How to find that last 10-15% 'commercial' sound fully ITB?

[EfreetiSultan]

Do you want new users or do you want an echo chamber? Honest question.

You clearly don't know me, which is understandable.

In my village we give a friendly nod to strangers. I'm also on Twi𝕏. When I read something posted/replied by complete strangers which is not 'liked' by someone else yet which I feel should be liked, I'll put my thumbs-up there as acknowledgment.

Of the dozen or so people you hear echo'ing in this thread, I'm one of the few that responds in good faith some solid advice to posts of new members. I often also quote them, so they get a notification (if their board settings are still at default values.)

Experience has taught me however that a fair share of newbies never come back to the threads they started, and run straight to the Sell&Buy section once they have reached 5 posts. That is a problem on it's own over which I have no control.

What I don't tolerate is fake news, alternative facts, etc. Trouble is though, Poe's law may apply. I do suspect VoodooU was not totally serious when he posted his garbage advice.


Back to topic: a good (increasing) share of commercial music is produced fully in-the-box. That is a fact. No proof required me thinks. If you think otherwise, you have been living under a rock and you may get ridiculed. That's a normal human/social reaction.

Also live music at concerts today is processed with digital mixing consoles, and there's no reason why it shouldn't sound fine. The limiting factor is always the guy at the controls. As said on page 1, first reply:

practice and experience

Good to know. I understand what youre saying. You seem like a great dude, thanks for your reply.

ps. I completely agree proffessional sounding stuff can be produced purely ITB, as Ive mentioned previously I do alot of mastering, and I do go fully ITB. And I think I can create a great sound, since I know my tools in and out aswell as being close to 50 with close to 30 years of experience, Ive a well trained ear and a good set of monitors. Its more than possible! But for the top 100 billboard? Im just very unsure about that.. Usually theres LOTS of money involved, and quite honestly, if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

[VOODOO U]

Well folks, I thank you for the "wonderful" exchange. What I learned from this thread is that my assertion that one cannot produce pro, commercial sounding recordings (that can compete with the majors) entirely ITB is garbage because:

1. I lack the skills
And
2. Ricky Martin did it.

I am totally convinced! Thank you and may god bless.

[elxsound]

Do you want new users or do you want an echo chamber? Honest question.

You clearly don't know me, which is understandable.

In my village we give a friendly nod to strangers. I'm also on Twi𝕏. When I read something posted/replied by complete strangers which is not 'liked' by someone else yet which I feel should be liked, I'll put my thumbs-up there as acknowledgment.

Of the dozen or so people you hear echo'ing in this thread, I'm one of the few that responds in good faith some solid advice to posts of new members. I often also quote them, so they get a notification (if their board settings are still at default values.)

Experience has taught me however that a fair share of newbies never come back to the threads they started, and run straight to the Sell&Buy section once they have reached 5 posts. That is a problem on it's own over which I have no control.

What I don't tolerate is fake news, alternative facts, etc. Trouble is though, Poe's law may apply. I do suspect VoodooU was not totally serious when he posted his garbage advice.


Back to topic: a good (increasing) share of commercial music is produced fully in-the-box. That is a fact. No proof required me thinks. If you think otherwise, you have been living under a rock and you may get ridiculed. That's a normal human/social reaction.

Also live music at concerts today is processed with digital mixing consoles, and there's no reason why it shouldn't sound fine. The limiting factor is always the guy at the controls. As said on page 1, first reply:

practice and experience

Good to know. I understand what youre saying. You seem like a great dude, thanks for your reply.

ps. I completely agree proffessional sounding stuff can be produced purely ITB, as Ive mentioned previously I do alot of mastering, and I do go fully ITB. And I think I can create a great sound, since I know my tools in and out aswell as being close to 50 with close to 30 years of experience, Ive a well trained ear and a good set of monitors. Its more than possible! But for the top 100 billboard? Im just very unsure about that.. Usually theres LOTS of money involved, and quite honestly, if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Seriously take a look at this catalog: https://www.mbrauer.com/discography

Again just last 4 years are ITB

I think the biggest reason is time and ease of use.

I mentioned before that I don’t have much hands on experience with mixing on hardware (never mixed on traditional hardware). I did watch a start to finish all hardware mix where they explain setting up the new mix to match the template/routings. Taping things to the console to then write out each track name or sub group. It was f**king tedious. The guy had his assistant do all the work and flat out said that when his assistant moves on, he’s retiring because it’s too much work.

