Sad state of Native Instruments

[BBFG#]

I feel the bigger issue is how much they blast us with potentially good products that never get realized as something that surpasses their glory of their laurels that their fans seem to want them to rest on. Seriously, 75% of their offerings are mediocre to potentially good ideas thrown onto a discarded pile of junk bloat.

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

And I won't rehash "specifics" that have been discussed ad infinitum.
That only confirms that people are either not paying attention or just won't get the point anyway.

[machinesworking]

I feel the bigger issue is how much they blast us with potentially good products that never get realized as something that surpasses their glory of their laurels that their fans seem to want them to rest on. Seriously, 75% of their offerings are mediocre to potentially good ideas thrown onto a discarded pile of junk bloat.

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

And I won't rehash "specifics" that have been discussed ad infinitum.
That only confirms that people are either not paying attention or just won't get the point anyway.

All I've been saying since the beginning is that's always been how it is with them. They release a mega ton of product, package it in Komplete for a tempting price etc. but for most people it's just bloatware with Reaktor and Kontakt as the super useful products. I would bet that Massive X v2 answers half of user complaints, but comes out way too late. That's been how it is forever with them.

and yeah I hate Native Access, total PITA to use. Most companies installers are terrible but the fact that you still can't independently choose per plug in where a sample library gets installed is BS.

[noiseboyuk]

IMO the problem is expectations VS the market. I think it's obvious that NI are going harder after two segments that aren't particularly represented here at KVR, commercial and TV composers and DJ/producers. The Play series appeals to both those markets but doesn't appeal to what I would say a large portion of what KVR is made up of, bedroom composers, solo electronic musicians putting out independent releases etc. That audience as a whole, wants more granular control over the sound, and longevity in the plug ins they use.

So NI put out massive amounts of content in the Komplete line up, and a lot of it is Play level romplers which are massively useful if you're a television composer on a tight schedule, and orchestral instruments which of course come in handy. At the same time they decide to stop developing Absynth since the cost will be more hiring the original developer to work on it etc. They announce in the forums that at the moment resources for Reaktor development are slim, and leave Massive X the hot mess of an interface that it is. It's no wonder this thread exists here.

Oh and to cement this difference I just installed Komplete 14 the other day with at least 6 new libraries for Massive X, i.e. support for Komplete Kontrol keyboards, deadline oriented TV producers, and DJs just cutting their teeth on producing.

I'm with you for most of this, but imo the Play series is not much use to jobbing composers. They all have Omni which is super-fast to work with, and - crucially - it's a one-stop shop. If there's 20 Play series libraries all scattered everywhere, it would take far too long to wonder which one(s) have something appropriate. So I think this series is aimed at the simple users set.

In theory Komplete Kontrol could help, but it's such a total shambles it doesn't really do much in practice.

This disparate nature of the libraries is a problem in other areas, such as the drummer series. IMO it would be a lot more useful if they consolidated the lot into one plugin where you could install the expansions you have, and would enable to mix and match a la Toontrack. As it is, it's all a PITA.

[machinesworking]

I'm with you for most of this, but imo the Play series is not much use to jobbing composers. They all have Omni which is super-fast to work with, and - crucially - it's a one-stop shop. If there's 20 Play series libraries all scattered everywhere, it would take far too long to wonder which one(s) have something appropriate. So I think this series is aimed at the simple users set.

In theory Komplete Kontrol could help, but it's such a total shambles it doesn't really do much in practice.

This disparate nature of the libraries is a problem in other areas, such as the drummer series. IMO it would be a lot more useful if they consolidated the lot into one plugin where you could install the expansions you have, and would enable to mix and match a la Toontrack. As it is, it's all a PITA.

Yeah for sure, but TV guys for a hot moment will jump on Play instruments to get a sound that isn't used in every episodic program out there, or at least that's the selling point, and of course they go back to Omnisphere for bread and butter.

Komplete Kontrol is a mess, and that's where NI really shoot themselves in the foot, the idea is great, the execution is unfinished, which goes back to what you and others are pointing out, they tend to jump ship before something is baked or make it too costly for them to fix something that's "free" like KK.

