Ik Multimedia - never again !!!

[jancivil]

They didn't listen to mine.

Big f**king deal, they finally after years and years decided to do like every other vendor on earth that doesn't charge extra for a download. You want to gaslight us on how responsive that is? Simp much?

[jancivil]

Did it ever cross your mind that we perhaps simply might have a completely different opinion regarding IKMM?

What "we". People are individuals. Evidently this thought didn't cross yours. Project and mock, great show.

There's a number of people reporting the same quality of problems dealing with them. My technical problems had nothing to do with my understanding of anything, something failed to work after updating and they had zero interest in the problem, the only thing happened was an insult to my intelligence. It's there to read

[VOODOO U]

Not any more, the latest plugin and the latest trainer handles any samplerate. The latest trainer was released yesterday.

Thanks for the heads up.

[zerocrossing]

The first time there was no support coming back at all, and I mentioned the issue here in my pique and their representative actually deflected blame onto VSL: "They aren't doing it right."

I don't mean this to gaslight you, or belittle your issue, but this type of problem is really common with almost all developers. I suspect it is very difficult to nail down the root of an issue, especially when DAWs are also being continually developed. There is a very good chance it was your DAW. I recently had an issue with Roli's Equator 2 plugin that was similar to yours, in that Roli blamed Bitwig, and Bitwig blamed Roli. I could see it from Roli's position, because the problem didn't exist in Live or Reaper, maybe not any other DAW. Logic points to it being Bitwig's fault. Yet, a few months later, with very poor communication from Roli, an update was released that fixed the problem. Maybe it still wasn't there fault, but they figured out how to make a change that satisfied Bitwig and kept the plugin working in other DAWs as well.

I'm currently working on a game for a platform that's in constant development. Updates for the platform happen without warning and usually without release notes. Things stop working, and it's super hard to know if it's something that you've done, or someone else on the team, or the platform itself. It's very frustrating. I was tasked to fix a bug and it was clear that the bug could not be an art issue, or at least not art that came from me. I tossed it back to the engineer who implemented it, and he tossed me back the graphic that he had made, which also clearly could not be the cause of the bug. It's very possible that the bug is the fault of the platform itself, him or maybe another engineer who was working on an adjacent system. I know the guy I'm in conversation with is super slammed trying to get his other work done at the same time, and since this bug isn't a stability issue, I can see him thinking it's very low priority compared to his other tasks.

TL;DR: bugs can be mysterious, especially in less popular software (I didn't even know VE Pro was a DAW, and you can't beta test on every single DAW known to humans) and engineers are often terrible communicators and slammed with other tasks. Customer service reps are also usually underpaid and not great at communicating. I'm not saying they deserve your business or forgiveness, but maybe a bit of empathy.

[jens]

Did it ever cross your mind that we perhaps simply might have a completely different opinion regarding IKMM?

What "we". People are individuals. Evidently this thought didn't cross yours. Project and mock, great show.

There's a number of people reporting the same quality of problems dealing with them. My technical problems had nothing to do with my understanding of anything, something failed to work after updating and they had zero interest in the problem, the only thing happened was an insult to my intelligence. It's there to read

Way to completely misinterpret what I wrote - well done!

Of course we are individuals and so "we" (i.e. those of us who DO use and buy IKMM-stuff after all) have all our own INDIVIDUAL completely different opinions regarding IKMM. A braindead idiot chimpanzee would know that's what I meant, as it is utterly immanent in the bit you quoted, which - sorry to say - makes your reply to it astoundingly idiotic.

[Danilo Villanova]

Does anyone know if the new Tonex version is more CPU intensive than the old one? I asked in the Cakewalk forum thread and I mentioned that Amplitube got twice as CPU intensive when they added Custom Shop tonit. Peter from IK scolded me and denied that Amplitube got heavier (or did he denied that the CS made it heavier?). They’re a trash company with trash policies and trash customer service.

[machinesworking]

Tonex, Mixbox, T-Racks and Amplitube are fantastic.

[jamcat]

Does anyone know if the new Tonex version is more CPU intensive than the old one?