Most of the hardware was already set at fixed positions and only a knob or two would be adjusted. It was really no different than building your own fx chains for certain things.

On Mixing With The Masters, one of the mixing engineers mentioned how he used the same kick for every track he mixed. It blows everyone away every time.

I sincerely understand the idea of reaching for tools outside for processing but even for the small amount of external hardware I have, it is still tedious to cover in a crunch. I’ll often bypass that if time is an issue, but I do prefer working with it because I enjoy it.

[Jac459]

Do you want new users or do you want an echo chamber? Honest question.

You clearly don't know me, which is understandable.

In my village we give a friendly nod to strangers. I'm also on Twi𝕏. When I read something posted/replied by complete strangers which is not 'liked' by someone else yet which I feel should be liked, I'll put my thumbs-up there as acknowledgment.

Of the dozen or so people you hear echo'ing in this thread, I'm one of the few that responds in good faith some solid advice to posts of new members. I often also quote them, so they get a notification (if their board settings are still at default values.)

Experience has taught me however that a fair share of newbies never come back to the threads they started, and run straight to the Sell&Buy section once they have reached 5 posts. That is a problem on it's own over which I have no control.

What I don't tolerate is fake news, alternative facts, etc. Trouble is though, Poe's law may apply. I do suspect VoodooU was not totally serious when he posted his garbage advice.


Back to topic: a good (increasing) share of commercial music is produced fully in-the-box. That is a fact. No proof required me thinks. If you think otherwise, you have been living under a rock and you may get ridiculed. That's a normal human/social reaction.

Also live music at concerts today is processed with digital mixing consoles, and there's no reason why it shouldn't sound fine. The limiting factor is always the guy at the controls. As said on page 1, first reply:

practice and experience

Good to know. I understand what youre saying. You seem like a great dude, thanks for your reply.

ps. I completely agree proffessional sounding stuff can be produced purely ITB, as Ive mentioned previously I do alot of mastering, and I do go fully ITB. And I think I can create a great sound, since I know my tools in and out aswell as being close to 50 with close to 30 years of experience, Ive a well trained ear and a good set of monitors. Its more than possible! But for the top 100 billboard? Im just very unsure about that.. Usually theres LOTS of money involved, and quite honestly, if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Seriously take a look at this catalog: https://www.mbrauer.com/discography

Again just last 4 years are ITB

I think the biggest reason is time and ease of use.

I mentioned before that I don’t have much hands on experience with mixing on hardware (never mixed on traditional hardware). I did watch a start to finish all hardware mix where they explain setting up the new mix to match the template/routings. Taping things to the console to then write out each track name or sub group. It was f**king tedious. The guy had his assistant do all the work and flat out said that when his assistant moves on, he’s retiring because it’s too much work.

Most of the hardware was already set at fixed positions and only a knob or two would be adjusted. It was really no different than building your own fx chains for certain things.

On Mixing With The Masters, one of the mixing engineers mentioned how he used the same kick for every track he mixed. It blows everyone away every time.

I sincerely understand the idea of reaching for tools outside for processing but even for the small amount of external hardware I have, it is still tedious to cover in a crunch. I’ll often bypass that if time is an issue, but I do prefer working with it because I enjoy it.

I do agree with you and frankly, I believe that it is difficult in 2024 to find excuses in the technology...

[Scotty]

I think what are hoping to find with our continual obsession with technology is inspiration. It can help, perhaps temporally and at some expense. Who isn't motivated to try out something shiny and new? Whether it be in the box or some choice piece of external hardware our curiosity, excitement and engagement is piqued.

I do agree with you and frankly, I believe that it is difficult in 2024 to find excuses in the technology...

[Jac459]

I think what are hoping to find with our continual obsession with technology is inspiration. It can help, perhaps temporally and at some expense. Who isn't motivated to try out something shiny and new? Whether it be in the box or some choice piece of external hardware our curiosity, excitement and engagement is piqued.

I do agree with you and frankly, I believe that it is difficult in 2024 to find excuses in the technology...

I was referring to mixing and mastering technology.

