Live 12 or Bitwig 5.1

[SLiC]

Ablewig

Ablewig is crap. Bitleton forever.

Actually nether is as good as Maschitwig (Maschine in Bitwig)

Choose one wisely. Either shitwig or crapelton... No seriously they both have some some shaite inside. Caperton is very rigid and unstable when its pride and joy M4L used. Shitwig is a synthesizer with basic DAW functionality and community of blind fanboys.

This was one of your 25 posts in 8 years. You must feel very strongly about it!

Live has been stable for years with MAX, totally stable- never had a single crash in several years.
Bitwig is a sonic playground with people who absolutely love it....Sounds terrible!

[fireapplered]

Both. Buy Ableton and then get Bitwig through the Splice subscription. Best of both worlds.

[jonljacobi]

Try them both. Buy the one you like.

[nusound mind]

I bought Ableton days ago and w/out having spent enough time w/ it to make any sort of informed evaluation, I will say that their plugin scan and the way it's set up is the worst I've seen by far. I can't imagine Bitwig's could be worse so it's likely a tick for them in the plugin scan column.

Other than that I like Live so far, the workflow is different and fun plus fast to get something cooking with. Thankfully scanning plugins is (optimally) a very occasional thing.

[xbitz]

^^^ The problem with Live is not with the plugin scan, but with how it saves the project in such a way that you cannot reload it. The backup folder only contains the last 10 saves, so you can't even save frequently because you don't know from which point it will not be able to reload the project.

[metaside]

^^^ The problem with Live is not with the plugin scan, but with how it saves the project in such a way that you cannot reload it. The backup folder only contains the last 10 saves, so you can't even save frequently because you don't know from which point it will not be able to reload the project.

I upgraded Bitwig instead of Ableton this Black Friday mainly because of this. There are many projects I started less then a year ago which I can't open anymore in Live. Beside an extremely fast plugin scan I also noticed better general performance of Bitwig on my system and less need to bounce. I'm still going to use Live for projects with extensive audio tracks and warp markers though...

[SLiC]

I upgraded Bitwig instead of Ableton this Black Friday mainly because of this.

I did the opposite this time around and upgraded to Live 12 to get the discount (as its only every 2 or 3 years or so and you get a lot of quality upgrades free during that time). I will upgrade Bitwig again at some point, quite happy on 5 and wasn't desperate for anything in 5.1...I guess I could of upgraded but it gets pricey keeping up to date when its not your only DAW!

[metaside]

I did the opposite this time around and upgraded to Live 12 to get the discount (as its only every 2 or 3 years or so and you get a lot of quality upgrades free during that time). I will upgrade Bitwig again at some point, quite happy on 5 and wasn't desperate for anything in 5.1...I guess I could of upgraded but it gets pricey keeping up to date when its not your only DAW!

Yeah, I was still on BW 3.2.8 though ^^ I didn't see anything I needed in the Live 12 update, so it was an easy decision.

[PieBerger]

Ablewig

Ablewig is crap. Bitleton forever.

Actually nether is as good as Maschitwig (Maschine in Bitwig)

Choose one wisely. Either shitwig or crapelton... No seriously they both have some some shaite inside. Caperton is very rigid and unstable when its pride and joy M4L used. Shitwig is a synthesizer with basic DAW functionality and community of blind fanboys.

This was one of your 25 posts in 8 years. You must feel very strongly about it!

Live has been stable for years with MAX, totally stable- never had a single crash in several years.
Bitwig is a sonic playground with people who absolutely love it....Sounds terrible!

Both suffer from "basic DAW functionality" issues, compared to more traditional tape-recorder style DAW's. No bounce in place and very limited multiclip editing in Ableton for example and in Bitwig, you can't export a single MIDI clip. Neither DAW has alias/ghost clips and are both relatively basic when it comes to mixing. They both suck at being basic DAW's tbh, but then other DAW's suck at being sonic playgrounds. I can't ever see myself using a DAW that doesn't have racks, macros, modulation, session/clip launcher etc., even if it's a bit potato in other departments.

[PieBerger]

As a primary Bitwig user (but still a Live license owner) I am of course biased, but I still think you should go for Bitwig. Since there isn't much between the two in terms of core functionality/philosophy, but Bitwig is more modern and is being developed at a significantly faster rate, it is the better option long-term imo. Anything missing from Bitwig today, is much more likely to be added in the future and sooner. There are features missing from Live that users have been requesting for so long now, 6+ years in some cases, the only logical conclusion is that it's simply not possible to implement them within the existing 20 year old code base. If you buy Live today, you have to accept that a lot of what is missing will probably be missing forever. If you prefer Live today and you're OK with certain features never seeing the light of day, of course Live is a totally viable DAW with lots of good things going for it. You can't go too wrong with either and deciding between the two is a nice problem to have

[SLiC]

I did the opposite this time around and upgraded to Live 12 to get the discount (as its only every 2 or 3 years or so and you get a lot of quality upgrades free during that time). I will upgrade Bitwig again at some point, quite happy on 5 and wasn't desperate for anything in 5.1...I guess I could of upgraded but it gets pricey keeping up to date when its not your only DAW!

Yeah, I was still on BW 3.2.8 though ^^ I didn't see anything I needed in the Live 12 update, so it was an easy decision.

Yup- thats a big jump, you will have a lot of new stuff to look at!

[nusound mind]

Hold up, what? I don't like the sounds of that at all. I appreciate the heads up early, this doesn't sound like the type of surprise I'd love to happen upon myself in the future unawares.

Is this hopefully a feature request in the closed beta for the update to 12? Anyone have any non computer programmer level expertise workarounds to saving projects? That's pretty nuts. I save every little thing in some projects to lose as little progress as possible and to try out different branches, etc.

I'm willing to let go of the plugin scan thing not making all my plugins available in Live, it'd probably be a good thing actually in some ways but if I can't rely on saves, that's a big deal. Maybe deal breaking, in fact. That's pretty incredible if true, you'd think reliable saves would be a priority.

^^^ The problem with Live is not with the plugin scan, but with how it saves the project in such a way that you cannot reload it.

projects I started less then a year ago which I can't open anymore in Live.

[SLiC]

Hold up, what? I don't like the sounds of that at all. I appreciate the heads up early, this doesn't sound like the type of surprise I'd love to happen upon myself in the future unawares.

I have never seen or even heard of either of these issues personally. I have never had a project I can't reload or any limit on saves in Live 11. Plugin scan in Bitwig and Live is about the same for me (sometimes Bitwig takes longer as it starts re-indexing before it scans plugin updates, but no big deal)

[Dalle]

Just save as a version, no limits there. The ten project limit is about backups which are created every time you save over a project. You can always open old projects.

[nusound mind]

@SLiC - Ok well that's somewhat reassuring. Guess I'll find out which is the case for me. Although I may wait until 12 arrives to dig into Live much.

@Dalle - alright, good to know I'll give that a try.