End of development: There will be no new Tone2 products
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VELLTONE MUSIC VELLTONE MUSIC https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=404834 - KVRAF
- 2452 posts since 19 Sep, 2017 from The Future
Pretty sure this is not the end of Tone2, despite all the tears here...
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- KVRist
- 95 posts since 15 Aug, 2006
I just saw a video on the tube from some guy I've never heard of quitting gear videos today too.
Yeah it sucks. I really feel for any small developer.. the last 20 years has seen an explosion in the prosumer market and it's just resulted in angry, spoiled, entitled people who make gear their entire personality.
Me personally, thank you... I love sarus and I actually loved listening to your demo tunes! They kept me occupied at work sometimes.
But until the "scene" gets a collective grip on its priorities, we're going to see more people close up shop simply because it's not fun anymore.
If you can't beat em, f em. It's not worth it. Sorry about your marriage man.. peace and good luck to you in the future.
Yeah it sucks. I really feel for any small developer.. the last 20 years has seen an explosion in the prosumer market and it's just resulted in angry, spoiled, entitled people who make gear their entire personality.
Me personally, thank you... I love sarus and I actually loved listening to your demo tunes! They kept me occupied at work sometimes.
But until the "scene" gets a collective grip on its priorities, we're going to see more people close up shop simply because it's not fun anymore.
If you can't beat em, f em. It's not worth it. Sorry about your marriage man.. peace and good luck to you in the future.
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- KVRian
- 1188 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil
Godspeed recovery!Markus Krause wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 3:41 pm During the last two decades I had to deal with an extreme amount of stress, many very over-emotional/nasty/drunken/high customers, bullshit in forums, harassment, piracy, defamation and trolling. The stress level was so dramatic that I did not only get divorced, but now also have to deal with serious health problems.
That's why I will move on and will not longer develop new products. I simply must focus on more on my health and have more time for my kids.
Any type of stress(psychological/chemical/ETC) will lead to B1 deficiency and
this will lead to MANY problems...
Mainly the diseases of modern civilized man...
Probably you also have vitamin D deficiency, K2, magnesium, zinc and other stuff.
https://www.eonutrition.co.uk/
Last edited by Pictus on Mon Nov 27, 2023 3:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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- KVRAF
- 44164 posts since 11 Aug, 2008 from clown world
Well, it's good to know that Markus is completely innocent and not to blame for anything.
This is the same method MJ used when he was working on Anthony Marinelli's Thriller.
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- KVRAF
- 5710 posts since 24 May, 2004 from []1
God bless you, Markus, Troels, Bastiaan (wherever you are), and all.
Peace and good health in this new chapter of your life.
Jim
Peace and good health in this new chapter of your life.
Jim
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- KVRer
- 12 posts since 2 Jun, 2021
Personally, I am a Nemesis user. I've been dreaming about this beauty for a long time. Not Icarus, not Saurus, not Electra. Only Nemesis. I saved up for it for a long time. Finally, after purchase, I figured it out deeper and, even having created a couple of presets packs for sale, I am now happy and definitely proud to be a Nemesis user who is currently struggling to save money on another Tone2 product. Haha) Will undoubtedly keep creating presets in order to draw attention to this supersonic synthesizer, no matter how complicated the workflow might seem to users.
In any consequences, I wish you only the best, Marcus. Please take care of yourself! Thank you for your support over these years. Thank you for these irreplaceable sound masterpieces of the music industry.
OCTO8R
In any consequences, I wish you only the best, Marcus. Please take care of yourself! Thank you for your support over these years. Thank you for these irreplaceable sound masterpieces of the music industry.
OCTO8R
Presets | Midi | Sounds
https://www.kvraudio.com/developer/octo8r
https://www.kvraudio.com/developer/octo8r
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- KVRAF
- 44164 posts since 11 Aug, 2008 from clown world
As a computer salesman who sells computers I have been using Tone2 products for some time to sell computers because they make my computers which are on sale right now look very good and I really appreciate Marcus for making products that help me sell my products (which by the way are on sale).
This is the same method MJ used when he was working on Anthony Marinelli's Thriller.
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- KVRer
- 12 posts since 2 Jun, 2021
Ok, folks…I think I can add something as a user of one of Tone2 synthesizers.
Will try to dot the i's and cross the t's for all of you.
Continuing previous comment, after purchase and figuring out Nemesis deeper I tried to leave some ideas but got a common, already mentioned here answers like “Well, there's a workaround for it…” which were basically reasonable from one point but from another...
