Sad state of Native Instruments

[kmonkey]

Drinking the koolade and not paying attention to the whole? "Works for me" is not really an argument here.

Well that sounds like you want to hear only one side of the story, isn't it?

So the point I am making is: it obviously works for some people that "buy" into it. Others who are not satisfied (remember, NI offers a trial) are whining and arguing here, expecting NI to change the course because of 26 people at KVR. Priceless. While the solution for your kind is simple. Go away and purchase something that works for you. Really that simple.

But no, I am a snowflake and I demand a company change in product vision and accommodate my bedroom tunnel vision.

Right.

[BBFG#]

That troll baiting is rather old.
Maybe find out the points you're missing in the last 45 pages?

It only takes "one black swan".
And there are many throughout these threads

[enCiphered]

Let me tell you a little story guys. Once upon a time in a small town, there was a tranquil lake where a group of black swans lived. These black swans were known for their elegance and uniqueness, as black swans are quite rare in nature. People from all around the area would come to admire these graceful creatures and take pictures of them.
One winter, an unexpected snowstorm hit the town, covering everything in a thick layer of snow. The lake froze over, leaving the black swans struggling to find food. However, they managed to stay resilient and found a small opening in the ice where they could still catch some fish.
One day, a group of tourists arrived at the frozen lake, excited to see the black swans. However, instead of admiring their strength and determination to survive the harsh winter, the tourists started complaining about the frozen lake and the swans' inability to entertain them as they usually did.

"These black swans are so boring!" one tourist said, shivering in the cold.

"Yeah, they should be doing tricks or something," added another. "I can't believe we came all the way here just to see them standing around."

Meanwhile, the black swans overheard these comments, and they couldn't help but roll their eyes as the tourists were behaving just like snowflakes – fragile, delicate, and quick to complain at the slightest discomfort.
So, to play a little trick on the whining tourists, the black swans decided to put on an unexpected show. One of the swans started dancing on the ice, flapping its wings in a comical manner. Another swan followed suit, and soon, all of them were waddling around, performing their own silly dance routine.
The tourists were taken aback at first, not sure whether the swans were mocking them or actually trying to entertain. However, soon enough, laughter erupted among the crowd, and everyone started cheering for the talented black swans.

In that moment, the tourists realized that they had been acting like fools, expecting everything to be perfect and tailored to their desires. They learned a valuable lesson from the swans, who showed them that resilience and humor in the face of adversity can bring unexpected joy and laughter.

[BBFG#]

Okay.
My references were to something posed by a scientific philosopher pointing out dissonance.

I hope that we come here with a stipulation that these products work as advertised for everyone. Unfortunately, that's often not the case. But then it can take the shape by how the company deals with it (or chooses to ignore it and work instead at minimizing the support rather than the problems.)

Continually saying it works for some as much as they expect it to while trying to silence those that present how it isn't is somewhat of a sycophant choir that only serves the company purpose. It's nice they don't have the experience of how it doesn't work as advertised. But if that's all they can do is join that choir, they really don't know or can share anything but that ignorance.
Counting the distortions can be interesting, but ultimately, they also do nothing to change the direction of the thread, the problems, or the company.

The "sad state of NI" is just that.
And even this thread is more time than I care to waste on it.

[Spring Goose]

Oh i get it: it's like they have been led on by somebody who doesn't put out ie they want to be a loyal customer but NI aren't delivering for them. One of the first things i learned as a DJ is: You can't please everybody all of the time.

[egbert101]

Sometimes you just want someone to fix your tiny GUI.

[Spring Goose]

Sometimes you just want someone to fix your tiny GUI.

hahah yeah i don't disagree. Some of the Reaktor ensembles are too small for my eyes too. Maybe i'm converted.

[noiseboyuk]

That troll baiting is rather old.

I don't know about black swans, but I do know about black pots and kettles. Only a page ago you were laughing at anyone who had a fine experience with Native Access at somehow "drinking the Kool Aid". Well yes, good point. Installing software easily is totally analogous to a cult whose psychopathic leader murdered 900 men, women and children. It's the exact same thing.

I'm with you Komplete Kontrol, that's been manifestly and woefully substandard from day one and has never significantly improved. BONES may be a bull in a china shop, but he did demolish most of the supposed shortfalls of Native Access. It's a snip to relocate. A lack of a direct uninstall is a valid criticism, but otherwise it works exceptionally well. What, specifically, are your other issues with it?

