KORG Collection 5 with ARP 2600 Emulation coming Summer 2024

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IvyBirds wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2024 2:24 pmIronic coming from you
How so? I don't care which synths I use, as long as the result sounds good. I don't see a part and think that it has to be a specific synth. I might think a certain synth will be less work than another but that's about as far as it ever goes. It's exactly like choosing the right spanner (wrench) to get to a nut in a tight space in an engine bay. Like a mechanic's toolbox, you have your favourite tools that you'll always pick up first - I love my ratchet ring-spanners - but when they don't look like getting the job done, you'll look elsewhere.

If I only had one synth to use, though, I'm sure I could still produce NOVAkILL songs, because what makes it a NOVAkILL song is not bound to the instruments we've used on it. In fact, the old songs we still play live have probably been through 3 or 4 total rebuilds - when we moved from hardware to software, when we moved from 32 bit to 64 bit Orion, when we moved from Orion to Cubase and again when I moved from Cubase to Studio One - where every instrument has been changed out for something else, yet they still sound like us. How could they not?
_leras wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2024 7:52 pmThe point was the range of tonality of the sounds. From a light poppy clean sound to the dirty resonant.
Then it was the wrong counterpoint to what I'd been saying. And I didn't like any of the synth sounds on either of those songs. The second one sounds like an exercise in making synths sound horrible, something I've never had any trouble doing, since I bought my first one in 1981. It's much harder to make them sound good.
That Ultravox has a more punk edge to the song, but... the synth sounds like jean michel jarre. It's not a punky, or new wave, synth sound.
Which synth? It's all synth, except the drums, but Billy Currie's Odyssey solo is very definitely not like anything Jarre would ever have even thought to do. This one is even moreso, although the song itself is not at all Punk -

NOVAkILL : Legion GO, AMD Z1x, 16GB RAM, Win11 | Audient EVO 8 | Lumi Keys | Studio Pro 8
Korg Odyssey, bx-oberhausen, Proxima, PolyMax, GR8, JP6K, Union, Atomika,
Invader 2, Flow Motion, Olga, TRK 01, Thorn, Spire, VG Iron

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http://www.guyrowland.co.uk
http://www.sound-on-screen.com
W11, Ryzen 7900, 64gb RAM, RME Babyface, 1050ti, PT 2024 Ultimate, Cubase Pro 14
Macbook Air M2 OSX 10.15

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This is all the Korg emulation I need plus change - free too!
https://www.fullbucket.de/music/vst.html

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Sound Author wrote: Thu Aug 01, 2024 8:18 pm
IvyBirds wrote: Wed Jul 31, 2024 3:22 pm
HunterKiller wrote: Wed Jul 31, 2024 3:12 pm That's a shame. Too bad it's not the next Repro.
Many people disagree with that hypothesis

It sounds very much like a hardware 2600 which doesn't sound like a Prophet 5, a Minimoog, or a CS80

The 2600 has a unique ability to both sit well in a mix and still be felt and heard

It's why it's featured on so many progressive rock records from the 1970s

People expecting an authentic sounding 2600 plugin to be some massive thick phat analog beast that is up in your face will be left disappointed
It's difficult for me to articulate what I love about the sound of the 2600. "Pure" is the word that springs to mind. The bass frequencies are beautifully crystal clear. Of all the classic synths, I think it has the most unabashedly ELECTRONIC character, and stability that is unmatched by the synths of that era. Sequences and arpeggios slice through mixes in a very distinct way. It just has a special sound that is unlike anything else. If you want "phatness", obviously you can reach for a Moog or something like that. But if you want to get lost in space, then yeah, that's what the 2600 does for me, and I think Korg has nailed that sound, both in hardware and software.
How about releasing a 2600 sound bank…?

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sovietpop wrote: Thu Aug 01, 2024 1:12 pm Maybe the hardware is a little warmer, alive ? Thats the impression i have with Uhe Pro 5 emu too and other emulation as well but it could be in my head.
I don't think it's just in your head. "Alive" is a very good word to use as a description.

Thing is, not everybody rates minute details or small variances as important at all. Some people only hear what I like to call the "macro" sound. For instance, they can hear two nearly identical filter sweeps and they only hear the sweep itself, the length of the sweep and the basic envelope shape and basic tonality in general ("it gets darker" or "it gets thinner"). That would be the "macro" sound. The biggest part of the sound created, the "sound preset" itself.

