The Threat of A.I over Music.

[harryupbabble]

Here’s the thing. All life is just DNA arranging matter with a single purpose: Make copies. We are the result of 3.7 years of genetic oneupmanship. Every single thing you do is for one endgame, and that’s procreation and if you don’t believe that, you don’t understand evolution.

A.I. has no similar mandate. There is no driving force to make it multiply, unless you build it in, which we should absolutely not do. A.I. needs hardware to run, and as far as I can tell, we are pretty far from making robots who are capable of building and maintaining their own hardware. So, if your A.I. starts going out of control, you just have to basically pull the plug. These things could be built by bad actors, but like a bio weapon, having it turn on you is likely. We should be way more afraid of a bio weapon than of A.I.

As for the end of art, humans make art because that’s what we do. We are social animals and have a biological imperative to create and maintain culture for the cohesion of that society. So, regardless of what computers are doing, we will be making music. It’s already pretty much not a job now, so maybe this is just the end of it being a job at all, but IMO, that’s a good thing, because now you are unshackled from trying to create something that can generate money, and you are now free to just make pure art for its own sake.

but what about eunuchs?
i wonder what those guys do after work

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

Those two things are entirely unrelated. Dogs have feelings but lack consciousness. A sociopath has consciousness but may entirely lack feelings.

What!?? What is your definition of being conscious BTW?
If not having and using the 5 senses + mind! Then what exactly?

A sociopath/psychopath surely has feelings as in finding things pleasant/unpleasant/neutral but lacks compassion and can do insane things to others without remorse. If sociopaths/psychopaths didn't have feelings you could walk up to them and spit them in the face while calling them all sorts of things - and they would not even react. But since they have such a grandiose self-centred image the opposite would happen, they'd probably start planning on how to ruin your life in all possible ways. So surely they have feelings…Just saying something wrong to such a person would trigger all kinds of feelings in them. They lack remorse and have no compassion.

If this AI is truly a sentient person how does it discern between true and false statements?

How do you? How does anyone?

Well I am not in need of verifying ALL the f**king data that is out there from history to astronomy but some people are actually in need of it. Or all the data regarding daily bank transfers being made etc. I keep it simple regarding what I need to realise/know and that is having wisdom, something AI will never have.

I am not in any measure afraid of death so does that mean I lack consciousness?

Are you mixing up the words conscious and conscience????
I take it you follow a materialist world view that when you die you are 100% annihilated? If that isn't one bit scary to you, fine.

Smell, touch and taste are also types of cognizing/being aware. Types of awareness LaMDA sadly can't experience, yet.

Why not? There are detectors for those things that could easily be wired into any system. And again, there are people who lack one or more of those senses, does that mean they also lack consciousness?

You can be aware of a smell while closing your eyes and not seeing the surroundings. Yes if you are deaf you lack being conscious of sounds but conscious via other senses. Simple.

Well, no. They are purely psychological experiences. If I can remember what something looks like, sounds like and/or smells like, then I can dream about it.

Are saying that all dreams you have are based on objects you've seen with your physical senses? Ever had any dreams with incredible music you've never heard before? Nightmares where you found yourself in very strange environments you've never seen before? Can you control these psychological experiences?

I only brought up dreams because how can the mind create a new body with the 5 senses that interacts in dream environments while the physical senses are not being used? No answer to this but it is safe to say that we can be aware of a lot more in a relaxed state of mind!

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

I would like to add, dogs have way better developed senses than humans from hearing/scent to even knowing in advance if someone is coming home! Much friendlier than most humans too!

[osiris]

Just wait till they stick AI onto one of those robot dogs. Metalhead indeed.

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

Well, no. They are purely psychological experiences. If I can remember what something looks like, sounds like and/or smells like, then I can dream about it.

Are saying that all dreams you have are based on objects you've seen with your physical senses? Ever had any dreams with incredible music you've never heard before? Nightmares where you found yourself in very strange environments you've never seen before? Can you control these psychological experiences?