There's plenty to criticise and lament about NI. But just ridiculing anyone who has a good experience with any of their products doesn't really help anything except noise.

[BBFG#]

The "koolade" wasn't about the company, but a MO of projection. So no black pot/kettle. But as in all things in the realm of dissonance, we are all eligible. The difference here is in the dispute that I applied to myself first and then shared.

There is a site where this method can be achieved if desired. S.M.A.R.T. I think? "The truth will set you free, but first it's going to hurt." May be the appropriate adage here. And realizing what NI is becoming is sad and painful. And yes, I understand that are some that enjoy pain.

[noiseboyuk]

And yes, I understand that are some that enjoy pain.

Here's the thing - when I use their stuff (or install their stuff) I'm not actually in pain at all. Imagine that!

As their focus has shifted, some of their new stuff is of no interest to me, some of it frustrates me but - imagine this - some of their products delight me. Yes, the new ones!

[Scotty]

I can understand and appreciate the change in direction in most cases. It doesn't make sense for NI to be making their own traditional EFX or even sub-licencing their creation to Soft Tube. They've got the Plugin Alliance folks in the consortium to do that. What I don't appreciate is that they just close off a plugin line or stop the development in some cases kill it.

Why not sell the code to an independent developer and let them modernize it or at least make it operate with the latest OS updates? They could then offer the plugin for sale again in their store and make money off the distribution. Pro 53, Absynth and possibly Reaktor? These had a following.

[BBFG#]

And yes, I understand that are some that enjoy pain.

Here's the thing - when I use their stuff (or install their stuff) I'm not actually in pain at all. Imagine that!

As their focus has shifted, some of their new stuff is of no interest to me, some of it frustrates me but - imagine this - some of their products delight me. Yes, the new ones!

I've often heard that from masochists as well.
Enjoy.
Personally starting to look forward to the day I'm Kompletely free of them now. Too much time and energy for how little I get out of it now. As is this thread...

[CrystalWizard]

...


I think the logic is - NI no longer interested in serious music makers, only interested in one finger bedroom producers and DJs.

Sums it up quite nicely.

That's the argument anyway, which I don't think is accurate. As pointed out numerous times across the 43 pages, NI are producing absolutely top end stuff...

Such as?

The real problem is that KVR is heavily skewed towards synthesis, and a huge premium is placed on authenticity to old models and also pioneering new stuff. NI used to be trailblazers there, but in a very crowded market seem to have withdrawn considerably from this area. Hence the thread.

I like pioneering new stuff. I don't think it's unreasonable to want some more of that from NI.

[CrystalWizard]

I can understand and appreciate the change in direction in most cases. It doesn't make sense for NI to be making their own traditional EFX or even sub-licencing their creation to Soft Tube. They've got the Plugin Alliance folks in the consortium to do that. What I don't appreciate is that they just close off a plugin line or stop the development in some cases kill it.

Why not sell the code to an independent developer and let them modernize it or at least make it operate with the latest OS updates? They could then offer the plugin for sale again in their store and make money off the distribution. Pro 53, Absynth and possibly Reaktor? These had a following.

Because all the decision makers at NI are bean counters who have absolutely no interest in music making nor music makers except as a source of sales. Despite what one of our resident loudmouths' says, the original engineers at NI had a big hand in the direction they were going. That changed about a decade ago (another member can jump in here and correct me idc.)

[noiseboyuk]

That's the argument anyway, which I don't think is accurate. As pointed out numerous times across the 43 pages, NI are producing absolutely top end stuff...

Such as?

Most recently, Valves Pro looks and sounds terrific. The scripting and UX looks pioneering, and yet they've done the recordings really well too - you don't often get both. I don't have that yet, but I do have Lores and Strummed Acoustic Nylon, both are outstanding. With Lores they've pulled off what Spitfire have been trying to do for years but never quite nailed - a contemporary scoring tool that sounds human, organic and not cliched. Concept and execution superb. The Nylon is fabulous - I've often said (and stick by) that virtual guitars are never a patch on real ones mostly because you have to play them with a keyboard not six independent strings whose pitches criss-cross. It's impossible. But they take a subset of what IS possible, and they've made it sound fabulous. Highly musical.

These products may not be for everyone, but they are best in class at what they do. And they do plenty I dislike, but most here don't ever hear their best stuff. Everything on KVR is filtered through a synthesis prism. On that, I've hated Massive X since release, to me it sounds cold, sterile and uninspiring. Others think it's the best synth on the market. Shrug emoji.