It's like a banana is just a banana for many people, even if the brand or time of picking or ripeness is different. They only taste and care about the "macro/the big picture" of it. Thus a banana is a banana. An apple is an apple.. etc

Whereas some people can get absorbed in minute details of things. This too is of course a very slippery slope and very often gets further muddled by the placebo effect, which is VERY real and very powerful (underrated trait of humans!). Still, there is such a thing as nuance and it does matter for many people. It's most prominent for me personally when I'm actually playing a synth, when it's not within the context of a mix or a whole composition.. but rather just noodling around with it and testing it out, exploring the sweet spots. Some things just sound good to my ears whereas some things sound a bit flat and boring and some sound downright offensive. These are of course 100% subjective things and thus will vary greatly from one person to another.

To my ears the Korg ARP 2600 emulation sounds a bit flat and quite sterile (and yes, I have played with the voices panel, I've routed things through the preamp, through the SEM filter etc). Whatever it is, it doesn't represent what I heard on the hardware.. in terms of small nuances and thus it isn't as pleasurable to play and experiment with as the hardware was. Even the Behringer clone was more engaging sounding to my ears, though that one I felt didn't quite do the original justice either. It was a bit off somehow.. the Behringer is more beefy and probably hits the various circuits a bit harder than the original (or then there's just way more saturation everywhere).

Mind you, not all analogue synths trigger my pleasure centers either. Some I just don't like. For instance I have never really liked the Prophet 5 (any revision of it). I also don't care much for the sound output of the Moog Grandmother nor the Moog Matriarch. I also never really liked the Moog Voyager.. whereas the original Minimoog (I think this one was of the last batch, so late 70s or early 80s) that I had the fortune of using back in the late 90's and early 00's sounded absolutely wonderful!

@IvyBirds

.. the point is, we all hear things differently. I know what you are trying to say but maybe perhaps just accept the fact that some people hear things differently and value things differently? I'm sure the Korg Arp2600 will do just fine in terms of sales. It's already by far the most authentic emulation of this beast ever done in digital. That is 100% clear. It doesn't need defending.
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot

"They don't ban hate speech; they ban speech they hate." -an oracle

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I almost pulled the trigger on buying this upgrade last night. The EP-1 being the favorite of the three latest, Vox being second, and the 2600 being a nice rounding out. I had passed on the previous offer, because the plugins in that offer felt useless for me (and still do).
Anyway, I was prompted to update these demos and the way the manager is now downloading/installing/deleting had me concerned as it won't let me save those downloads for installing on my offline computer. Is there a way to do this? Or is this the only way going forward? If so, I'll be forced to be done with Korg...

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bmanic wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:55 pm Mind you, not all analogue synths trigger my pleasure centers either. Some I just don't like. For instance I have never really liked the Prophet 5 (any revision of it). I also don't care much for the sound output of the...Moog Matriarch.
Oh boy do the Prophet Rev 4 and Matriarch trigger my analog pleasure centers. I've got the former and a good friend owns the latter and I've spent a lot of time with it. Still mean to pick one up some day just don't have room for it!

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I totally understand how people love those! They have a very distinct and unique character (which is much more important for an instrument than to sound "same as everything else"). AFAIK the Moog Voyager is also dearly beloved by a lot of people. To me it just sounds rather "hard" somehow. Have had numerous occasions to buy one at a really attractive price but I just didn't like it enough to justify the cost.

So yeah, naturally we all have different preferences. For instance, I'm one of those weirdos that really REALLY like the sound of the Behringer Deepmind. Like truly like it.. I wouldn't part with it for almost any amount of cash. Heck, I'm probably buying 2 or 3 more of them over the coming years just to have it available in my arsenal as I don't know how robust they are over time (they are Behringer so it's a crap shoot!).

I also really like the actual sound output of the Elekron Analogue Four, mk1 specifically! To my ears it just sounds quite a bit better than the mk2 version. Not sure if it's the worse AD/DA conversion or some other components but it just sounds more pleasant to my ears than the mk2. It's quite subtle but the differences are there.

And I was one of those who really liked the Alesis Andromeda back in the day when they were brand new. At least here in Finland, it didn't have a good reputation. Most people I spoke to thought it sounded rather sterile and thin.. which I can sort of understand and sympathize with but the sweet spot for that synth wasn't with the "normal" sounds. I'm still kicking myself for never actually purchasing one of my own when they were going for peanuts (like 1200 euros b-stock straight from the store!).

