Live 12 or Bitwig 5.1

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StrangeSatellite wrote: Sun Dec 31, 2023 8:37 pm I’ve been using Ableton for around 15 years and am demoing Bitwig 5.1 now. I think the built in devices are great and better than Live in many cases. The grid is also just loads of fun. I used to code devices in Max for Live so I’m quite familiar with that, but I really prefer the grid for building out of the box things, even though it doesn’t have the coding part. It’s just nicer to work with. I’m a Launchpad user and Bitwig now works with that exactly as it does in Ableton, and without any third party scripts that Bitwig used to require.

Honestly, my main gripe with Bitwig may seem very superficial, but it’s the look of the interface. It just looks dated to me. I love the flat minimalist look of Ableton, and the ability to customize with themes. It looks like they’ve expanded upon this in Live 12. I know I’m OCD, but I need my DAW environment to look clean and awesome when I fire it up. It sets the mood for creating. I do think Bitwig will fix this in a future version, but they’re not there yet.

So I think I’m going to purchase Live 12 and keep my eye on Bitwig. If they fix the interface, it will be a buy for me.
^^^
with midtones/black level 5/0 it's like a candy store in cybercity :D I like it (default track colors)

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dunno how well it goes through, on a MacBook Pro it's quite vivid
"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

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Not a fan of the Halloween candy store look. Much prefer the clean look of Live. Can you enable to see arranger grid lines in clips though?
Last edited by Yorrrrrr on Sun Dec 31, 2023 10:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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there is a dedicated clip-editing view where the clips don't have any color
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you would just ruin my candy store with all kinds of transparency. :P

ps. there are lot of votes on it, then it will never happen :D https://bitwish.top/t/visible-gridlines ... -clips/689 I also gave it one.
"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

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SLiC wrote: Sun Dec 31, 2023 6:19 pm Analog, Collision, Tension and Electric were all update to be MPE in 11.3 as well,
This gets missed by most people. Years ago I completed my AAS collection because I preferred the advanced controls on the non embedded versions of the Live devices, but in the meantime AAS did not make v3 MPE compatible instead opting for a cheesy two instruments in one lay out. :roll:

So kudos to Ableton for bringing Tension and the rest into the MPE world!


Owning both I still think that Bitwig has some great instruments though, I guess I compare it to Reaper and DP, both of which have nothing to write home about.

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Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
Using: Cubase Pro 15, Reason 13, Tascam US-4x4HR, MODX6, DM12D, LaunchKey 49, Yamaha guitar(Pacifica 612v) and bass (BB234) and some virtual instruments and synths.

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I really like the look of bitwig. Then again Halloween is my favorite holiday :lol: I do agree that firing up a nice looking daw makes a difference

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EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 1:43 am Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
I’m sorry for you. Just stay with Bitwig. Be happy. :D
ABEFLGMOPPRRST :phones:

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machinesworking wrote: Sun Dec 31, 2023 10:20 pm
SLiC wrote: Sun Dec 31, 2023 6:19 pm Analog, Collision, Tension and Electric were all update to be MPE in 11.3 as well,
This gets missed by most people. Years ago I completed my AAS collection because I preferred the advanced controls on the non embedded versions of the Live devices, but in the meantime AAS did not make v3 MPE compatible instead opting for a cheesy two instruments in one lay out. :roll:

So kudos to Ableton for bringing Tension and the rest into the MPE world!
Yeah, kudos to Ableton for making them MPE.

It's unfortunate that AAS stopped dsp development years ago. Their stuff has been surpassed by more recent physical modeling.

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pdxindy wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 4:56 am Yeah, kudos to Ableton for making them MPE.

It's unfortunate that AAS stopped dsp development years ago. Their stuff has been surpassed by more recent physical modeling.
It should be a rule that you have to name what you think is better. :)

Personally I still think String Studio and Sculpture hold up. Modeling one thing? specifically SWAM and other one single instrument modelers are better, but all around physical modeling? I don't know of any that are better? All ears if you do.

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liquidsound wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 3:06 am
EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 1:43 am Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
I’m sorry for you. Just stay with Bitwig. Be happy. :D
Thank you 😊 I wish you the same unless you like misery ;)
Using: Cubase Pro 15, Reason 13, Tascam US-4x4HR, MODX6, DM12D, LaunchKey 49, Yamaha guitar(Pacifica 612v) and bass (BB234) and some virtual instruments and synths.

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Image - DALL-E

It's not crowded, only for connoisseurs

:D
"Where we're workarounding, we don't NEED features." - powermat

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EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 6:16 am
liquidsound wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 3:06 am
EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 1:43 am Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
I’m sorry for you. Just stay with Bitwig. Be happy. :D
Thank you 😊 I wish you the same unless you like misery ;)
After few years of usage I don’t produce with BWS anymore, so no more misery for me. Thank you and Happy New Year! :party:
ABEFLGMOPPRRST :phones:

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EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 1:43 am Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
+1
HDPI is really bad and that wonky workaround on Windows makes Serum VST3 unuseable...
Steve says he will not change Serum VST3 as it´s Ableton´s fault that they need this workaround...

Ableton stays a crashfest to me as well...
I wanted to give it another shot, installed it on a clean fresh OS, opened it, took of the Autoscaling of SPAN Plus and dragged it onto a track... > Endless circle of death... Ableton froze > I had to kill it with the task manager...

I never encountered so much problems with any other software in my whole life...
This is sad as I basically really like it...

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machinesworking wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 5:27 am It should be a rule that you have to name what you think is better. :)

Personally I still think String Studio and Sculpture hold up. Modeling one thing? specifically SWAM and other one single instrument modelers are better, but all around physical modeling? I don't know of any that are better? All ears if you do.
A couple examples... Reason's Friktion and Objekt. Both have a more natural dynamic and realistic tone when played and modulated compared to String Studio.

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liquidsound wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 7:55 am
EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 6:16 am
liquidsound wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 3:06 am
EnGee wrote: Mon Jan 01, 2024 1:43 am Just tried the latest Live intro in Windows. Horrible performance! Cpu spikes even when you cough!
HiDPI support for plugins is the worst I've seen. I can see only a part of Massive X, OPsix and some other vst3 plugins!
And of course it installed this shit again (Push driver) in spite of not having Push.
Uninstalled this misery and returned to my happy candy world of Bitwig :)
I’m sorry for you. Just stay with Bitwig. Be happy. :D
Thank you 😊 I wish you the same unless you like misery ;)
After few years of usage I don’t produce with BWS anymore, so no more misery for me. Thank you and Happy New Year! :party:
Well, I've learnt something, and that is, someone's misery is someone's happiness! So, enjoy your Live if it works for you. Happy new year :tu:
Using: Cubase Pro 15, Reason 13, Tascam US-4x4HR, MODX6, DM12D, LaunchKey 49, Yamaha guitar(Pacifica 612v) and bass (BB234) and some virtual instruments and synths.

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