can control plugins form Push.

Configure.png

[BrainBeatMusic]

I would say I mostly am using 3rd party plugins for sounds but use a mix for effects. I will often do my sound design in clip view and then arrange everything in arrangement view. This is part of the reason I was at least looking at the Mashine as you would seem to be able to use 3rd party plunins for the sounds at least but if you can do the same as mentioned above that is good to know. I think there will be an issue trying to try out a Push 2 without owning it as I think they were sold out months ago if not longer here. Also given push 2 need to be connected to a computer I am not sure many music shops will have one setup just so you can try out a controller.

[rod_zero]

I would say I mostly am using 3rd party plugins for sounds but use a mix for effects. I will often do my sound design in clip view and then arrange everything in arrangement view. This is part of the reason I was at least looking at the Mashine as you would seem to be able to use 3rd party plunins for the sounds at least but if you can do the same as mentioned above that is good to know. I think there will be an issue trying to try out a Push 2 without owning it as I think they were sold out months ago if not longer here. Also given push 2 need to be connected to a computer I am not sure many music shops will have one setup just so you can try out a controller.

Look for one second hand, people are unloading them for low prices now.

[SLiC]

PUSH 2 will be around (and supported) for a long time and will continue to hold a decent value I think (as the cheapest PUSH you can but in the stores now is $1000)

[BrainBeatMusic]

Does anyone have any opinion on the gear from Novation, Elektron, Polyend, Rolland and others?

So far the best price I can see locally for a Push 2 is $500 AUD which to me sounds like a lot of money for a superseded and 2nd hand piece for equipment that would likely be without a warranty. Sure that is about 50% off the last RRP I think and 1k off the 3 but would feel more comfortable about risking a bit less if I were to go that way. I could also get a brand new Novation controller (there are a few options) for about that price.