Of the unobtainable classics I suspect I'd really love playing a Yamaha CS-80. It's got something truly fascinating in it's tonality. Sort of nasal but not in an annoying way. It just tickles my senses.. a bit similar to how the TB-303 always tickled that "somewhat nasal" but in a peculiar and attractive way. Unfortunately I've never been able to lay my hands on one of those. Have played the CS-60 though but I don't know how close in sound it is to the bigger brother.
"Wisdom is wisdom, regardless of the idiot who said it." -an idiot

"They don't ban hate speech; they ban speech they hate." -an oracle

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BBFG# wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 5:33 pm Anyway, I was prompted to update these demos and the way the manager is now downloading/installing/deleting had me concerned as it won't let me save those downloads for installing on my offline computer. Is there a way to do this?
Yes, there are individual download links for the plugins you purchased:
https://id.korg.com/users/products
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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I really hate fine tuning of knob values in pretty much every soft synth...except for u-he synths, which absolutely nail fine tuning with the mouse wheel. This plugin has the same insanity-inducing fine tuning that sticks and never lands on the values you want, constantly undershooting or overshooting your target value. It's been this way for years and it's so frustrating, especially when you're just trying to dial in semitones for the VCO frequency. Yeah, you can press shift and get octaves but there's no quantizing for simple semitones.

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LuizAtKorg wrote: Mon Aug 05, 2024 3:42 am
BBFG# wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 5:33 pm Anyway, I was prompted to update these demos and the way the manager is now downloading/installing/deleting had me concerned as it won't let me save those downloads for installing on my offline computer. Is there a way to do this?
Yes, there are individual download links for the plugins you purchased:
https://id.korg.com/users/products
These I know, but there's no equivalent for the demos to move to the offline computer. Which is a major part of my process in demoing.

Another question I have is since I have an offer code for discount which of course isn't valid during the sale anyway, if that brings it to the same price after the sale?

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BBFG# wrote: Mon Aug 05, 2024 4:56 am 1 - These I know, but there's no equivalent for the demos to move to the offline computer. Which is a major part of my process in demoing.

2 - Another question I have is since I have an offer code for discount which of course isn't valid during the sale anyway, if that brings it to the same price after the sale?
1 - I don't know if I got your message right, but there is no "demo installer". There is only the full installer and the plugin will be in demo mode if it is not authorized by KSP.
But yes, if you haven't purchased the plugins you will not have access to the links at the KORG ID webpage.
If you want I can send you the links in PM, just let me know if you want MAC or WIN.

2 - Not sure about that, you may want to ask at the support channel:
https://support.korguser.net/hc/en-us/requests/new

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bmanic wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:55 pm
sovietpop wrote: Thu Aug 01, 2024 1:12 pm with the voices panel, I've routed things through the preamp, through the SEM filter etc). Whatever it is, it doesn't represent what I heard on the hardware.. in terms of small nuances and thus it isn't as pleasurable to play and experiment with as the hardware was. Even the Behringer clone was more engaging sounding to my ears, though that one I felt didn't quite do the original justice either. It was a bit off somehow.. the Behringer is more beefy and probably hits the various circuits a bit harder than the original (or then there's just way more saturation everywhere).
That's hilarious! As I was reading your rant about subtlety, I was thinking how apt is was in the case of Korg's 2600. It's entire appeal is those little details that are lost in a mix but readily apparent when you are using it on its own. Then you go and ruin it all by proving you have ears of cloth! Very disappointing.
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Something I've discovered in trying to fit the 2600 into a few songs is that some of the factory sounds have patch cords that don't do anything. A lead patch I was working on today had about 10-12 patch cords but I was able to remove 5 of them without it having any effect on the sound. They were going to outputs that didn't have an input or to parts of the synth that weren't in the signal path at all. That's very sloppy work in my book. I thought maybe they were being used to pump the output level up or something but not even that.

I've actually surprised myself how easily I have got my head around this thing. I think it kind of forces you to work in a more deliberate way, which I am fine with, and that helps you come to grips with it quickly. It's not exactly easy, and it takes a bit of time, but it's definitely worth the effort. I'm really diggin' it at the moment.
NOVAkILL : Legion GO, AMD Z1x, 16GB RAM, Win11 | Audient EVO 8 | Lumi Keys | Studio Pro 8
Korg Odyssey, bx-oberhausen, Proxima, PolyMax, GR8, JP6K, Union, Atomika,
Invader 2, Flow Motion, Olga, TRK 01, Thorn, Spire, VG Iron

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Sound Author wrote: Mon Aug 05, 2024 3:57 am I really hate fine tuning of knob values in pretty much every soft synth...except for u-he synths, which absolutely nail fine tuning with the mouse wheel. This plugin has the same insanity-inducing fine tuning that sticks and never lands on the values you want, constantly undershooting or overshooting your target value. It's been this way for years and it's so frustrating, especially when you're just trying to dial in semitones for the VCO frequency. Yeah, you can press shift and get octaves but there's no quantizing for simple semitones.
In case you don't already know...

1. Focus the Initial OSC frequency parameter
2. On the "Parameter Info" section in the top right, type in the semi-tone you want, e.g. -24
3. Press Enter

Works for all params.

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I love the param info section - all plugins should have one

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