Tal J-8

[CoolColJ]

I have been comparing the various JP8 emulation filters and I noticed the Roland one gets louder when you increase resonance, similar behaviour to old digital filters in their Samplers and synths of that era, and other software filters.
Analog filters of all the Roland gear is the opposite, volume gets much lower as resonance is increased, except in 12db mode
It makes you wonder how much modelling they actually did.....

The Arturia one doesn't change volume too much.
Tal J-8 does a bit

[CoolColJ]

Shoot TAL a request for native SFC-8 support.

Patrick replied to my request pretty quickly, saying that support for SFC-8 is on the "TODO" list, and he hopes he can add it "in the next few weeks." I am glad he is already aware of it.

I also requested support for aftertouch over MIDI, preferable polyphonic aftertouch.

He told me Aftertouch is coming in next update, soon, plus arp fixes, to make it act like the JP8 when using 8 notes
I also put in a vote for native SFC-8 support and poly aftertouch

I have an SQ80, and soon Hydrasynth explorer (and maybe deluxe) for poly aftertouch

---
Thanks for testing. The behavior of the portamento on the hardware is as follows:

- If you press a portamento melody that has less than 8 notes, then portamento disappears after 8 notes playing.
- If you press a portamento melody that has more than 8 notes (for example chord with 3 notes over 4 octaves) then the portamento stays because the synth does not have enough voices and has to reuse them.

Unfortunately, the plugin still acts a bit randomly in some situations. I will have another look at this.

The portamento is always based on the previously played note on that voice. Setting the number of voices to 1 is the best option to have a good sounding portamento I guess.

[Septic Underground]

I also put in a vote for native SFC-8 support and poly aftertouch

Great, much appreciated.

[marzzz]

I also put in a vote for native SFC-8 support and poly aftertouch

Also appreciated! I have several polyAT keyboards and would really love to control even some basic modulation destinations (VCF cutoff, VCA, LFO speed/depth). The SFC-8 is amazing, well worth what i paid for it because it feels like I am programming an actual J8. Also useful for other VSTs because you can use it to cover basic functions.

[CoolColJ]

I have an Roland MKS-80, and even though I have the programmer for it, I think the SFC-8 will be nice for it as well.
The Hydrasynth Deluxe has a nice spot on the right for it , with that add on shelf

I can't think of a better a combo for Soft synth control than these two together - 6 octaves, ribbon controller, poly aftertouch, OLED screen that show the names of the parameters, buttons that pull up settings onto the screen for the 8 knobs around it, and the SFC-8 for the immediate tactile control.

Only thing missing is the an XY controller, breath controller and vector joystick - but I can use my Technics WSA1 for that, it has two Trackballs - one spring loaded and the other not. And a Yamaha VL1 for breath control.

Hydrasynth midi out into SFC-8, its midi out into MKS-80, and USB midi into DAW for TAL J-8

[CoolColJ]

SFC-8 support should be around the corner.
Patrick told me he already sent a version to Soundforce for testing

[EvilDragon]

I have been comparing the various JP8 emulation filters

Familiar face from GS, hehe!

Wanted to ask you, since you were comparing the various JP8 emulations (and IIRC you owned or still do own a real one), what say you on the complete lack of phase noise in J-8's oscillators? This seems like quite a weird design choice for an emulation of a vintage analog synth...

To showcase this:

1. Load default patch
2. Go to SC panel, set Intensity to minimum and press Random. This will reset all the trimmers to the default
3. Set the VCO-2 Fine Tune knob to default as well

Now play any key repeatedly and every note will sound exactly the same without any phase noise whatsoever.

I don't think this should be possible even if all the trimmers are set to the default. You cannot get any analog VCO to behave like this, ever. And IIRC you cannot get this sort of deadness from either Roland's or Arturia's emulations either (so they got it right at the very least in that regard).

[Sawtooth Fairy]

I have been comparing the various JP8 emulation filters

Familiar face from GS, hehe!

Wanted to ask you, since you were comparing the various JP8 emulations (and IIRC you owned or still do own a real one), what say you on the complete lack of phase noise in J-8's oscillators? This seems like quite a weird design choice for an emulation of a vintage analog synth...

