HALion 7

[Gam456]

And the Library Manager is inside Halion 7?

The Download Assistant did NOT let me specify where to install.. it's just incredibly dumb and installs it all in the download directory.

Library Manager is an utility, along Download Assistant, e-licenser and activation manager.
Download Assistant allow you to choice the destination in the pref. It must be set up before any download.

You can keep there or move into another location with Library Manager

[bmanic]

And the Library Manager is inside Halion 7?

The Download Assistant did NOT let me specify where to install.. it's just incredibly dumb and installs it all in the download directory.

Library Manager is an utility, along Download Assistant, e-licenser and activation manager.
Download Assistant allow you to choice the destination in the pref. It must be set up before any download.

You can keep there or move into another location with Library Manager

Nope. Maybe you guys use PC and it works differently there but at least on my Mac, with the latest version of Download Assistant, you only can specify a download folder and a "target" folder but that one is also the download folder. It's really really weird and is not at all explained.. and also the instructions on Steinbergs own website list a completely different install experience which doesn't happen.

Whatever.. I got it installed eventually.

Anyhow, first impressions are very mixed in terms of capabilities. For instance the wavetable synth part of Halion 7 is way more limited than I had hoped. Some very obvious modulation destinations are missing. For instance there is no way to modulate the envelope depth for the filter. I have also not found any way to modulate a modulation matrix slot.

This makes the wavetable part of Halion far less capable than Falcon, Serum, Vital and Massive X.

Having said that, I do really like the huge amounts of different filter types and routings. That is really cool and that Waldorf filter actually sounds and behaves like the typical old Waldorf digital filters!! Did they license them directly from Waldorf?

As for workflow in general, it seems pretty convoluted and disjointed, just like Falcon.. but in a very different way. I thoroughly dislike the tiny fonts, buttons and all kinds of micro sized elements of the overall UI. It's way too small for my ageing eyes. This alone is probably a deal breaker for me but I'll explore further.

EDIT: It's also extremely frustrating how some sliders with large ranges requires you to hold a modifier key down to change the values over the full range! It's incredibly clumsy and badly done. It's like the anti-FabFilter approach.. making value tweaking with the mouse as clumsy and bad as possible. It's absolutely incredible that this kind of shit gets through QC or beta testing. What's even worse, it's not at all consistent!!! Some sliders work just fine while others are impossible to use without holding down the modifier key.

One positive is that I've already found some excellent sounds/presets in Halion 7. There seems to be a lot more usable stuff here than in for instance Falcon.

[bmanic]

Yeah, I may have to buy this just for the excellent sounds in many of the various modules. I'm especially impressed by FM Lab and the granular thing. I don't know what it is but somehow to my ears Halion just "sounds different" to a lot of my other options. It's very clean/sterile sounding but not in a bad way at all! It reminds me a lot of typical workstation synth sound aesthetics. A lot of the audio output from HALion is very balanced and exceptionally easy to mix and post process. I also found it hilariously fun to play the General Midi module that is included. There are some real gems in that collection!

It's kind of the complete opposite of something like Omnisphere where a lot of the sounds/samples are very thick and full of resonances that can become a problem within a mix.

Whatever the case with Halion, it's definitely worth the current crossgrade price just for the unique sound output from it in general. Also I still haven't really tried the spectral synth thing. That looks really interesting and useful.

[felis]

....Nope. Maybe you guys use PC....

Yep - pc here. It wasn't obvious at first how it works. I have no clue about mac stuff.

[Liero]

How on earth does a company like Steinberg have such a lame installer/download software? I mean it's even worse than all the competition's software (NI Access, Arturia installer thing, UVI installer thing). Really weird.

I'm seriously thinking of just skipping this product due to such annoying bullshit you have to go through. Doesn't exactly bode confidence in the company and their programming skills.

This. Steinberg has gotten gradually worse for a decade plus with this, to the point that they are now without a doubt the most bloated and messy developer with regard to the myriad of things you need in order for their software to run on your computer. The very opposite of Fabfilter or Reaper, which will just work even without an installer.

They should rename to Bloatberg.

