SWAY - a synth modeled after the Yamaha SY77

[Caesarg86]

Yes sir!

[Aloysius]

I can boogie

Oops ... wrong thread.

[masterhiggins]

Looks great. Watching this.

[sheaf]

The past few weeks I've been getting a lot of emails asking about the project, so I thought I'd give a little update on my progress here.

I'm currently finishing up the effect section. That was a huge amount of work so I'm going to be glad when I can call it done. Overall I'm really satisfied with how the effects turned out. I do want to be honest and admit the reverbs are not as accurate as I hoped I could get them. I ultimately had to increase the echo density a bit to make them sound smoother than the SY77. I did this because I couldn't reproduce the metallic sounding resonances at the exact same frequencies (which in hindsight was a bit naive to think I could do so in the first place). I found that a reverb that has no obvious resonances sounds on average more accurate than one that has a similar number of resonances as the original but in the wrong places. As long as the other characteristics such as the early reflections, echo buildup over time, damping, etc match at least. If that makes sense?

After finishing the effects I have one major issue to tackle, and then a couple of dozen smaller issues. The big one is the filter module that needs to be revised. The envelopes are not accurate enough in the current implementation, and there is a problem when engaging both filters. I had assumed for a long time that filter 1 & 2 just run serially, but unfortunately that's not what's happening in the SY77. When both filters are active weird things start happening when the cutoff frequencies get close to each other. Hopefully I can make some sense of it when I do a deep dive into it.

The smaller issues are mostly some bug fixes, and some detective work on patches that still sound inaccurate wrt the hardware. When those issues are tackled I'll be able to send out a build to the beta testers. While they are testing I'll be finishing up the samples that ship with the synth.

I don't really want to put time estimates on these remaining tasks, because I just don't know how long it will take. Rest assured I'm working hard on it every chance I get. Hopefully it will be worth the wait.

[seangm]

I can boogie

Oops ... wrong thread.

I'm sorry but I'm going to need to see video evidence of this.

[frag]

Actually, perhaps it doesn't have to be that accurate, it "just" has to be an interesting instrument with lots of character. SY77 appears to be that. Some plugins claim to be very accurate emulations (even oscilloscopes show this) but they're not interesting to play...

[Aloysius]

I can boogie

Oops ... wrong thread.

I'm sorry but I'm going to need to see video evidence of this.

[IvyBirds]

I'm currently finishing up the effect section. That was a huge amount of work so I'm going to be glad when I can call it done. Overall I'm really satisfied with how the effects turned out.

Can I ask, beg even, on my knees saying pretty pretty please that you release the effects section as a separate plugin. Even if it's not 100% accurate it would still be massively cool to have a plugin like that

[cslevine]

So happy to see some news from you, Sheaf !

Would be happy to be part of beta testing
loading my sys.ex patches, play, and listen.

[cslevine]

Actually, perhaps it doesn't have to be that accurate, it "just" has to be an interesting instrument with lots of character. SY77 appears to be that. Some plugins claim to be very accurate emulations (even oscilloscopes show this) but they're not interesting to play...

there are much plugins wih FM and 6 op with lots of "SY77 characters, for example some modules of REAKTOR, or lots of new VSTi can be adressed with FM and samples... But that we want is to load sys.ex and have the original SY/TG77 patched forever and ever, so it has to be 1:1 accurate for main patches.
Effects is not so mandatory, the sounds characers is made from exacts algorythms and we often bypass internal synth FX for some much better external reverbs. Maybe the flanger is used on some patches and make some coloration, but the main thing, for Sheaf, is working on filters. ( maybe parallel )
( the patch "Frights" may be interesting for working on filter ? )

[frag]

Actually, perhaps it doesn't have to be that accurate, it "just" has to be an interesting instrument with lots of character. SY77 appears to be that. Some plugins claim to be very accurate emulations (even oscilloscopes show this) but they're not interesting to play...

there are much plugins wih FM and 6 op with lots of "SY77 characters, for example some modules of REAKTOR, or lots of new VSTi can be adressed with FM and samples... But that we want is to load sys.ex and have the original SY/TG77 patched forever and ever, so it has to be 1:1 accurate for main patches.
Effects is not so mandatory, the sounds characers is made from exacts algorythms and we often bypass internal synth FX for some much better external reverbs. Maybe the flanger is used on some patches and make some coloration, but the main thing, for Sheaf, is working on filters. ( maybe parallel )
( the patch "Frights" may be interesting for working on filter ? )

Sure, we all want that, but I don't think it's possible to create 1:1 emulation by ear... If you have DSP code, like Virus TI, Nord Lead etc, then it's possible. SWAY may load TG77 sysex but I don't think it can be 100% accurate. We have Dexed which loads DX7 sysex, but doesn't sound exactly the same.

[gentleclockdivider]

Actually, perhaps it doesn't have to be that accurate, it "just" has to be an interesting instrument with lots of character. SY77 appears to be that. Some plugins claim to be very accurate emulations (even oscilloscopes show this) but they're not interesting to play...

there are much plugins wih FM and 6 op with lots of "SY77 characters, for example some modules of REAKTOR, or lots of new VSTi can be adressed with FM and samples... But that we want is to load sys.ex and have the original SY/TG77 patched forever and ever, so it has to be 1:1 accurate for main patches.
Effects is not so mandatory, the sounds characers is made from exacts algorythms and we often bypass internal synth FX for some much better external reverbs. Maybe the flanger is used on some patches and make some coloration, but the main thing, for Sheaf, is working on filters. ( maybe parallel )
( the patch "Frights" may be interesting for working on filter ? )

Sure, we all want that, but I don't think it's possible to create 1:1 emulation by ear... If you have DSP code, like Virus TI, Nord Lead etc, then it's possible. SWAY may load TG77 sysex but I don't think it can be 100% accurate. We have Dexed which loads DX7 sysex, but doesn't sound exactly the same.

Dexed is in some cases really off because it doesn't account for the maximum carrier output gain which is defined by the algoritms .
An algoritm that has many carriers will have a lower output gain per carrier versus an algoritm that has fewer carriers (example 1/4=0.25 versus 1/2=0.5)
This does NOT affect the fm modulation index , it does affect the overall loudness of a patch
That being said , I've loaded sysex in both dexed and ops7 and the differences were really subtle
Dexed is amazing for freeware

[cslevine]

Very interesting. OK so that global level should be maybe reduced. But no way a problem because of digital and 64 bit, the signal/noise will not be affected even by /4 global volume level reduction.

[EvilDragon]

I ultimately had to increase the echo density a bit to make them sound smoother than the SY77. I did this because I couldn't reproduce the metallic sounding resonances at the exact same frequencies (which in hindsight was a bit naive to think I could do so in the first place).

Sorry if I'm going to add some fuel to the fire just now...

IIRC one can load custom samples to a SY77 via that WaveBlade card? Maybe (if you have one) you could add a single full-scale sample (impulse) and test the reverb like that, with filters bypassed, one single operator going, and hoping that the amp envelope can actually be fully flat (instantaneous attack) in order to not eat the impulse... This way you could examine the early reflection delay patterns and stuff...

[gentleclockdivider]

Great Idea , now someone buy Sheaf a Waveblade