…let me explain.
The case is I didn't offer ideas because they were the attack of my caprice between social scrolling and unsatisfied vitriol. I sincerely believed in The Sound of Tone2 (and yes, I still believe in it whatever is waiting all of us, users, further and me personally after this comment). I offered ideas for Nemesis to probably make it more competitive in the industry knowing that these of that features can be managed easier in another synthesizers and consequently seeing the room for upgrade of Nemesis. I’m sure most of you feel the same, this sometimes arising inconvenience to operate with Tone2 synthesizers. That’s basically because of the workflow. I’m not going to say anything of GUI from the point of colors or forms of buttons below, nope. Only the workflow and its critical factor - speed!
QUESTIONS
As a user "mevla" said here:
“I'm sure there are objective, measured, behavioral-studied, ways to analyze GUIs although for most of us it's rather objective and as such we can discuss our perception differences endlessly.”
No!
All the “endlessly discussed perception differences” are shortened down to a simple factor - amount of “thoughts/mouse clicks” user has to do while operating a feature. And that’s it! Such breakthrough gizmos like Serum and then Vital and PhasePlant, and now Current changed fundamentals of industry exactly shortening amount of "thoughts/mouse clicks" down to literally ONE if possible.
I don't have to count leftover lines in the Matrix like I constantly do it in Nemesis actually. I just drag-and-drop! The Matrix “size” doesn’t change from version to version in Nemesis. It had and has only 12 connections. Why???
Analogically, all the predefined connections like LFO2 for Morphing in Oscillators of Icarus2 simply seem strange these days of drag-and-drop functionality. At least there could be a scroll-down menu with an option of modulators by choice of user but there is none. Why???
If there are MSEGs in Icarus2, they are coded and they function, why not turning all the LFOs into MSEGs? Couldn’t Markus implement MSEG into all of the synthesizers to uplift their competitiveness? Yes, He could. Then why not?
Adding more than 2 programmable LFOs into Nemesis or 1 programmable LFO into Warlock (which is actually FireBird but a bit extended in Oscillators and should be way too blind to do not notice this) – why not?
Adding Wavetables manager into Nemesis/Icarus2/Electra/RayBlaster/Gladiator (just not that drop-down menu) – why not?
Mark the spot from which user can drag-and-drop modulator because they are not marked anyhow - why not?
Those and more and more questions are lurking around GUI which are generally about to ruin speed of the workflow, your muse and mostly obscure The Sound of Tone2 on the market unfortunately.
GUESSES OF ANSWERS
IMHO, any ideas about assistance in the art design work, customers support or marketing are away. Except some shade from the past with plugin-callings, nowadays this all is good. It’s definitely not the weak spot here. All questions from above and many more may be divided into two global reasons: Matrix that needs expansion and amount of difficult Modulators like MSEG. Why do Tone2 synthesizers have such a tiny Matrix?! Why does functionality attempt to stick with simple Modulators, small amount of them or stick with predefined ones? Why are there any workarounds at all if sometimes they seem irrational to be?
My own and the only guesses are – an architecture of synthesis or of Tone2 doesn’t allow huge Matrix and more than 3 Effects per Preset. If you doubt, let’s look at several suspicious similarities among synthesizers.
Icarus:
Matrix - 18 lines
Predefined Modulators - 12
Chosen Effects - 3
Electra:
Matrix - 10 lines per every Layer
Predefined Modulators – 2 per every Layer
Chosen Effects – 1 per every Layer (Serious?) and 1 Effect for all Preset
Warlock:
Well, things are sad here. As I said, it’s improved FireBird (which is free actually. And almost every DAW nowadays support x32 plugins format natively) with just a little changes and firmly linear synthesis.
Matrix - none
Chosen Effects – 2
Gladiator:
Matrix - 12 lines
Predefined Modulators – none
Chosen Effects - 2
Nemesis
Matrix - 12 lines (one line is always taken for Pitchwheel. Serious?)
Predefined Modulators - 4
Effects - 2
RayBlaster:
Matrix – 15 lines
Predefined Modulators - 2
Chosen Effects - 2
Notice! I didn’t count Routed Modulators like "Aux Env" in Gladiator that a user can rout with any parameter BECAUSE… it’ll consume the Matrix anyway. So finally we have limited amount of potential lines in the Matrix and some additional Predefined Modulators that are “consuming” the Matrix lines but in so-called “locked” mode, predefined, so you cannot change them but the Modulation occurs here too.