I only brought up dreams because how can the mind create a new body with the 5 senses that interacts in dream environments while the physical senses are not being used? No answer to this but it is safe to say that we can be aware of a lot more in a relaxed state of mind!

Adding the following: It is one thing to have fantasies mixed up in dreams but that the mind without you having to fantasize creates new senses for you just out of the blue to experience these fantasies/psychological experiences is maybe something scientists should investigate? Or what about phantom pain?

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

Just wait till they stick AI onto one of those robot dogs. Metalhead indeed.

Haha wouldn't suprise me if future generations of hardcore AI-fanatics would prefer the robot dogs over real ones…

[zerocrossing]

Just wait till they stick AI onto one of those robot dogs. Metalhead indeed.

Haha wouldn't suprise me if future generations of hardcore AI-fanatics would prefer the robot dogs over real ones…

If you’ve ever been woken up by a dog at 6 am to go pee and they then refuse because it’s raining, you’d understand why an AI dog would be a good option.

[zerocrossing]

Here’s the thing. All life is just DNA arranging matter with a single purpose: Make copies. We are the result of 3.7 years of genetic oneupmanship. Every single thing you do is for one endgame, and that’s procreation and if you don’t believe that, you don’t understand evolution.

A.I. has no similar mandate. There is no driving force to make it multiply, unless you build it in, which we should absolutely not do. A.I. needs hardware to run, and as far as I can tell, we are pretty far from making robots who are capable of building and maintaining their own hardware. So, if your A.I. starts going out of control, you just have to basically pull the plug. These things could be built by bad actors, but like a bio weapon, having it turn on you is likely. We should be way more afraid of a bio weapon than of A.I.

As for the end of art, humans make art because that’s what we do. We are social animals and have a biological imperative to create and maintain culture for the cohesion of that society. So, regardless of what computers are doing, we will be making music. It’s already pretty much not a job now, so maybe this is just the end of it being a job at all, but IMO, that’s a good thing, because now you are unshackled from trying to create something that can generate money, and you are now free to just make pure art for its own sake.

but what about eunuchs?
i wonder what those guys do after work

They played a role in society and were part of the culture, which helped form cohesive communities that were successful in propagating.

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

Just wait till they stick AI onto one of those robot dogs. Metalhead indeed.

Haha wouldn't suprise me if future generations of hardcore AI-fanatics would prefer the robot dogs over real ones…

If you’ve ever been woken up by a dog at 6 am to go pee and they then refuse because it’s raining, you’d understand why an AI dog would be a good option.

Hehe well for the future practical people this AI dog might be a good option but in no way could a robot dog replace a real dog. Impossible, just as a robot can't replace a human being. Sure robots can replace human jobs and all that stuff but never an actual human being having the human experience.

Funnily enough me and some friends went with my dog + two other dogs to a lake today. My Flat-coated Retriever loves to swim, something a robot-dog can't do and would obviously not even enjoy if it could - since it has no conscioussness

[Yadrichik_Chaya]

This is the exact type of discernment I'm talking about:
since AI-robot doggy can never enjoy doing things (like swimming) or dislike doing things (like taking a walk while it is raining outside)
- it shows that it has no real awareness or ability of true self-reflection.

AI is just a language model that you can engage with via language. Or a model that has been trained to do a specific task like isolating and creating stems from songs.

Also the first people behind developing AI can't be said to be people with good intentions. First they where closely tied to the military and nothing but military.

I also see this now about a heavyweight at MIT, Marvin Minsky, known as “father of artificial intelligence”:

Epstein was at MIT for Marvin Minsky’s memorial 
According to an email from Media Lab cofounder Nicholas Negroponte, Epstein’s closest friend at MIT was AI pioneer Marvin Minsky, who “even visited him in jail.” Today’s report showed that Epstein had donated $100,000 to Minsky in 2002, several years before his 2008 conviction. Nevertheless, Minsky has posthumously become associated with the Epstein scandal. In a deposition unsealed last August, Epstein accuser Virginia Giuffre said that Epstein forced her to have sex with Minsky. Source: https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/0 ... ng-ethics/

So no wonder AI is already used now mostly for manipulating, cheating, stealing, scamming. Unethical people will have a blast thanks to AI.

