KVR Audio

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 10:45 am

Why is it that the music I want to buy is rarely in the shops? It could be considered specialist (breakbeat...), and therefore wouldn't sell much. What annoys me is that it feels to me that stores such as HMV and Virgin are increasingly limiting the stock they sell so that they only sell stuff that they will sell in volume. That makes sense from a business perspective, but given that these stores probably account for 90% of all sales, is it any wonder that we end up with mainstream crap in the charts?

It feels like a bit of a chicken and egg scenario. Do these stores only sell mainstream pop as it sells and therefore charts, or do the charts themselves define what a store should sell?

Either way it annoys me that choices seem to narrowing and I can't buy what I want - this results in me not buying anything so I can't see who wins?

Any thoughts?

Sorry a bit heavy from me on a Monday morning...

Ja.x · Post by **Ja.x** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 10:55 am

From the "business" point of view it only makes sense to aim at the masses, not at the minority, "educated" listeners (i.e. people who hear music a lot and as an opinion about what they listen to). That's why the industry is eating itself and blaming everything but their own rules.

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:09 am

I get the reasons why, it just really annoys me. SO I suppose my original post was more of a rant than a question/discussion...

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:17 am

...and thats why they invented Amazon.

Honestly, I almost only ever buy from Virgin or HMV or whatever these days when its stuff thats heavily on sale (5 DVDs for £30 sort of thing)

original flipper · Post by **original flipper** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:19 am

HI

Perhaps a bit off tangent but having worked with young people, students & young offenders (in no particular order!) for the last 15 years I would say that every potential 'younger' buyer of music in that group has a vast genre base to choose from - unlike 20-20 years ago we now have so many 'styles' of music that no one genre is as prominent as you might think.

A typical group of 6 teenagers could spawn a 'goth', an R&B smoothie, a Jungle lover, a Revive rocker, a Kylie cuttie a Hip-Hopper or mainstream top of the pops buyer!

So as you can see it is probably difficult stocking a definitive collection of wares for such a varied market, it also means that potential artists don't have the mass market out there any more, unless they hit the 'G' spot!

Flipper.

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:20 am

good point. I suppose it dogs me off that I can't go into a shop and buy what I want when I want it because I don't live in one of the major cities. The other thing is that I like to browse and listen before I buy.

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:41 am

The other question it raises in my (tiny) mind is, if you speak to most people, they'll state that they don't listen or buy music that's in the charts. It's almost as if there are two music cultures - mainstream pop and 'real' music. Now I know that teenagers have the most disposable income but do their purchases really outweigh the rest of the population?

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:52 am

Only because they are easier to manipulate with trendy marketing.
In my experience the big HMV in Sydney has the most diverse range of music in the whole damned city. When I couldn't get the new Rammstein album from the Goth/Industrial section in the big alternative store they had about a dozen on the shelves in HMV. Same for the last WIRE album and a lot of re-releases. HMV is usually now my first stop. I only resort to amazon.com when I cannot support the retailers.

original flipper · Post by **original flipper** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 12:46 pm

HI

I can tell you that in many places I have worked young people are given CD/Tape players and it goes without saying that a lot of 'Sharing' via tape recording is common, but that is standard - it happerned back in the 70's with me and my friends, but saying that I spent 10 years LIVING in record shops and spending 50% of my income on music.

I think the file sharing sites have not helped, I also think the tactile aspect of an album/12" vinyl felt like you had a tangable product whereas I have never felt that with CD's and have not as yet bought a CD!

Flipper.

zerobae · Post by **zerobae** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:04 pm

"More than half of Amazon's book sales come from outside its top 130.000 titles. Rhapsody streams more songs each month beyond its top 10.000 than it does its top 10.000."

Check out this brilliant article called "The Long Tail" in Wired Magazine. Really worth a read!

Zerobae

psycontinuum · Post by **psycontinuum** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:19 pm

original flipper wrote:HI
I have never felt that with CD's and have not as yet bought a CD!

weird. Can't like music that much then, given that 99.99% of it has been released on CD in the last decade or more. What a bizarre admission, and a verrrry strange thing to be proud of!
Loony!

CypherOne · Post by **CypherOne** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:20 pm

psycontinuum wrote:
original flipper wrote:HI
I have never felt that with CD's and have not as yet bought a CD!
weird. Can't like music that much then, given that 99.99% of it has been released on CD in the last decade or more. What a bizarre admission, and a verrrry strange thing to be proud of!
Loony!

no, I think he's actually just a really prolific shoplifter.

Ja.x · Post by **Ja.x** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:33 pm

BONES wrote:.... When I couldn't get the new Rammstein album from the Goth/Industrial section in the big alternative store ...

In the various times I was in Germany (different towns) I could find Rammstein stuff all over the place. Obvious, right? But on the other hand I tried to find stuff by Michael Rother, and not only there wasn't anything available, but no one had ever heard of him (Michael who? Well, a founding member of Kraftwerk, NEU!, Harmonia, etc. nine solo albuns... that's who). In his own country! In the meantime he's selling through his website. Call it a problem of marketing, distribution, whatever.

The problem with big corporations is that they are not looking for profits, but for HUGE profits, otherwise stakeholders will place their money somewhere else. Music as a business is splitting more and more between the charts crap from the big corporations (what I call macmusic), and the alternative sources where real interesting stuff is popping up (like KVR). And the gap is increasing with the DIY approach that step by step is getting into our lives. In the last 3-4 years I almost haven't bought a CD, but listening to my own music and from other people's on KVR, Soundclick, etc. Far more interesting. It's only me? Or if not, what does it mean?

zerobae · Post by **zerobae** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:45 pm

jax wrote: The problem with big corporations is that they are not looking for profits, but for HUGE profits

Good point

And the gap is increasing with the DIY approach that step by step is getting into our lives.

- which in return means it's becoming cool to find weird/exotic/rare/precious stuff and play it to your friends (and yourself).

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:52 pm

jax wrote:In the last 3-4 years I almost haven't bought a CD, but listening to my own music and from other people's on KVR, Soundclick, etc. Far more interesting. It's only me? Or if not, what does it mean?

I don't find that at all. I have only ever found two songs on the 'net that I wopuld actually want to listen to. I just find that there is less and less good music around so I buy fewer and fewer CD's. I look just as hard but there is f**k-all out there that interests me these days. I probably buy more remastered versions of CD's I already own than new works.

Thoughts on the music industry - CD sales in particular