Cytomic "The Drop" Resonant Filter

[andy-cytomic]

I love The Drop, full stop. At the same time, I’m growing to love Filtershaper XL. And I would love polyphonic functionality like your VCV filter in The Drop. I know it’s probably not going to happen, but I have to humbly suggest a few feature suggestions:

(1) CLAP implementation for polyphony
(2) Additional bandpass and notch filters
(3) a modulation system like Filtershaper XL

Thank you for your consideration.

1) The Drop is feature complete, but I may add a few more analog modelled HP / LP, but that’s about the only scope for anything new in terms of features. Support for Clap will just be for stereo, as supporting polyphony like VCV Rack requires a complete re-design of the sound engine.

2) The Drop is focussed on a very basic and easy to understand signal path of HP -> LP, that is what the product is at its core, and changing that would mean a complete re-design of the main user interface, what you are asking for would be possible in a new product, but not The Drop.

3) Another focus of The Drop is to allow for “playing” of the knobs in a musical way, so that complicated modulations and be done on the fly without needing presets of intricately programmed multi-point envelopes. I want The Drop to be more like an hardware filter that is easy to quickly tweak some knobs to get some motion and then this can be recorded / automated from a DAW, not add that complexity inside the plugin itself.

In addition the modulation in Filterscape XL is at a relatively “slow” 5kHz. The Drop is at full audio rate, so at least x8 faster modulation. All modulation sources in The Drop are anti-aliased so they sound smooth at audio rate, and all modulation destinations support full audio rate modulation and sound smooth when pushed hard. This limits the scope of modulation destinations, and the number of modulation sources, since it requires x8 the cpu just to process the modulation at least, but then extra on top to anti-alias the sources as well.

Filterscape XL it a great plugin, but it has a very different focus to The Drop, so they complement each other, and one plugin doesn’t have to try and be the other.

The Drop is primarily about the most accurate analog modelled filters combined with smooth audio rate modulation that never “falls apart” or sounds bad no matter how hard you push it. The Drop is focussed on tone and ease of use, not shipping complicated presets with lots of pre-programmed multipoint envelopes. In fact The Drop even has a mode where all modulation is bypassed, since this is a big use case where you just want to automate a filter sweep with the best sounding ITB analog modelled filters possible!

[jtsterays]

Andy can you update the models list in the manual?

[perpetual3]

Thanks, Andy. Indeed when you put it that way, I wouldn’t change a thing. Hope to see more filter based emulations from you in the future.

I love The Drop, full stop. At the same time, I’m growing to love Filtershaper XL. And I would love polyphonic functionality like your VCV filter in The Drop. I know it’s probably not going to happen, but I have to humbly suggest a few feature suggestions:

(1) CLAP implementation for polyphony
(2) Additional bandpass and notch filters
(3) a modulation system like Filtershaper XL

Thank you for your consideration.

1) The Drop is feature complete, but I may add a few more analog modelled HP / LP, but that’s about the only scope for anything new in terms of features. Support for Clap will just be for stereo, as supporting polyphony like VCV Rack requires a complete re-design of the sound engine.

2) The Drop is focussed on a very basic and easy to understand signal path of HP -> LP, that is what the product is at its core, and changing that would mean a complete re-design of the main user interface, what you are asking for would be possible in a new product, but not The Drop.

3) Another focus of The Drop is to allow for “playing” of the knobs in a musical way, so that complicated modulations and be done on the fly without needing presets of intricately programmed multi-point envelopes. I want The Drop to be more like an hardware filter that is easy to quickly tweak some knobs to get some motion and then this can be recorded / automated from a DAW, not add that complexity inside the plugin itself.

In addition the modulation in Filterscape XL is at a relatively “slow” 5kHz. The Drop is at full audio rate, so at least x8 faster modulation. All modulation sources in The Drop are anti-aliased so they sound smooth at audio rate, and all modulation destinations support full audio rate modulation and sound smooth when pushed hard. This limits the scope of modulation destinations, and the number of modulation sources, since it requires x8 the cpu just to process the modulation at least, but then extra on top to anti-alias the sources as well.

Filterscape XL it a great plugin, but it has a very different focus to The Drop, so they complement each other, and one plugin doesn’t have to try and be the other.

The Drop is primarily about the most accurate analog modelled filters combined with smooth audio rate modulation that never “falls apart” or sounds bad no matter how hard you push it. The Drop is focussed on tone and ease of use, not shipping complicated presets with lots of pre-programmed multipoint envelopes. In fact The Drop even has a mode where all modulation is bypassed, since this is a big use case where you just want to automate a filter sweep with the best sounding ITB analog modelled filters possible!

[andy-cytomic]

Thanks, Andy. Indeed when you put it that way, I wouldn’t change a thing. Hope to see more filter based emulations from you in the future.

Good to hear! I am aware that more fiddly modulation at "control rate" is still useful to have for gee whizz presets, but I think the best solution for this sort of thing would be some sort of generic plugin wrapper that allows for advanced midi mapping, an arbitrary number of lfos, envelopes, multi-point envelopes, step sequencers, and other modulators, so that it is clear what is at audio rate and what is at a slower rate eg 1/8th of the audio rate, which is normally called "control rate". Currently your DAW is this wrapper, but equally something like VCV Rack could do the job, or in a more limited, but high definition capacity you can route audio to the external input of The Drop to allow for arbitrary modulation at audio rate from any source to all the current modulation destinations.

[andy-cytomic]

Andy can you update the models list in the manual?

Sure, but the whole manual needs updating. Below is the full list.