On the other hand:
*We could use AI to send water-drones to help out during droughts around the world.
*We could have AI-robots learn agriculture and grow fruit, vegetables, mushrooms and medicinal plants.
*We could set up greenhouses being ran by robots on every corner in every city/town where the food grown is 100 % FREE to each and everyone and open 24/7.
*We could use AI robots to cleanse the seas and remove plastic, prescription drugs and other stuff found in our drinking water 24/7.
We could do great things that benefit all and everyone.

But instead we marvel at manipulative stuff like voice cloning, generating pictures of people that don't exist, deep fakes etc. like it is really amazing.
Don't get me wrong it can be fun with these things mentioned in the light of comedy/parody but that's not really helping people all over the world.

Countless billions of money invested in AI and I've yet to see how anything will really benefit us all.

[BONES]

Here’s the thing. All life is just DNA arranging matter with a single purpose: Make copies. We are the result of 3.7 years of genetic oneupmanship. Every single thing you do is for one endgame, and that’s procreation and if you don’t believe that, you don’t understand evolution.

Or people.

These things could be built by bad actors, but like a bio weapon, having it turn on you is likely. We should be way more afraid of a bio weapon than of A.I.

You obviously haven't seen the Forbin Project or The Lawnmower Man. They are much scarier than The Satan Bug.

As for the end of art, humans make art because that’s what we do. We are social animals and have a biological imperative to create and maintain culture for the cohesion of that society. So, regardless of what computers are doing, we will be making music. It’s already pretty much not a job now, so maybe this is just the end of it being a job at all, but IMO, that’s a good thing, because now you are unshackled from trying to create something that can generate money, and you are now free to just make pure art for its own sake.

Exactly! (All of it.)

Dogs absolutely have consciousness.

In the context of the thread, "consciousness" had became shorthand for "self-awareness", which is weird because "self-awareness" is much easier to type.

[Alchemedia]

“A single AI program can write as much text as all of humanity. A single two Gb image-generation model running on your laptop can compress all the pictures on the open web into a tool that generate images with extraordinary creativity and precision. A single pathogenic experiment could spark a pandemic, a tiny molecular event with global ramifications….” (p. 120)

“For the time being, it doesn’t matter whether the system is self-aware, or has understanding, or has humanlike intelligence. All that matters is what the system can do.” (p. 89)

“Over the next ten years, AI will be the greatest force amplifier in history. This is why it could enable a redistribution of power on a historic scale. The greatest accelerant of human progress imaginable, it will also enable harms—from wars and accidents to random terror groups, authoritarian governments, overreaching corporations, plain thefts and willful sabotage.” (p.224)

the coming wave sm.jpg

[pekbro]

“A single AI program can write as much text as all of humanity. A single two Gb image-generation model running on your laptop can compress all the pictures on the open web into a tool that generate images with extraordinary creativity and precision. A single pathogenic experiment could spark a pandemic, a tiny molecular event with global ramifications….” (p. 120)

“For the time being, it doesn’t matter whether the system is self-aware, or has understanding, or has humanlike intelligence. All that matters is what the system can do.” (p. 89)

“Over the next ten years, AI will be the greatest force amplifier in history. This is why it could enable a redistribution of power on a historic scale. The greatest accelerant of human progress imaginable, it will also enable harms—from wars and accidents to random terror groups, authoritarian governments, overreaching corporations, plain thefts and willful sabotage.” (p.224)

the coming wave sm.jpg

Of course that's true, but that still boils down to people utilizing it, and just as it can be used for bad stuff, it could be used for good, or infact to counter harmful uses of it. Easier to acquire than
a nuclear weapon, but also self defeating to a large extent. So we are still in a crap shoot one way or the other and in the least, tentatively still in control.

[zerocrossing]

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/can-a-i-take-a-joke/

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/new-te ... different/

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/a-i-is ... clude-you/

[osiris]

I don't know. I went to Sounddraw and had it make a bunch of songs and they were very 'Casio Demo' quality.