Levels into Bus?

[bundoo]

Not sure with regards to levels of Drums going into Bus and Bus Comps.
Do you Hi Pass the kick or leave it in?

I'm using The Glue and Softubes Bus Processor

There is more of an issue with layered snares or kicks as the levels obviously go up significantly when combining sounds.

Any tips welcome.

[Laguna_999]

So which problem do you try to solve? Is there anything particular that you do not like with your drumsound? If it sounds fine, most likely there is no need to change anything.

If you layer two snare sounds, you could group them together to a snare bus and than lower the volume of that snare bus so that it has a reasonable level wrt to the other elements in the drums group and in the complete mix.

One way to go at this is to first get the individual levels within one group (snare, kick, ...) right. Then get the levels between the drum groups right. Finally adjust the overall drum level to the rest of the track.

[kritikon]

Usual answer - it depends what result you're after and there are 1000 ways of doing it.

More often than not I don't send the kick into a drum bus with other drums. Especially if I'm compressing to any extent, but that also depends on what compression I'm using. If it's a glue type thing I don't want a universal compressor being over-triggered by the kick. But that also depends on which compressor, e.g. Kotelnikov has a sidechain that can reduce the bass input trigger, so I might glue the whole thing with kick then.

If it's a multiband comp then I'm more likely to send the kick in with other drums. If it's a comp more for character then I really don't have any format rules for a drum bus, I might only send certain drums to the bus and leave out e.g. hats, as most character comps bugger up high frequency and I might want crunchy drums but clean pristine hats.

Same goes for bus fx. I often have a second drum buss specifically to put an insert reverb on the whole kit. That may or may not include the kick (usually not).

As for levels, same thing. Depends on the track. My levels are likely to be radically different for the drum fx bus than for the compression bus. And tbh I don't even always compress a drum buss, it might just be for a global drum volume slider to make mixing easier. So again, levels going into that bus don't really matter.

So, sorry there is no right answer for you. Probably everybody does it differently for different results. There's no right levels and no right way of bussing drums.

[kritikon]

I'll also add that I rarely layer any drums. It smacks of trying to come up with an answer to a problem that didn't really exist in the first place. Yeah, if you layer you're going to have bigger problems with levels...so maybe don't, then you won't have those level problems. I've yet to hear classic tracks recorded with real drums, or even old classic electronic bangers that have impactful drums that I've thought..."yeah they could make that better by having 3 times more drums in it". You can layer whatever you want, and DAWs make it easy to do. Some of the best electronic tracks I've heard over the past 35 years are definitely NOT layered though. And unless you have an octopus playing drums, no real drumkit would do that. It's difficult enough mixing, mastering etc your own stuff - why make it more difficult than it has to be?

[bundoo]

Yes tbh I've just never understood the point - i've always processed drums separately...layers to make new and interesting sounds....just interested in why bus compression is so widely accepted as useful....really just adds another layer of annoying for me...

[_leras]

-18db is a good level to go into buses, allows good gain staging and is also a good level to hit most compressors without clipping etc.

Personally I have a separate group for my Bass Drum so I can more easily mix it with my bass buss.

My other drums usually go into another group. I'm Bitwig you can have multiple local sends so I'll often have a snare drum verb and a separate group room verb in that group. This group can get a parallel channel for some dirt, and usually the final out gets its own compressor, mainly to add a little 'groove' with the release setting.

But generally low like -18 so as to allow good gain staging and not clip.

[_leras]

Yes tbh I've just never understood the point - i've always processed drums separately...layers to make new and interesting sounds....just interested in why bus compression is so widely accepted as useful....really just adds another layer of annoying for me...

Once you have your drums how you like them, almost certainly some bus compression can further help bring them together, glue them and make it all a bit more cohesive. Especially if the compressor has a musical/groovy release component.

[_leras]

I'll also add that I rarely layer any drums. It smacks of trying to come up with an answer to a problem that didn't really exist in the first place. Yeah, if you layer you're going to have bigger problems with levels...so maybe don't, then you won't have those level problems.

Layering can be as simple as doubling your OHH with another sound to get a new character.

Layering electronic and acoustic drum samples can also have great results. You can even chop front from one kick and tail from another to layer two kicks and make new sound.

All of these can be done and even bounced out before mixing, so complicate very little.

If you think layering is playing 5 different high hat patterns, then, yeah sure it can probably get messy. But even this type of thing can produce some creative results.

You don't have to. But lots of people do to great effect.