As you can see, everything narrows down to complexity and actually capacity of Modulation Matrix which Tone2 synthesizers cannot stand in large scales.
32 connections in Serum? Nope.
64 connections in Vital? Nope either!
200 connections for every of 4 Layers in F:’em? Never heard!
Maybe it’s the engine of Tone2 and general criterion to maintain crystal-clear Tone2 sound. Maybe I’m just trying to find reasons of obvious facts. But in any possible reason, there’s a solution actually.
Drop-down menu. All the predefined and “locked” modulators could be chosen by the user through the Drop-down menu with no harm for Matrix capacity. It’s not 100% competitive boost, as there still is unanswered question of Effects amount and MSEG as universal Modulator, but it’s real solution that could reinvigorate Tone2 on the market.
AFTERWORD
Even knowing all this, even knowing that I'll probably look like a printing monster with blood on teeth and acid on fingers, I'm happy and definitely proud to be user of Nemesis. The sound of Tone2 is really genius and it’s really competitive. As I said in the beginning, I truly believe in The Sound of Tone2 and I would like Tone2 synthesizers to be able unleash their potential way deeper in creativity and wider among creators.
Will try to dot the i's and cross the t's for all of you.
Continuing previous comment, after purchase and figuring out Nemesis deeper I tried to leave some ideas but got a common, already mentioned here answers like “Well, there's a workaround for it…” which were basically reasonable from one point but from another...
…let me explain.
The case is I didn't offer ideas because they were the attack of my caprice between social scrolling and unsatisfied vitriol. I sincerely believed in The Sound of Tone2 (and yes, I still believe in it whatever is waiting all of us, users, further and me personally after this comment). I offered ideas for Nemesis to probably make it more competitive in the industry knowing that these of that features can be managed easier in another synthesizers and consequently seeing the room for upgrade of Nemesis. I’m sure most of you feel the same, this sometimes arising inconvenience to operate with Tone2 synthesizers. That’s basically because of the workflow. I’m not going to say anything of GUI from the point of colors or forms of buttons below, nope. Only the workflow and its critical factor - speed!
QUESTIONS
As a user "mevla" said here:
“I'm sure there are objective, measured, behavioral-studied, ways to analyze GUIs although for most of us it's rather objective and as such we can discuss our perception differences endlessly.”
No!
All the “endlessly discussed perception differences” are shortened down to a simple factor - amount of “thoughts/mouse clicks” user has to do while operating a feature. And that’s it! Such breakthrough gizmos like Serum and then Vital and PhasePlant, and now Current changed fundamentals of industry exactly shortening amount of "thoughts/mouse clicks" down to literally ONE if possible.
I don't have to count leftover lines in the Matrix like I constantly do it in Nemesis actually. I just drag-and-drop! The Matrix “size” doesn’t change from version to version in Nemesis. It had and has only 12 connections. Why???
Analogically, all the predefined connections like LFO2 for Morphing in Oscillators of Icarus2 simply seem strange these days of drag-and-drop functionality. At least there could be a scroll-down menu with an option of modulators by choice of user but there is none. Why???
If there are MSEGs in Icarus2, they are coded and they function, why not turning all the LFOs into MSEGs? Couldn’t Markus implement MSEG into all of the synthesizers to uplift their competitiveness? Yes, He could. Then why not?
Adding more than 2 programmable LFOs into Nemesis or 1 programmable LFO into Warlock (which is actually FireBird but a bit extended in Oscillators and should be way too blind to do not notice this) – why not?
Adding Wavetables manager into Nemesis/Icarus2/Electra/RayBlaster/Gladiator (just not that drop-down menu) – why not?
Mark the spot from which user can drag-and-drop modulator because they are not marked anyhow - why not?
Those and more and more questions are lurking around GUI which are generally about to ruin speed of the workflow, your muse and mostly obscure The Sound of Tone2 on the market unfortunately.
GUESSES OF ANSWERS
IMHO, any ideas about assistance in the art design work, customers support or marketing are away. Except some shade from the past with plugin-callings, nowadays this all is good. It’s definitely not the weak spot here. All questions from above and many more may be divided into two global reasons: Matrix that needs expansion and amount of difficult Modulators like MSEG. Why do Tone2 synthesizers have such a tiny Matrix?! Why does functionality attempt to stick with simple Modulators, small amount of them or stick with predefined ones? Why are there any workarounds at all if sometimes they seem irrational to be?