To showcase this:

1. Load default patch
2. Go to SC panel, set Intensity to minimum and press Random. This will reset all the trimmers to the default
3. Set the VCO-2 Fine Tune knob to default as well

Now play any key repeatedly and every note will sound exactly the same without any phase noise whatsoever.

I don't think this should be possible even if all the trimmers are set to the default. You cannot get any analog VCO to behave like this, ever. And IIRC you cannot get this sort of deadness from either Roland's or Arturia's emulations either (so they got it right at the very least in that regard).

So why set those trimmers to zero (is that the default?), when you do not want that static sound? Who forces you to do so?

[EvilDragon]

You're missing the point. A vintage analog emulation should always have phase noise in the oscillators. Always! The above scenario should not be possible, trimmers or no trimmers.

[zvenx]

ED, I know you have mentioned this before here, have you mentioned it to Patrick? As cool j says he is working on a new update, maybe it might be a good reminder for him to address this.
rsp

[EvilDragon]

I might as well!

[Sawtooth Fairy]

You're missing the point. A vintage analog emulation should always have phase noise in the oscillators. Always! The above scenario should not be possible, trimmers or no trimmers.

I was just playing around with the trimmer panel and noticed that the problem seems to be that as long as you do not play more notes than you specified in the voice selector, the synth assigns the same voice to the same note again and again. Thus there is no pitch variation as you play the same note again and again, ultimately turning the repeated notes into a single long note because of the pick-up mode of the envelopes.

If you exceed the number of allowed voices, though, it assigns another voice to that note and you get the variation.

In Retrologue2 that is rather different. There is only a single pitch randomization knob for the entire synth. But it works fine. I set it to like .5 and the same note sounds slightly different each time I play it, leading to pleasant overlapping with longer release times. Regardless of how many voices I have allowed.

Sometimes less is more...

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

I might as well!

Yeah, it's been a few years since this was first raised. Perhaps wouldn't hurt to bump again. The trimmer panel kind of made me forget about because once you slightly detune the OSCs between voices you get some beating, but ideally they'd be free running and not phase locked.

I love that we're getting to the point where whether OSCs are phase locked or not or replicating some obscure Arp behavior are the only things left to do.

[CoolColJ]

I have been comparing the various JP8 emulation filters

Familiar face from GS, hehe!

Wanted to ask you, since you were comparing the various JP8 emulations (and IIRC you owned or still do own a real one), what say you on the complete lack of phase noise in J-8's oscillators? This seems like quite a weird design choice for an emulation of a vintage analog synth...

To showcase this:

1. Load default patch
2. Go to SC panel, set Intensity to minimum and press Random. This will reset all the trimmers to the default
3. Set the VCO-2 Fine Tune knob to default as well

Now play any key repeatedly and every note will sound exactly the same without any phase noise whatsoever.

I don't think this should be possible even if all the trimmers are set to the default. You cannot get any analog VCO to behave like this, ever. And IIRC you cannot get this sort of deadness from either Roland's or Arturia's emulations either (so they got it right at the very least in that regard).

Yes I thought it was weird, but upon testing mine, my earlier JP8A model drifts far less than you think.
I believe Tal's JP8 is a later 14 bit model which has improved tuning accuracy

My Roland Jupiter 8a - warmed up and after autotuning upon boot up.
Dual sawtooth oscillators, with minimal detuning to start.
Even my earlier 12 bit model doesn't drift much, and the later revision drifts even less.

https://soundcloud.com/coolcolj/roland- ... al_sharing

[CoolColJ]

You're missing the point. A vintage analog emulation should always have phase noise in the oscillators. Always! The above scenario should not be possible, trimmers or no trimmers.

I was just playing around with the trimmer panel and noticed that the problem seems to be that as long as you do not play more notes than you specified in the voice selector, the synth assigns the same voice to the same note again and again. Thus there is no pitch variation as you play the same note again and again, ultimately turning the repeated notes into a single long note because of the pick-up mode of the envelopes.

If you exceed the number of allowed voices, though, it assigns another voice to that note and you get the variation.

In Retrologue2 that is rather different. There is only a single pitch randomization knob for the entire synth. But it works fine. I set it to like .5 and the same note sounds slightly different each time I play it, leading to pleasant overlapping with longer release times. Regardless of how many voices I have allowed.

Sometimes less is more...

Use the Jp8 oscillator mode or Round robin, if you want J-8 to cycle through the voices