It doesn’t seem to be. But I found this, which is definitely something to be aware of before updating to TONEX 1.5:

• Amp and Cab section now streamlined to mix and match Tone Models.

This seems to have screwed something up.
In previous versions (v1.0 through v1.2.6) you could use 2 instances of TONEX in a row, with the cab in the first instance of TONEX disabled, and the amp in the second instance of TONEX disabled, and it would sound the same as having both amp and cab enabled in a single instance of TONEX. The sound was IDENTICAL. This allowed you to place a plugin in an “FX loop” between the amp-only instance and the cab-only instance.

Or you could create a stereo split after the amp-only instance of TONEX, and go to a stereo pair of cab-only TONEX instances, with a stereo effect in between the amp and stereo pair of cabs.

As of version 1.5, it now sounds terrible when splitting the amp and cab over 2 instances. It now has a trashy filtered sound, like layers of convolution/deconvolution have been applied. It sounds very different than it does when using a single instance for both the amp and cab. In other words, something has changed drastically from v1.2.6 to v1.5, and it is seriously screwed up.

This has destroyed the ability to create a realistic stereo JazzChorus, or insert a reverb into the amp. Hopefully this is just a bug (and not a new “feature”) and IK shows actual interest in fixing it quickly.

Until then, I have rolled back to v1.2.6, because 1.5 is unusable.

[Immanencer]

A braindead idiot chimpanzee would know that's what I meant, as it is utterly immanent in the bit you quoted

Topic aside, +1 for the only non-typo use of the word "immanent" on this site since 2020 (according to the search engine)

[Recourt]

Hopefully they'll get that sorted quickly.

[electro]

They'll do it again soon when T-Racks 6 comes out. Just keep the old versions installed.

What could T-Racks 6 possibly bring to the table? What they need to do is separate those tape plugins from T-Racks into something new that can host all the algos.

[Danilo Villanova]

Does anyone know if the new Tonex version is more CPU intensive than the old one?

It doesn’t seem to be. But I found this, which is definitely something to be aware of before updating to TONEX 1.5:

• Amp and Cab section now streamlined to mix and match Tone Models.

This seems to have screwed something up.
In previous versions (v1.0 through v1.2.6) you could use 2 instances of TONEX in a row, with the cab in the first instance of TONEX disabled, and the amp in the second instance of TONEX disabled, and it would sound the same as having both amp and cab enabled in a single instance of TONEX. The sound was IDENTICAL. This allowed you to place a plugin in an “FX loop” between the amp-only instance and the cab-only instance.

Or you could create a stereo split after the amp-only instance of TONEX, and go to a stereo pair of cab-only TONEX instances, with a stereo effect in between the amp and stereo pair of cabs.

As of version 1.5, it now sounds terrible when splitting the amp and cab over 2 instances. It now has a trashy filtered sound, like layers of convolution/deconvolution have been applied. It sounds very different than it does when using a single instance for both the amp and cab. In other words, something has changed drastically from v1.2.6 to v1.5, and it is seriously screwed up.

This has destroyed the ability to create a realistic stereo JazzChorus, or insert a reverb into the amp. Hopefully this is just a bug (and not a new “feature”) and IK shows actual interest in fixing it quickly.

Until then, I have rolled back to v1.2.6, because 1.5 is unusable.

Wow, what an insane f*ck up...

[Funkybot's Evil Twin]

Does anyone know if the new Tonex version is more CPU intensive than the old one?

It doesn’t seem to be. But I found this, which is definitely something to be aware of before updating to TONEX 1.5:

• Amp and Cab section now streamlined to mix and match Tone Models.

This seems to have screwed something up.
In previous versions (v1.0 through v1.2.6) you could use 2 instances of TONEX in a row, with the cab in the first instance of TONEX disabled, and the amp in the second instance of TONEX disabled, and it would sound the same as having both amp and cab enabled in a single instance of TONEX. The sound was IDENTICAL. This allowed you to place a plugin in an “FX loop” between the amp-only instance and the cab-only instance.