[Liero]

EDIT: It's also extremely frustrating how some sliders with large ranges requires you to hold a modifier key down to change the values over the full range! It's incredibly clumsy and badly done. It's like the anti-FabFilter approach.. making value tweaking with the mouse as clumsy and bad as possible. It's absolutely incredible that this kind of shit gets through QC or beta testing. What's even worse, it's not at all consistent!!! Some sliders work just fine while others are impossible to use without holding down the modifier key.

This would be a total dealbraker for me. At least to me, in the end, workflow is even more important than sound quality. If something sounds great but is always a pain to use, it will end up being superceded (usually quite quickly) by something else and will end up collecting dust on the shelf without you ever getting your money back.

I guess what I'm trying to say is put your money into something better!

[SLiC]

HALion is a frustrating beast. Yup, fiddly and often inconsistent GUI and a programming layout that makes Falcon look simple…ridiculous instal/copy protection and generally uninspiring presets given its complexity…..but….some incredible sound design options (possibly class leading FM) and the reason I bought it….its a sampler that can actually sample! Not many of them about…for the current price an absolute bargain, we can only hope that Steinberg update the copy protection, usability and GUI at some point…

[Liero]

HALion is a frustrating beast. Yup, fiddly and often inconsistent GUI and a programming layout that makes Falcon look simple…ridiculous instal/copy protection and generally uninspiring presets given its complexity…..but….some incredible sound design options (possibly class leading FM) and the reason I bought it….its a sampler that can actually sample! Not many of them about…for the current price an absolute bargain, we can only hope that Steinberg update the copy protection, usability and GUI at some point…

I'd appreciate if you could compare the FM to the Digitone, which you also seem to own? I find the Digitone to be the best sounding FM device on the market, especially with regard to what its Feedback parameter sounds like (very smooth, not harsh). How does Halion compare?

[SLiC]

HALion is a frustrating beast. Yup, fiddly and often inconsistent GUI and a programming layout that makes Falcon look simple…ridiculous instal/copy protection and generally uninspiring presets given its complexity…..but….some incredible sound design options (possibly class leading FM) and the reason I bought it….its a sampler that can actually sample! Not many of them about…for the current price an absolute bargain, we can only hope that Steinberg update the copy protection, usability and GUI at some point…

I'd appreciate if you could compare the FM to the Digitone, which you also seem to own? I find the Digitone to be the best sounding FM device on the market, especially with regard to what its Feedback parameter sounds like (very smooth, not harsh). How does Halion compare?

Yes, I love the digitone for its hardware interface and sequencer, its a great sounding FM box but in reality given its all digital, a software FM synth is going to offer more variation and at least equal 'sound quality' (not just HALion), its more of a software/hardware argument...there are obviously big technical differences such as HALion has 8 operators and Digitone only 4 which is going to make a big difference in program complexity as will the operator configurations (and you can dwsign your own in Halion, so its unlimited), FM LAB also has a more modern environment generally, such as multistage envelopes, better LFOs, far more effects etc...but then software will always win this battle...and Digitone may be more 'immediate' (fun?) due to the limitations...just turn knobs

Yamaha (who obviously own Steinberg) developed the FM Synth and obviously have a bit of a history with FM!...HAL is probably getting you as close as possible (if not identical) to Yamaha FM Synths (DX7, FM-X, TX81Z etc) and for me as an old bloke I like to have that 'sound'', I won't say if that is better or worse than Digitone, its just different!

Ultimately I avoided Halion until they added FM Lab, it was enough for me to dive in even given the often mentioned frustrations- FM LAB , Spectral Synth and a real sampler (that can auto sample software and hardware) are worth the money IMO especially at 50% off.

[Liero]

HALion is a frustrating beast. Yup, fiddly and often inconsistent GUI and a programming layout that makes Falcon look simple…ridiculous instal/copy protection and generally uninspiring presets given its complexity…..but….some incredible sound design options (possibly class leading FM) and the reason I bought it….its a sampler that can actually sample! Not many of them about…for the current price an absolute bargain, we can only hope that Steinberg update the copy protection, usability and GUI at some point…

I'd appreciate if you could compare the FM to the Digitone, which you also seem to own? I find the Digitone to be the best sounding FM device on the market, especially with regard to what its Feedback parameter sounds like (very smooth, not harsh). How does Halion compare?