On the drum tip, I'm in the process of converting my Maschine libraries to the MPC. Maschine doesn't live up to it's promise, much like IMO Push 3 it could easily be better than the MPC Live series but it's not. Push 3 IMO will eventually be better, but Maschine has stagnated for a decade really.

[noiseboyuk]

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

I've just set up a new MacBook and I have to say Native Access 2 has been... superb. Probably the least hassle of any developer's installers, and very easy to find my way around. Not sure what I'm doing right...

[BBFG#]

Drinking the koolade and not paying attention to the whole? "Works for me" is not really an argument here.

I've been through several inceptions where I've had to find work arounds to their psychopathy of Komplete Kontrol over everything their customers do and think. Of course, that works best with Apple users since there's strong evidence they created that text book.

[Echoes in the Attic]

I haven't had problems lately with Native Access either. Just seems to work. I have my Komplete installed on a secondary ssd as well. But the thing that drives me crazy is how to get rid of Komplete Kontrol Libraries. Some Third party installers delete the NKS stuff but most don't. And there are a lot of hoops to jump through to delete all the NKS stuff. I wish they just had a library uninstaller. Or do they now and I don't know?

[vurt]

Drinking the koolade and not paying attention to the whole? "Works for me" is not really an argument here.

I've been through several inceptions where I've had to find work arounds to their psychopathy of Komplete Kontrol over everything their customers do and think. Of course, that works best with Apple users since there's strong evidence they created that text book.

while i have several complaints, well misgivings i guess, with nis current direction, i, as a windows user, cant say ive ever had an issue with native access.
no kool aid, i just like a few products, far from all they do.

[vurt]

though i have read of many who do.
computers are arseholes

[pdxindy]

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

I've just set up a new MacBook and I have to say Native Access 2 has been... superb. Probably the least hassle of any developer's installers, and very easy to find my way around. Not sure what I'm doing right...

Does the new Access 2 now have an uninstall option on Mac? That was my only significant complaint... no uninstall.

[machinesworking]

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

I've just set up a new MacBook and I have to say Native Access 2 has been... superb. Probably the least hassle of any developer's installers, and very easy to find my way around. Not sure what I'm doing right...

The two big complaints to me with Native access are that it only has one path in preferences, so to instal on multiple drives you have to think out installation. When you have some reason to move a library, your choice is to relocate ALL of your libraries, or one at at time. No option to select I dunno? Maschine libraries only that you have installed somewhere, and relocate them.

It's weird because Kontakt itself has the best lost sample library tools out there, but none of their other products do.

[BONES]

You can move things around however you like and all you need to do in NA is "locate" it and you're done. It's not rocket science and it means I just went through setting up my new laptop and I didn't have to install any Kontakt library, all I had to do was point NA to where I had put them on the new drive. It was far and away the easiest part of the whole process and literally saved me about two days in set-up time compared to a year or two ago.

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

Native Access is f**king great! It saves literally hours compared to installing products one by one. It took a while for them to get it right but the current version is just about the gold standard, surpassed only by PA's Manager app. That you can also use it for all your third party libraries makes it even better.

and yeah I hate Native Access, total PITA to use. Most companies installers are terrible but the fact that you still can't independently choose per plug in where a sample library gets installed is BS.

Of course you can, just change the path before you install it. The last thing anyone needs is to have to set the path every f**king time. That's exactly the kind of tedium those things are designed to remove from our lives.

I've been through several inceptions where I've had to find work arounds to their psychopathy of Komplete Kontrol over everything their customers do and think. Of course, that works best with Apple users since there's strong evidence they created that text book.

What? Native Access doesn't lock you into anything, it doesn't force you down any paths or do anything other than make your life easier. It's f**king brilliant and I'd love to know how you can possibly see it in any other light.

[BBFG#]

Do you get cookies with that Koolade?

[DrGonzo]

And the worst of it all delivered via Access, which is great for them, but an insult to us, the customers.

What's your issue with NI Access? Not baiting just curious. Never had any problem with it. Never had any problems with dongles or iLok either so maybe I'm just lucky.

[BBFG#]

"All swans are white"?
You guys really are proving my point.