Or you could create a stereo split after the amp-only instance of TONEX, and go to a stereo pair of cab-only TONEX instances, with a stereo effect in between the amp and stereo pair of cabs.

As of version 1.5, it now sounds terrible when splitting the amp and cab over 2 instances. It now has a trashy filtered sound, like layers of convolution/deconvolution have been applied. It sounds very different than it does when using a single instance for both the amp and cab. In other words, something has changed drastically from v1.2.6 to v1.5, and it is seriously screwed up.

This has destroyed the ability to create a realistic stereo JazzChorus, or insert a reverb into the amp. Hopefully this is just a bug (and not a new “feature”) and IK shows actual interest in fixing it quickly.

Until then, I have rolled back to v1.2.6, because 1.5 is unusable.

Wow, what an insane f*ck up...

I think that item in the changelog has nothing to do with any sound changes and is just saying "you can now drag tone model sections directly from the browser into the amp or cab block to mix and match amps or cabs". It's a workflow change.

Jamcat, if you think the sound changed, do a proper test and please post some audio. I'm guessing the sound has not changed and you're just finding that your sandwiching FX in between the amp and cab blocks is hit or miss based on the Tone Model. Which I'd expect and has always been the case IMO.

TONEX is "guessing" where the amp ends and the cab begins and it's not always spot on. Look at my recent uploads of my Cox Amps Tweed Champ. Just a single SM57 about 2" back from where the cone meets the speaker on a super simple Champ with an 8" speaker. But if I just isolate the cab section and go from model to model, each sounds pretty darn different. Some of what TONEX has determined to be the "cabinet" have way more bass or way more treble - but it's the same speaker with the same mic in the same position in the same room - only difference might be volume 4 versus volume 5 (no tone circuit on the amp). So why the big changes in sound? It's just TONEX's ability to guess what part of the audio is the cabinet that's not 100% accuracte. And it never has been. It's a best guess. If it was perfect, the sound of the cabinet in my recent uploads would hardly change from Tone Model to Tone Model and it would essentially be like having an IR of the cabinet. But it's not.

So I don't think they changed how TONEX guesses that. But if they did, I'd love to hear audio. I can't downgrade as I've already made a bunch of lists and I'm committed to 1.5. But if it did mess with the sound (I'm not hearing any difference in the overall Tone Models), I'd love to hear proof of that, and it should definitely be raised to IK support. But I'm skeptical. I'm more inclined to believe that nothing changed in the sound until I hear otherwise.

[Bombadil]

They didn't listen to mine.

Big f**king deal, they finally after years and years decided to do like every other vendor on earth that doesn't charge extra for a download. You want to gaslight us on how responsive that is? Simp much?

It's a little thing, imo. But it is still to their customers' benefit. Not that I think they did it out of the goodness of their corporate little hearts, because corporations are what they are. I expect they took a lot of shit over the years and also didn't like the look of people raising their voices in protest, especially when some prospective punter starts to research whatever they're interested in and see threads vilifying them on music forae and see everyone's ire.

for your problem with VSL, I expect it is a small minority of complaints and so they slough them off. Not exactly anything else but corporate c-b analysis.

They seem to have elbowed themselves into the place of a market leader, with the money to invest in hardware that does get good reviews.
If I were to start my software collection all over, I honestly don't know what I'd do.
How old is Sampletank 2? I have the patches from that and its add-ons in S4. I can still use Amplitube 4 if I choose (I don't).
Having been a customer of theirs since 2009, I've seen a significant improvement in their products (for my usage methods) over the years. They seemed fairly ramshackle during the Oughts.

[machinesworking]

It's a little thing, imo. But it is still to their customers' benefit. Not that I think they did it out of the goodness of their corporate little hearts, because corporations are what they are.

I think it's safe to say that at the size that most plugin developers are, they don't really qualify as corporations. 15 to 80 employees would be an average.

I guess you cold argue ones owned by corporations qualify, but I don't think IK are? Just another reason I don't like slagging completely plugin companies for some perceived slight. Even with NI I like to sandwich my gripes with compliments.