My own and the only guesses are – an architecture of synthesis or of Tone2 doesn’t allow huge Matrix and more than 3 Effects per Preset. If you doubt, let’s look at several suspicious similarities among synthesizers.
Icarus:
Matrix - 18 lines
Predefined Modulators - 12
Chosen Effects - 3
Electra:
Matrix - 10 lines per every Layer
Predefined Modulators – 2 per every Layer
Chosen Effects – 1 per every Layer (Serious?) and 1 Effect for all Preset
Warlock:
Well, things are sad here. As I said, it’s improved FireBird (which is free actually. And almost every DAW nowadays support x32 plugins format natively) with just a little changes and firmly linear synthesis.
Matrix - none
Chosen Effects – 2
Gladiator:
Matrix - 12 lines
Predefined Modulators – none
Chosen Effects - 2
Nemesis
Matrix - 12 lines (one line is always taken for Pitchwheel. Serious?)
Predefined Modulators - 4
Effects - 2
RayBlaster:
Matrix – 15 lines
Predefined Modulators - 2
Chosen Effects - 2
Notice! I didn’t count Routed Modulators like "Aux Env" in Gladiator that a user can rout with any parameter BECAUSE… it’ll consume the Matrix anyway. So finally we have limited amount of potential lines in the Matrix and some additional Predefined Modulators that are “consuming” the Matrix lines but in so-called “locked” mode, predefined, so you cannot change them but the Modulation occurs here too.
As you can see, everything narrows down to complexity and actually capacity of Modulation Matrix which Tone2 synthesizers cannot stand in large scales.
32 connections in Serum? Nope.
64 connections in Vital? Nope either!
200 connections for every of 4 Layers in F:’em? Never heard!
Maybe it’s the engine of Tone2 and general criterion to maintain crystal-clear Tone2 sound. Maybe I’m just trying to find reasons of obvious facts. But in any possible reason, there’s a solution actually.
Drop-down menu. All the predefined and “locked” modulators could be chosen by the user through the Drop-down menu with no harm for Matrix capacity. It’s not 100% competitive boost, as there still is unanswered question of Effects amount and MSEG as universal Modulator, but it’s real solution that could reinvigorate Tone2 on the market.
AFTERWORD
Even knowing all this, even knowing that I'll probably look like a printing monster with blood on teeth and acid on fingers, I'm happy and definitely proud to be user of Nemesis. The sound of Tone2 is really genius and it’s really competitive. As I said in the beginning, I truly believe in The Sound of Tone2 and I would like Tone2 synthesizers to be able unleash their potential way deeper in creativity and wider among creators.
Presets | Midi | Sounds
https://www.kvraudio.com/developer/octo8r
https://www.kvraudio.com/developer/octo8r
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- KVRian
- 920 posts since 12 Jan, 2004 from Boston, MA
So long and thanks for all the synths.
*sniff*
(FTR: I own every Tone2 synth except Nemesis, just 'cause I'm not into FM that much. Good stuff.)
*sniff*
(FTR: I own every Tone2 synth except Nemesis, just 'cause I'm not into FM that much. Good stuff.)
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- KVRist
- 385 posts since 15 Jan, 2003
Wow. I like Tone2. With the exception of Warlock, I have purchased all of their VST synths over the years. Solid products. Gladiator is highly underrated, and should have receive more recognition in the market.
Get well Markus!
Get well Markus!
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- KVRAF
- 2818 posts since 30 Aug, 2001 from where dinosaurs are still alive
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- KVRian
- 1082 posts since 13 Oct, 2005 from UK
It's easy to understand Markus. People think they can be as hostile as they want online, and that doesn't impact the people they target.
What you've created will be competitive for years to come, so look after your health. I find the saying "your health is your wealth" to be true, so detach from the stressors, and enjoy the fruits of your labour. Thank you for Icarus !!
What you've created will be competitive for years to come, so look after your health. I find the saying "your health is your wealth" to be true, so detach from the stressors, and enjoy the fruits of your labour. Thank you for Icarus !!
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- KVRist
- 202 posts since 26 Jul, 2023 from France
No, it's much worse: people think they can be as hostile as they like online to make an impact on the people they target.2NDMOUSE wrote: Tue Jan 30, 2024 2:37 pmPeople think they can be as hostile as they want online, and that doesn't impact the people they target.