The Drop features these filters all in low pass and high pass modes, with 2 and 4 pole options:

KSM = Custom designed Sallen Key
AMU = Custom designed ARP Odyssey mk 1
OSR = Oxford Synthesizer Company OSCar
WSP = EDP Wasp with modifications to allow for self oscillation
MS1 = Korg MS20 Rev. 1
MS2 = Korg MS20 Rev. 2 with modified buffers for more drive
SMP = Custom designed blend between MS20 Rev. 2 / OSCar
JPR = Roland Jupiter 8 / Juno 6 with full resonance compensation
SHR = Roland SH2 / SH101
PRD = Moog Prodigy

and each of these filters has both MD (medium detail) and HD (high detail) modes, as well as adjustable oversampling amounts to lower the aliasing to any desired level depending on how hard you're pushing the frequency modulation and drive.

[jtsterays]

Nice, also ever thought about doing the Polivoks filter? Urs said he couldnt do it in the past so i feel like youre the only one in the world who can, which sounds kinda badass.

[Dip200]

Isnt there some kind of Airwindows z-plane replica? Please dont ask me how its exactly called, as I am totally lost in his vast and also a bit overwhelming catalogue. Might be worth to check out, if you are after that kind of sound.

The best you can get in terms of complex filters is filterscape by u-he. You can basically design an eq curve starting point and a completely different end point and then move between them by either a synced kinda lfo or trigger an envelope via midi.

Still, the emulator-x filters are extremely smooth and just awesome in my perception. I don't care if they meet "modern standards" or not, nor do I care about who defines that standard and by what criteria.

[cantaloupe]

Your work on getting this updated to apple silicon is much much appreciated! i know it was a lot of work.

What i would like to see in an updated manual is a bit more info on each filter and what their properties are in layman terms. Would love to get some insight into what BJT buffers, IR3109 OTA core, Cascade circuit topology etc etc actually mean for the sound in less technical terms. Anyway, thanks again.

[drsyncenstein]

Isnt there some kind of Airwindows z-plane replica? Please dont ask me how its exactly called, as I am totally lost in his vast and also a bit overwhelming catalogue. Might be worth to check out, if you are after that kind of sound.

The best you can get in terms of complex filters is filterscape by u-he. You can basically design an eq curve starting point and a completely different end point and then move between them by either a synced kinda lfo or trigger an envelope via midi.

Still, the emulator-x filters are extremely smooth and just awesome in my perception. I don't care if they meet "modern standards" or not, nor do I care about who defines that standard and by what criteria.

these are the airWindows zplane experiments:
ZBandpass264, ZHighpass264, ZLowpass264, ZNotch264, ZRegion264

Zplanes are pretty cool, but once you hear them next to an eII, eIII, or Emax I i think you'll agree that they we're only great as technology of that era.

[drsyncenstein]

Andy can you update the models list in the manual?

Sure, but the whole manual needs updating. Below is the full list.

The Drop features these filters all in low pass and high pass modes, with 2 and 4 pole options:

KSM = Custom designed Sallen Key
AMU = Custom designed ARP Odyssey mk 1
OSR = Oxford Synthesizer Company OSCar
WSP = EDP Wasp with modifications to allow for self oscillation
MS1 = Korg MS20 Rev. 1
MS2 = Korg MS20 Rev. 2 with modified buffers for more drive
SMP = Custom designed blend between MS20 Rev. 2 / OSCar
JPR = Roland Jupiter 8 / Juno 6 with full resonance compensation
SHR = Roland SH2 / SH101
PRD = Moog Prodigy

and each of these filters has both MD (medium detail) and HD (high detail) modes, as well as adjustable oversampling amounts to lower the aliasing to any desired level depending on how hard you're pushing the frequency modulation and drive.

Andy; that emulation list is not complete without the 3320, 3350 and 2044
for the connaisseurs: assuming plenty of spare time, you should add the NJM OTA filters from the Korg DSS-1.

[QCGroove]

Your work on getting this updated to apple silicon is much much appreciated! i know it was a lot of work.

Lol is this plugin still not ARM native? We're coming up one three YEARS of Macs with ARM chips. I greatly appreciate the privilege (and I sincerely mean that, don't get me wrong) of using this plugin in the past but I've got to move on.

I guess I'll try Volcano? The mighty have fallen.

[Mogular]

It works perfectly fine even if its not silicon - at least on Logic. Without any rosetta.

[dayjob]

It works perfectly fine even if its not silicon - at least on Logic. Without any rosetta.

same. haven't had any issues. will be nice to have apple silicon though... along w/the other cytomic plug ins as apple silicon native.

seems all reasonably close. i'm sure Andy will be glad to have these updates behind him as well.

[andy-cytomic]

Your work on getting this updated to apple silicon is much much appreciated! i know it was a lot of work.

What i would like to see in an updated manual is a bit more info on each filter and what their properties are in layman terms. Would love to get some insight into what BJT buffers, IR3109 OTA core, Cascade circuit topology etc etc actually mean for the sound in less technical terms. Anyway, thanks again.

It's technical, there isn't a way around that. In any context I recommend clicking the little arrow on the filter type and use your ears for what sounds best in context of the composition, that's all that matters!

[sqigls]

Your work on getting this updated to apple silicon is much much appreciated! i know it was a lot of work.

Lol is this plugin still not ARM native? We're coming up one three YEARS of Macs with ARM chips. I greatly appreciate the privilege (and I sincerely mean that, don't get me wrong) of using this plugin in the past but I've got to move on.

I guess I'll try Volcano? The mighty have fallen.

'the mighty have fallen'
pffft
drama queen
if you grabbed a free copy of Arturia's MS20 filer, that's all you need to tide you over till Andy releases a native version. Volcano isn't gonna replace the Drop. Feel free to waste your time and money though.