Yes, I love the digitone for its hardware interface and sequencer, its a great sounding FM box but in reality given its all digital, a software FM synth is going to offer more variation and at least equal 'sound quality' (not just HALion), its more of a software/hardware argument...there are obviously big technical differences such as HALion has 8 operators and Digitone only 4 which is going to make a big difference in program complexity as will the operator configurations (and you can dwsign your own in Halion, so its unlimited), FM LAB also has a more modern environment generally, such as multistage envelopes, better LFOs, far more effects etc...but then software will always win this battle...and Digitone may be more 'immediate' (fun?) due to the limitations...just turn knobs

Yamaha (who obviously own Steinberg) developed the FM Synth and obviously have a bit of a history with FM!...HAL is probably getting you as close as possible (if not identical) to Yamaha FM Synths (DX7, FM-X, TX81Z etc) and for me as an old bloke I like to have that 'sound'', I won't say if that is better or worse than Digitone, its just different!

Ultimately I avoided Halion until they added FM Lab, it was enough for me to dive in even given the often mentioned frustrations- FM LAB , Spectral Synth and a real sampler (that can auto sample software and hardware) are worth the money IMO especially at 50% off.

Thanks for the insight! I'm tempted to check it out and break my own rule, but let's see.

What I'm repeatedly amazed by vis a vis the Digitone is its almost objectively "better" sound quality versus other FM synths, even computer plugins with loads more features. I invite you to create a basic sawtooth patch with Digitone using the feedback knob and compare to basically any other FM-capable synth. It's not subtle at all, the Digitone just sounds so much less shrill, perhaps due to some unique oversampling shenanigans or something... And the more "FM" your sound, ie. the more FM depth you use, the better Digitone fares versus others.

Try it out and compare, you might be surprised!

[SLiC]

Well, the Digitone is a bit of a hybred FM synths, simplified FM and the best of subtractive as well...there is obviously a bit of magic in the code, as unlike say Syntakt there is no analogue in the signal path...so its just (great) code! And yes, sounds amazing, that why I bought it (and more importantly still own it.. many others have been and gone!)

You probably know this but the guy who was heavily involved in the Digitone code makes his own software synths now and they currently have a 30% off sale...OPAL is pretty close to a Digitone in software...but its in MAX so you need Live.

https://fors.fm/opal

[Liero]

Well, the Digitone is a bit of a hybred FM synths, simplified FM and the best of subtractive as well...there is obviously a bit of magic in the code, as unlike say Syntakt there is no analogue in the signal path...so its just (great) code! And yes, sounds amazing, that why I bought it (and more importantly still own it.. many others have been and gone!)

You probably know this but the guy who was heavily involved in the Digitone code makes his own software synths now and they currently have a 30% off sale...OPAL is pretty close to a Digitone in software...but its in MAX so you need Live.

https://fors.fm/opal

Yes, unfortunately all his plugins require either Max for Live or a mac.

[tekknovator]

or instance there is no way to modulate the envelope depth for the filter.

Each modulation has it's own depth and any modulation in the matrix can be affected by any other modulation source. Just use the drop down to choose a source. You can even use buses and determine nonlinear response curves, as well as min max range:

Screenshot 2024-07-06 at 12.05.45.png

This whole download/license/activation thing is not steinbergs strength. The library manager was created to solve user requests for library management and they created the download assistant because people where complaining that downloading huge libraries, or collections such as absolute, could not be paused or downloaded in one go. At some point they cobbled it all together. Fortunately the audio is top notch and this is where it counts imho. But you gotta dance the dance before getting there

[SLiC]

^^^ This
There is very little you cant do with HAlion, it is ridiculously powerful (possibly the most powerful VST ever made) and flexible using layers, zones, busses etc...but its a bugger to learn (as is Falcon) due to the level of customisation and flexibility. The tiny buttons and GUI doesn't help, but if you dig it is one of the most powerful and best sounding VSTs ever created...they have tried to make it more immediate with the new homage and macro based 'instruments' (Like X-STREAM) that are pretty much self contained with bigger/easier GUIs...but if you want to program from scratch you need to watch some of the many excellent YT Videos...probably a few times! Recommend -

[statue]

Is there any other synth that does something similar than that HALions spectral synth thingie?
Really like how you can take a single note synth sample and re-synthesize it like that...