Do we (independent artists) need a fairer new music streaming service?

[ghettosynth]

I want a service that'll somehow prevent and protect my works from being vacuumed up by some AI company to train their push-button music generating algorithms and turn the years of blood, sweat, and tears I’ve put into all this into a few datapoints to spit out a song on 20 seconds.

If this service offers that, take all my money.

Technically it's not really possible. You can limit the "vacuuming" aspect by slowing the rate of consumption. That's not really practical for a streaming service though. People don't want to be limited to, e.g., seven songs a day. This reminds me of the efforts in days of yore to copy-protect software distributed on audio tape, e.g., for the C64. Um, the hardware to copy audio tape had been common place for sometime.

If someone is so desperate for content that they must have obscure internet punter's work, despite copyright law, then there's nothing stopping them from using the app on a mobile and plugging the headphone output into an audio interface. Boom, your precious song has been vacuumed up.

You can limit things through legal means, but that's always going to be costly and difficult. Relatively easy for Bono to get attention, hard for you.

Honestly, I think that for most here, the threat is overblown. If nobody is listening to works from amateurs, it's not exactly a hot sales target for AI driven firms trying to sell "original" works to others.

Frankly, if they want to vacuum up my album "Songs for four hoovers and a dollar store vibrator," then more power to them! I'm not quite sure what their model will learn? How to clear a room at a party?

[brendaningram]

There's lots of good feedback here, and I'll reply properly to it all ASAP, thank you everyone

I just wanted to chime in regarding DRM (including protection from the AI vacuum!). Unfortunately, as good as any DRM is, ultimately the sound plays on a computer and out the speakers. DRM is useless when anyone can setup a loop-back audio interface and record any and all audio that's played through their computer. The worst scenario is when DRM inconveniences the honest listeners, and doesn't stop the crooks.

There is a definite plan to offer physical media sales through TuneFreq, as well as the Bandcamp model of being able to pay to download high-res versions of individual songs and full albums. That doesn't really address the DRM issue, but hopefully it will represent real value to both the artist and the listeners.

[donkey tugger]

I was thinking that, given you're angling this on the basis of more fairness (which I absolutely agree with), then perhaps you could look at the business models of concerns which seek to promote themselves on the basis of being ethical in nature, and derive much of their income from donations despite being large scale. Thinking of things like The Guardian, Wikipedia etc (whether people personally agree with their ethics is immaterial here; they seem to successfully run on this basis), and the whole patreon thing.

[brendaningram]

Thanks donkey tugger, that's a good suggestion.

[counterparty]

A couple of points:

1) I would focus a lot more on the people who would actually be paying you (and why they should pay you). Your site seems to focus a lot more on artists and artist payouts but doesn't really have a whole lot about why anybody should subscribe and exactly what they'll get. What are the compelling reasons for people to sign up?

2) You don't address publishing royalties. A song performed and recorded by an independent artist could have any number of writers, each with varying percentage shares of the publishing rights. I'm not sure what your legal position would be if you tried to run a streaming service that did not pay out those standard royalties (and it would likely be different in different countries).

[donkey tugger]

Thanks donkey tugger, that's a good suggestion.

I was also thinking of the example of podcasts, of which I listen to a lot!

Most are free to listen to, but subscribers will get bonus (for want of a better word...) 'content', be it extra episodes, Q & As with the hosts/guests, to choose the topic of a show etc etc...

Not sure how it would work with music, but maybe 'adding value' for subscribers is an idea?

[Robmobius]

I buy music I would never use a streaming service like Spotify. If a streaming service was more ethical I might be persuaded.

[VOODOO U]

2) You don't address publishing royalties. A song performed and recorded by an independent artist could have any number of writers, each with varying percentage shares of the publishing rights. I'm not sure what your legal position would be if you tried to run a streaming service that did not pay out those standard royalties (and it would likely be different in different countries).

It's not the responsibility of a streaming service to distribute royalties to all involved in the writing and performance of a song.
Whoever uploads the music and sets up for streaming payment is the one who is responsible to distribute any profits earned.

[Frantz]

2) You don't address publishing royalties. A song performed and recorded by an independent artist could have any number of writers, each with varying percentage shares of the publishing rights. I'm not sure what your legal position would be if you tried to run a streaming service that did not pay out those standard royalties (and it would likely be different in different countries).

As a point of reference, this is currently supported by Distrokid as "splits": https://support.distrokid.com/hc/en-us/ ... matically-

[VOODOO U]

That's a good offering. Actually it's a great idea. If Bandcamp offered this, those who I collaborate with needn't worry about me scamming them with actual profits earned. It's all handled by the service provider. It's a load off everyone's back. Mandatory in my opinion.

[VOODOO U]

Now if there were a way to tell how many streams we are actually getting without worrying about the service provider scamming the numbers.

[Constructed Identity]

I, too, would like to live in a perfect world.

[vurt]

I, too, would like to live in a perfect world.

with symmetrical trees n stuff?

[Constructed Identity]

I, too, would like to live in a perfect world.

with symmetrical trees n stuff?

Fluffy symmetrical trees

[harryupbabble]

hell yes, we do need a better and fairer way
at least 50 percent of the revenue should go to the music maker?