But agreed with your point on creative technology. Hardware is infinitely more sexy and infinitely more cumbersome to use than software. Both are enough imho.

[Scotty]

Understood. I do find creative inspiration in some mixing tools be they hardware or software. Running a bus through tape or tape emulation for example or getting a vocal to sit nicely using Soothe2 or bringing out some buried details using Gullfoss. I suppose they are problem solvers and utilitarian primarily but I do look forward to using them and derive some creative satisfaction in their application.

I think what are hoping to find with our continual obsession with technology is inspiration. It can help, perhaps temporally and at some expense. Who isn't motivated to try out something shiny and new? Whether it be in the box or some choice piece of external hardware our curiosity, excitement and engagement is piqued.

I do agree with you and frankly, I believe that it is difficult in 2024 to find excuses in the technology...

I was referring to mixing and mastering technology.

But agreed with your point on creative technology. Hardware is infinitely more sexy and infinitely more cumbersome to use than software. Both are enough imho.

[Jac459]

Understood. I do find creative inspiration in some mixing tools be they hardware or software. Running a bus through tape or tape emulation for example or getting a vocal to sit nicely using Soothe2 or bringing out some buried details using Gullfoss. I suppose they are problem solvers and utilitarian primarily but I do look forward to using them and derive some creative satisfaction in their application.

I think what are hoping to find with our continual obsession with technology is inspiration. It can help, perhaps temporally and at some expense. Who isn't motivated to try out something shiny and new? Whether it be in the box or some choice piece of external hardware our curiosity, excitement and engagement is piqued.

I do agree with you and frankly, I believe that it is difficult in 2024 to find excuses in the technology...

I was referring to mixing and mastering technology.

But agreed with your point on creative technology. Hardware is infinitely more sexy and infinitely more cumbersome to use than software. Both are enough imho.

100%

[vurt]

Well folks, I thank you for the "wonderful" exchange. What I learned from this thread is that my assertion that one cannot produce pro, commercial sounding recordings (that can compete with the majors) entirely ITB is garbage because:

1. I lack the skills

maybe its confidence in your own abilities, which you lack?
rather than the skills, only you can know.

[vurt]

But for the top 100 billboard? Im just very unsure about that.. Usually theres LOTS of money involved, and quite honestly, if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

indeed, and nothing they like more than saving money!
there are plenty of pro tools studios out there, full digital desk set up (ive worked at one many years ago) with mixing and mastering being done in house.
maybe not billboard top 100 (i believe thats the usa?) but i was involved at the bottom end (i was an assistant engineer, which really meant rolling spliffs and making coffee mostly), of two tracks that entered the top 40 in the uk.

[Uncle E]

if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Which ones?

[donkey tugger]

if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Which ones?

Not bothered about that. I want to know "which ones" in the case of the singles vurt was 'assistant engineer' on.

but i was involved at the bottom end (i was an assistant engineer, which really meant rolling spliffs and making coffee mostly), of two tracks that entered the top 40 in the uk.

[elxsound]

if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Which ones?

Not bothered about that. I want to know "which ones" in the case of the singles vurt was 'assistant engineer' on.

but i was involved at the bottom end (i was an assistant engineer, which really meant rolling spliffs and making coffee mostly), of two tracks that entered the top 40 in the uk.

No matter what the answer is, surely one of them must be this:

[vurt]

if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Which ones?

Not bothered about that. I want to know "which ones" in the case of the singles vurt was 'assistant engineer' on.

but i was involved at the bottom end (i was an assistant engineer, which really meant rolling spliffs and making coffee mostly), of two tracks that entered the top 40 in the uk.

No matter what the answer is, surely one of them must be this:

i was around 8 when that first came out!

[donkey tugger]

if I could afford it, there are certain pieces of gear I would definitely love to have to improve my sound to push it just over that edge.

Which ones?

Not bothered about that. I want to know "which ones" in the case of the singles vurt was 'assistant engineer' on.

but i was involved at the bottom end (i was an assistant engineer, which really meant rolling spliffs and making coffee mostly), of two tracks that entered the top 40 in the uk.

No matter what the answer is, surely one of them must be this:

i was around 8 when that first came out!

Difficult choices back in th'old days. "Eeeh come on lad, time to make tha choice. What's it do be - dahn t'pit or workin' fer Astley?"